Why Muzzleloading...?

[Andy54Hawken]

Flintlocks are ok in the rain, it's the matchlocks that present problems.

I don't have a matchlock .... yet...
I do have a wheellock pistol and the spanner wrench to make it work...just need to post a picture of it...
Andy

 

[titsonritz]

So Andy,

About how much does it cost to play this game? I am talking a non-replica, but non-museum worthy of shooting and basic possibles.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Depends on :
Flintlock or caplock...flintlocks are as a general rule more expensive...
Grade of wood , lock , experience and skill of the maker...
New or used...
Styling of the gun...
Rifled or smooth bore....

A good custom Longrifle with a well made and tuned lock ...generally starts around $1000 depending on what I said above...
A good custom percussion gun can be had for around $700 and up...again depending on what I said above.

Most leather off the shelf bags run around $50.00 and up...

Gear is best bought after doing your homework on makers and what to look for.

Now with all that said...
You can get stuff cheaper..if you wait , go to black powder shows and to be honest...
Many folks who have all this cool gear are now in their 70's and 80's and are getting out of the game...you may be able to buy someone out .
last rendezvous a guy had a gorgeous Northwest Tradegun in Flint for $800...if I had the cash it would have been mine....that was a good buy.

All of the above is for a ready made custom outfit....
Off the shelf is just fine and with a little bit of work , can easily rival custom in appearance and performance.

Sometimes a good shootable antique can be found , cheaper than a new gun
2 years ago , I found a antique percussion longrifle for $100.
I took it apart...checked it all out..."proofed" it , assembled it , cleaned it up just a tad , and gifted it to a good friend , who wanted an original to shoot.
My original St. Louis rifle in .50 caliber was $700....And it shoots very nicely.
You can't buy a replica "Mountain rifle" new , at that price...or at least one that looks like a original Mountain or plains rifle....

A Lyman Great plains rifle is a great start...they can be found in $400-$600 range
Older T/C "Hawken rifles" are excellent as well....no longer made but also found in the $300-$500 range
Both of the above are not quite historic in how they look...but again that can be easily fixed.

Many outfits make a Civil War rifled musket and those make dandy shooters and fine hunters as well.
Used these can be found in the $300-$700 range. ( used )
Andy

 

[titsonritz]

Thanks for the primer. I'm in no hurry so I have plenty time to study up.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

You are very welcome....glad to have been of some help.
Andy

 

[WoodsPlinker]

Wow... Thank you for sharing...

I'm new to black powder, for me the attraction was:

A) it kept me out doors for longer (all those long reloads)
B) the smoke was cool
C) history
D) it's relaxing

Most of the reason why I shoot is it's a calming sport, very relaxing... I find black powder amplifies that relaxation and fills a void left open by my inability to easily do long distance shooting anymore. I probably should do some "drills" or something to improve my skill level under pressure but, it's hard to do when my main attraction to the sport was because I wanted the opposite.

It's funny I used to go to the range and see all the old timers shooting black powder and think they were crazy for spending so long loading the thing up just for one shot... Now it's what makes it so appealing to me. I guess I just wasn't mature enough yet.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

I probably should do some "drills"

Not really a "drill"...but a good thing to learn is how to shoot from the bag....
No boxes of gear or range rods , or a big bag crammed full of "stuff"...
You do not need a ton of gear to shoot...
Powder , patch , ball...
Powder measure...
Extra flints or caps...
A turnscrew...
Vent pick or Nipple wrench...
A good ramrod...use short strokes and hold near the muzzle...
Maybe a short starter...
If hunting some sort of lube... I use bear grease , deer tallow , mink oil , crisco
Below are two bag set ups...
Andy

 

[Argonaut]

I haven't read the thread............but to me, muzzle loading is the purest form of shooting. They have always been as powerful and accurate as metallic cartridge guns and many exhibit more science than there breech loading brethren. I knew a world champion Black powder shooter when I lived in Germany. He only shot orignal guns and they were incredible. His best target rifles dated from the 1870's and were cased with false muzzles, custom bullet molds designed specifically for that rifle after load development at the factory, an assortment of sights, stocks and forearm grips and powder measures. The intricacy and precision were breath taking. Many were English but he also had German and American guns. The other interesting thing is the hunter success percentage is higher during black powder season than any other type weapon season. I was told that by a local game warden and mentioned it here some time ago. I didn't realize how much higher it was.......like 5 or 10 times more likely to fill your tags during the black powder season. I like hunting later in the fall in cool weather when the black powder season is better too.

 

[CountryGent]

I have seen Flintlock trade guns dated into the 1880's and my Flintlock fowler dates to around 1900...well into the cartridge gun era.

I never done a deep research on the topic, but it seems to me the flintlock, and other muzzleloaders, lingered on much longer in some parts of the world than these United States. I vaguely recall seeing a Spanish Miquelet (which I think is a snaplock using flint) dated from around 1870. And I've seen footage Afghans packing Jezails when the Soviets rumbled into that country in the 1970s.

I do have a wheellock pistol and the spanner wrench to make it work...just need to post a picture of it...

That sounds extremely neat-o.

Very cool thread in general, I might add.

 

[Argonaut]

We have had metallic breechloaders for 140 years or so........muzzle loaders (of one sort or another) have been around maby 1500 years?

 

[Bon Sauvage]

Not that long ago but a pretty long time: 12 century China.

 

[Argonaut]

Not that long ago but a pretty long time: 12 century China.

My book says the 9th century.

 

[CountryGent]

Not that long ago but a pretty long time: 12 century China.

Kicking it old school. And by that, I mean really old, circa 1350 in China. From a treatise on the topic of things that go "pew".

 

[KKG]

In 1970 the 1st Cav. Div. went into Cambodia and found what was called "Rock Island East" at the bottom end of the Ho Chi Minh Trail. Several muzzleloaders were brought out including a matchlock. All of them were hand made and all were functional.

 

[Ura-Ki]

We came across many B.P. arms in the sand box, many had been passed down through the generations and were much treasured and fully functional arms to be feared! Sadly, many were taken and deposed of!

 

[CountryGent]

In 1970 the 1st Cav. Div. went into Cambodia and found what was called "Rock Island East" at the bottom end of the Ho Chi Minh Trail. Several muzzleloaders were brought out including a matchlock. All of them were hand made and all were functional.

This reminds me of a photograph I recently saw in a book of which I am reading. It is entitled The Thompson Submachine Gun. The gentleman on the left appears to fancy the classics, in a manner of speaking.

 

[KKG]

The ones I mentioned became part of a Museum that the Division Small Arms Inspector had assembled. Supposedly that Museum came back to the States but that hasn't been confirmed.

 

[Argonaut]

This is my ultimate fantasy gun. It dates from the mid 1600's. The barrel is Damascus most likely captured at the Battle of Vienna in the 1680's from the Ottoman's (Muslims) and refit in Nuremberg Germany into the matchlock we see here. It is unbelievably adorned with gold and ivory inlays of intricate scenes. I have seen similar guns in European museums and find them breathtaking. This is one of the few to ever come for sale outside of a museum........60,000 OBO. The photo does not do it any justice. It is available at Collector's firearms with better photos.

 

[edslhead]

Caps often won't work if ...
You don't "bust a cap or three " before loading your rifle.
If you bust a cap it will blow out any oil or leftover debris from the last cleaning and clear the ignition vent to the main charge.
Do this only with a un-loaded gun...or the result will be very different....
Andy

Dang. I should have wrote that down. Now Ive got this at home and its plugged up. How loud is a cap gonna be in my back yard? After cleaning out as best I could you can barely draw air through it. Was fun shootin! Lots a smoke

 

[KKG]

Dang. I should have wrote that down. Now Ive got this at home and its plugged up. How loud is a cap gonna be in my back yard? After cleaning out as best I could you can barely draw air through it. Was fun shootin! Lots a smoke

Do you think you have a charge in the barrel?