Why are we buying into the Anti-Gunner Hype?

[DB is Here]

Are the fringes on the gun debate controlling what we talk about here at NWFA?

I ask this question because it seems we get a ton of posts about what the fringes are doing and as a community we get drug down into the latest "What they're" going to do.

If we as a community get drug down into every rabbit hole that the Anti-Gunner desires, are we not allowing them to stir us into a frenzy?...Why are we allowing 8% of the populace to control us?

I'm done getting drug around by the anti's!!!

Last I checked we still have the 2A, We still have a Constitution.

Rant Over.

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[Andy54Hawken]

I do hear ya DB.
With that said...

Someone comes into my house or in this case a "hangout" filled with friends or folks who at least , have similar interests...
And espouses the ideas of those who wish to take away a Right....then it can get folks fired up.
Which can make for a whole lotta hype from both sides of the argument.

It is wise to pick your battles as the old saying goes....it is also wise to pick your battlefield.
Andy

 

[Elf]

Past a certain point the frenzy becomes unproductive and that's unavoidable. However, I think if you consider that this is a culture war being waged upon gun owners -- and ironically, an attempt to turn them into an oppressed minority -- then it is good to know "the enemy's movements" as soon as possible so that strategies can be made to counter them.

That could be politically, as is our responsibility in contacting our legislators and voting, or by purchasing items before they are banned, or by thinking up new firearms technologies to get around infringing laws, or by getting enough heads up to make other plans should things turn out like most other countries and some states (bans, confiscations, etc.). Being informed about what people are doing to try and hurt gun owners is what enables us to get as much of a head start as possible.

 

[DB is Here]

Excellent point and in no way am I saying to bury our heads in the sand nor live w/ rose colored glasses. I also understand the need to vent one's frustrations by all these endless attacks on our rights. That said I do feel it's worth keeping grounded as we still have our BOR's & Constitution.

 

[bbbass]

@DB Wesner As I mentioned in another post... these "happenings" or incidents going on as current events, bring out certain types that want to have influence over gun owners. I call them trolls. They are seeking arguments. I will play up to a certain point since I love to mix it up... but my mind is not sharp and I'm not really good at it anymore. Then there are what I've called "impostors" that visit the site... we have another coined term for them, but they typically lead with "I'm a gun owner but". One such person even linked to Everytown.... why would anybody here have that group on their bookmark list?

I'll fight em, as long as I have the energy.

For someone on the forum that has genuine questions, I don't mind explaining... but so many just have attitude or agenda and you're right, its a waste of time and energy that could be used better lobbying.

I'm like a dog when another dog raises it's hackles... the fight is on.... oh well.

 

[RVTECH]

are we not allowing them to stir us into a frenzy?.

Yes, we are and for reasons I have laid out in a previous post - we are the ones who stand to lose the most.
My previous post:

As i have said before many times - the undeniable fact remains to the dems/antis 'gun control' is purely a conceptual undertaking for them because they have NOTHING to loose and because of this they will simply continue to respond in this manner while we, with MUCH to loose, are scrambling like rats leaving a sinking ship.
It's like this with nearly ANY liberal 'cause'. The MOST who protest AGAINST something have virtually no interest, experience or investment in what they are protesting or want to control/eliminate.
Any attempt to 'convince' them of anything is falling on deaf ears. Their words are resolute and unwavering. We are a joke to them. They are laughing at us because they know we are on the defensive. They know among ourselves, and on forums such as this, the members are posting unending, redundant and rhetorical statements about them and their misguided beliefs yet unfortunately do nothing but to bolster the members post count. We are simply telling ourselves the same things over and over we already know - I think the original was 'when guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns'.
Until the dems and antis understand and experience the emotion of a potential loss such as we stand to this is NOT going to change - and nothing to lose is a very powerful weapon.

 

[bbbass]

Yes, we are and for reasons I have laid out in a previous post - we are the ones who stand to lose the most.
My previous post:

I agree on principle. But what would you have us do? Given that the opposing side won't listen to reason, it would seem that the only thing to do is defeat them at the ballot box or get engaged in fighting legislation. While we can each work in our spheres of influence, family and friends mostly have already made up their minds. Going to Salem... not everybody can do that on a regular basis. Not sure what else we can do.

IMO we are in a culture war and we are losing. The sources of influence are social media, the MSM, Hollywood and music stars, and the colleges, universities, and schools. Unless we can turn the culture tide, take a young person shooting, etc, we will continue to lose gun rights.

 

[Mike97124]

It's not just the "opposing side" that won't listen to reason, it's also the fanatical hard core NRA and Second Amendment contingent that won't listen to reason. If the NRA hadn't taken the cold stiff fingers stance and those that feel that the Second Amendment gives them the right to buy, sell, use and miss-use what ever weapon they want without checks or consequences then we wouldn't be in the corner that we are in right now. I blame the two extreme members of these groups (as well as the gun manufacturers that pumped out millions of AR type guns as fast as they could) for turning many of the fence sitters against guns and causing them to join those that are fanatical about taking them away.

There are a lot of us that agree with what the more level headed groups are saying on both sides, but if we speak up we are just shouted down... even on this forum. There is a lot of room for the middle ground, but unfortunately, I feel it's too late and that the cold stiff fingers group is going to see it happen, as will the rest of us that enjoy guns.

Mike

 

[bbbass]

It's not just the "opposing side" that won't listen to reason, it's also the fanatical hard core NRA and Second Amendment contingent that won't listen to reason. If the NRA hadn't taken the cold stiff fingers stance and those that feel that the Second Amendment gives them the right to buy, sell, use and miss-use what ever weapon they want without checks or consequences then we wouldn't be in the corner that we are in right now. I blame the two extreme members of these groups (as well as the gun manufacturers that pumped out millions of AR type guns as fast as they could) for turning many of the fence sitters against guns and causing them to join those that are fanatical about taking them away.

There are a lot of us that agree with what the more level headed groups are saying on both sides, but if we speak up we are just shouted down... even on this forum. There is a lot of room for the middle ground, but unfortunately, I feel it's too late and that the cold stiff fingers group is going to see it happen, as will the rest of us that enjoy guns.

Mike

You're talking about me.

IMO, the "cold dead hands" group is fed up with compromise. What has compromise bought us... a slower death. We have continued to lose gun rights over the years. Level-headed talks have bought more of the same (misery, losses).

You put yourself up as above the fray, the voice of reason. Someday you will find yourself going to the collection points with your revolver and your bolt action rifle. Don't for a minute think that you won't wind up like the UK, Australia, New Zealand, and Venezuela... "reasonable" talk and compromise is leading the way.

IMO your ideas are dangerous. Neville Chamberlain comes to mind.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

If the NRA hadn't taken the cold stiff fingers stance and those that feel that the Second Amendment gives them the right to buy, sell, use and miss-use what ever weapon they want without checks or consequences then we wouldn't be in the corner that we are in right now.

Speaking only for myself here...
I am a NRA member and could be seen as an adherent to the "cold stiff fingers stance".

I do "feel" , think , believe ,etc.. that the 2nd Amendment guarantees the Right to keep and bear arms...without exception as to just what type of Arms.

With that said...

What is troubling to me , with your statement , that , admittedly I quoted in part , is the word "miss-use" and the phrasing of "they want without checks or consequences".

Again speaking only for myself here...
I want no one to misuse a firearm.
The misuse of a firearm can lead to injury or death...way to much of that going around , no need to add to it.

Also as for checks and consequences...
Checks----When filling out a form 4473 there is a list of just what and who can or can not buy a firearm...I am not against that.
Consequences---We have gun laws aplenty already...how 'bout enforcing those...?
Also...Why should I or any other gun owner , not involved in a crime , be made to suffer the consequences of another persons action...
I am not against consequences....I just don't want to be held accountable for the actions of another.
Andy

 

[quality]

The knee jerk reaction to put ERPO constraints looming over each, and every LAW ABIDING gun owner is tantamount to the Leftist drive to disarm anyone not swallowing the Socialist mantra. In theory, one mamby-pamby basement dweller could disarm an an entire neighborhood by publicly declaring that they felt threatened and a feared for their safety!! Even if they did One person at a time!
These ERPO orders could effectively disarm people at an exponential rate by by putting an entire household under an ERPO restriction..
What a better way to scope out unprotected household for a robbery than to see LAW ABIDING CITIZENS have their private domain invaded to KEEP THE PUBLIC SAFE!!

 

[11Charlie]

Are the fringes on the gun debate controlling what we talk about here at NWFA?

I ask this question because it seems we get a ton of posts about what the fringes are doing and as a community we get drug down into the latest "What they're" going to do.

If we as a community get drug down into every rabbit hole that the Anti-Gunner desires, are we not allowing them to stir us into a frenzy?...Why are we allowing 8% of the populace to control us?

I'm done getting drug around by the anti's!!!

Last I checked we still have the 2A, We still have a Constitution.

Rant Over.

With all do respect brother I think the frenzy as you call it is what we are left with. We have been trying to get the people balanced in the middle to stand up and vote for our rights for years and its not going to get any better! By the time people pull there heads out of the dark hole and rose colored sun glasses it will be over and they will be controlled by a socialist government.

The only thing at this point in time that will solve our issues and the fight against our 2A rights is lead!

 

[nammac]

It's not just the "opposing side" that won't listen to reason, it's also the fanatical hard core NRA and Second Amendment contingent that won't listen to reason. If the NRA hadn't taken the cold stiff fingers stance and those that feel that the Second Amendment gives them the right to buy, sell, use and miss-use what ever weapon they want without checks or consequences then we wouldn't be in the corner that we are in right now. I blame the two extreme members of these groups (as well as the gun manufacturers that pumped out millions of AR type guns as fast as they could) for turning many of the fence sitters against guns and causing them to join those that are fanatical about taking them away.

There are a lot of us that agree with what the more level headed groups are saying on both sides, but if we speak up we are just shouted down... even on this forum. There is a lot of room for the middle ground, but unfortunately, I feel it's too late and that the cold stiff fingers group is going to see it happen, as will the rest of us that enjoy guns.

Mike

You are talking about me! I'm a hard core Second Amendment supporter, there's no language there that gives any government the right to regulate, legislate or otherwise restrict this God given right. Sorry you don't feel the same way...

 

[11Charlie]

You are talking about me!

He's talking about 90% of this forum!!

 

[Stomper]

All right everyone.... stay calm and chive on.

 

[nammac]

The only thing at this point in time that will solve our issues and the fight against our 2A rights is lead!

Amen Brother, Amen!!!!

 

[DB is Here]

With all do respect brother I think the frenzy as you call it is what we are left with. We have been trying to get the people balanced in the middle to stand up and vote for our rights for years and its not going to get any better! By the time people pull there heads out of the dark hole and rose colored sun glasses it will be over and they will be controlled by a socialist government.

We agree my friend. My point was/is that I'll not be whipped into a frenzy by what the crazies do. I'll keep my calm resolve as I do believe a well reasoned argument backed by a firm resolve is our best tact...

 

[sdlsaginaw]

There are a lot of us that agree with what the more level headed groups are saying on both sides, but if we speak up we are just shouted down... even on this forum. There is a lot of room for the middle ground, but unfortunately, I feel it's too late and that the cold stiff fingers group is going to see it happen, as will the rest of us that enjoy guns.

To understand why we are at "cold dead hands" you should Google "lawdog cake". Middle ground implies there is a balance arrived at by give and take negotiating.

The gun control side gives up nothing, only the pro-gun side ever gives up anything. The "middle ground" is a constantly shrinking part of a once whole cake.

Seriously, read LawDog's cake analogy and the list of concessions already made over the years. Think about a "middle ground" where the gun control people are satisfied while leaving you with the guns you currently own.

 

[MannyGlocks]

Per the thread title: I'm not.

I'm avoiding the 'the sky is falling' threads.

 

[11Charlie]

I'll keep my calm resolve as I do believe a well reasoned argument backed by a firm resolve is our best tact...

Not going to disagree with you my friend but I also believe we are past that point of talking. There is nothing and I mean nothing that any of us can say that will change the minds of the weak feeble sheep that need protecting.

I will for one will protect my own flock by all means necessary.