Why Chamber Empty Carry Is Dumb

[bbbass]

You all are missing a YUGE advantage of empty-chamber carry. Once you've got the drop on the bad guy, and you really want to emphasize the danger he's in, that's when you rack the slide. It makes a super scary noise that gets your point across. I learned this from Hollywood; they do it all the time in the movies.

Usually they do it 3 or 4 times, so as to REALLY make an impression!!!

 

[bbbass]

<<<———- Revolver. ALWAYS ready to go Bang.

Not necessarily.

I constantly read in books that the operator has to push the safety to off on his revolver.

 

[WillametteWill]

Cond. 3 (empty chamber)
Takes both hands to deploy your piece.
Takes longer to get off the 1st round.
Introduces one more possible cause for malfunction.
If taking the safety off is a problem, what is racking a round in a situation of existential peril?
Puts you going into the fight a round down before you even start shooting.

Saint John Moses actually intended his masterpiece to be carried in Cond. 0 (cocked and unlocked) with the grip safety being adequate to prevent unintended discharge. That was before the Legal Industry took over the world.

Good post!

Although I completely agree with your post, you know what I find to be an extremely high level of Alanis Morissette "Ironic" 100 years later? The cool kids guns are SF with no form of manual or even passive (e.g., grip safety), often with triggers lighter than 1911's because they shoot better with light triggers.

My usual disclaimer, everyone carry as they desire and I'll support your right, I just wish gun counters would have a little bit more intellectual honesty with brand new shooters. I hate to say it, but this will eventually be the lawsuit that sinks a large gun company.

 

[po18guy]

For your consideration: the many times a CC person had a gun pointed at him, but waited for the BG to look away, or even better, to turn away, then stealthily or quickly made his draw and got shots on the perp(s).

Most robbers are not killers, therefore, compliance most often buys you time, and time buys you options.

The big guard in this vid that was messing with the money bag had the perp dead when the perp looked away (to shoot the other guard), but his gun wasn't chambered.... suck time.




Ummm hmmm.

Indeed.

 

[ma96782]

Yeah.....why not?

Carry your revolver......with the first chamber (the ready to go one) EMPTY.

You know.....
It's for the SAFETY of the Perp. Just in case, you could/might be able to convince them to reconsider the course of their action(s).

Aloha, Mark

PS.....BECAREFUL who you mention this to. The Dems might just pass a LAW.

The Standard Disclaimer Applies.

 

[bbbass]

PS.....BECAREFUL who you mention this to. The Dems might just pass a LAW.

I see our Sec of Transportation, Mr. Buddypeg, is going to pass a law against traffic fatalities in order to reach zero... why didn't we think of that before???

 

[osprey]

If you are gonna carry with an empty chamber make it a full sized 1911 or better yet a desert eagle. Mass is your friend when you have to throw it or use it as a bludgeon.

 

[ma96782]

LOL.....



The S&W solution?

Aloha, Mark

 

[revjen45]

"I constantly read in books that the operator has to push the safety to off on his revolver."

Must be a lot of Webley-Fosberrys in literature.

 

[orygun]

Cond. 3 (empty chamber)
Takes both hands to deploy your piece.
Takes longer to get off the 1st round.
Introduces one more possible cause for malfunction.
If taking the safety off is a problem, what is racking a round in a situation of existential peril?
Puts you going into the fight a round down before you even start shooting.

Saint John Moses actually intended his masterpiece to be carried in Cond. 0 (cocked and unlocked) with the grip safety being adequate to prevent unintended discharge. That was before the Legal Industry took over the world.

It was the Army that wanted the thumb safety, not the lawyers.

 

[Nosferatu]

I'm starting a new trend...

Empty magazine carry.

Practice that, you masochists!

 

[solv3nt]

I'm starting a new trend...

Empty magazine carry.

Practice that, you masochists!

If you live in Multnomah county of Portland, and don't have a carry permit, you're only allowed to carry loose rounds with your magazine. I'm glad to see the gang bangers follow the law.

 

[revjen45]

"It was the Army that wanted the thumb safety, not the lawyers."

Given that it was supposed to be a cavalry pistol, not a bad idea. Relying on the grip safety in a cavalry charge could be problematic.
My point being that every last vestige of common sense in THE LAW had not yet been obliterated by judicial fiat.

 

[Burpboxhero]

One in pipe or not, your choice. Don't need two hands to chamber it. Shoot how you train.

 

[03A3Sporter]

Unless the individual in question is well versed in Israeli Carry , carrying a sidearm with empty chamber is a bad plan. Even if you're well versed in Israeli Carry all bets are off as to whether or not you can draw & chamber a round before the other guy shoots. In a game of seconds , fractions of a second are going to matter a lot.

 

[Burpboxhero]

Unless the individual in question is well versed in Israeli Carry , carrying a sidearm with empty chamber is a bad plan. Even if you're well versed in Israeli Carry all bets are off as to whether or not you can draw & chamber a round before the other guy shoots. In a game of seconds , fractions of a second are going to matter a lot.

It's an often heard rebuke, when seconds count, that is not applicable to the considerations made for not carrying one in the pipe, imho.

 

[DirectDrive]

One in pipe or not, your choice. Don't need two hands to chamber it. Shoot how you train.

Once an operator is trained (and proficient) in all aspects of empty chamber carry, he/she would be more than qualified to carry in C1

 

[whiskeybill]

We can debate this video all day long, but let's do a deeper look at what the root cause of this was. First thing was "hired" security guards. They work for a security company, hired to do a job. In South Africa. Were these fellows provided with proper training, and was there a company policy that dictated that the pistols be carried empty chambered? Very likely. The sidearms were also likely company "issue". These guys looked to be untrained, so it's a fair assumption that they were not trained at any level.

I was an Air Force cop many years ago, in the early to mid '70's. The Security guys that guarded the resources (aircraft, missile sites, weapons storage areas) all carried M-16's / CAR-15s on an empty chamber. Everyone would show up for Guardmount at the armory, checking out weapons and ammo. Everyone would get in line at the clearing barrel, show an empty chamber and let the bolt close, then install a magazine. At the time, the LE side of the police and all supervisory NCO's carried S&W M-15 revolvers in 38 Special, and those had all the holes filled with ball ammo. Looking at the world we live in today, even our annual "training" back then seemed lacking. There was never any discussion about "Shoot / Don't shoot" scenarios, just the annual trip to the range to shoot paper, and some kind of hands on riot control. That was then, and I have no clue as to what training protocol is now. I have my suspicions it isn't much better. Recall during the Clinton years and our involvement in Kosovo? Our Army troops that were seized and taken hostage? They were put in the field with weapons and NO AMMUNITION!

All I can say is Train the way you will fight, and fight as you trained. Better be good.

 

[Frank RW]

And the Democrats want all guns to have trigger locks on them. Imagine how many end up getting killed because of Democrat mentality.

Please don't group all Dems into the same cesspool. There are plenty of gun-lovin' non-GOP folks out there.

 

[Frank RW]

I suppose you could train for it, buy why ?
One more thing to do that could get you killed.

I figure most people are more likely to have a negligent discharge than ever need the firearm in defense.

Let's do the math, figuratively I guess, of all, say, USA civilian gun-owners... How many have unintentionally fired a round off vs needed to defend themselves with it?

From the ratio I see on YouTube, about 10 to 1.