WA's law on someone under 21 having a handgun in their car. Anyone know it by chance?

[schibbyzoltan]

Hey guys, so I'm 19 from WA and I've been looking at getting a handgun for the range. Now I know you have to be 21 to own it and such, and my father thinks I'm responsible enough so it'll be registered in his name until my 21st birthday in 18 months. But I'm wondering, if I want to go to the range, what precautions do I have to take being under 21 and it being in my truck to and from the range?

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[t.huynh]

I'm pretty sure you only have to be 21 to purchase a pistol. Don't quote me on that though, I am not a lawyer.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk 2

 

[chase]

In Oregon I can legally transfer a pistol to an 18 year old. I would presume it would be the same for Washington? You have to be 21 to purchase it from a dealer.

While transferring it just keep it unloaded and in the trunk, back seat, out of reasonable reach... You cant keep it loaded in the truck since you're not 21, and you cant have a CHL yet.

 

[MarkAd]

Now I know you have to be 21 to own it and such

You do not know the gun laws in WA. You can buy a pistol at age 18, You can not but it from a FFL, where you must be 21 to purchase it. You must 21 in WA to purchase handgun ammo from a store. Your dad can pick it up for you.

Since you are under 21 and can not get a CPL, to transport firearms make sure it is unloaded, in a case and out of easy reach as in behind or under your seat and you will be good to go.

I highly recommend Kitsap Rifle and Revolver club. Website is gunsafety.org
I will be there all day Monday with access to several firearms. You are welcome to come try then and see what you like before spending several hundered dollars on a gun.

I also suggest avoiding Gig Harbor it has become very crowded and makes me feel usafe.

Send me a PM if you want to come out

 

[Nwcid]

Mark is mostly right. In WA the ONLY requirement to carrying any firearm in a vehicle is to be unloaded. You can have a loaded magazine in one hand, the gun in the other and be 100% legal. Of course if you are over 21 and have a cary license you could have it loaded in the vehicle any time. Also there are other exemptions as found in the link below.

Yes you can legally own your own handgun at 18 in WA you just can not buy it though an FFL as they are Federal and Federal law says 21.

Second it is impossible to have it registered in your dads name since there is no registration of title 1 firearms in WA.

Here are all the laws in WA which I highly suggest you read, Chapter 9.41 RCW: FIREARMS AND DANGEROUS WEAPONS They include sections on exactly what you are asking about.

 

[MarkAd]

Nwcid is right. but i always suggest people keep the unholstered guns in a gun bag or case. mostly to protect the gun, Behind the seat in a truck is just a handy place to keep it.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Second it is impossible to have it registered in your dads name since there is no registration of title 1 firearms in WA.

Here are all the laws in WA which I highly suggest you read, Chapter 9.41 RCW: FIREARMS AND DANGEROUS WEAPONS They include sections on exactly what you are asking about.

That is incorrect, Washington has a pistol registry, when you buy a pistol from an FFL you fill out a "purchase application" from the state of Washington, this is a triplicate form that sends copies to the Department of Licensing which maintains a central registry.

there is no requirement to inform DoL of a sale or to fill out the purchase form in a face to face sale, but there is when buying from an FFL. hence any pistol purchased from the OPs dad as a gift will be "registered in his father's name"

RCW 9.41.110

(9)(a) A true record in triplicate shall be made of every pistol sold, in a book kept for the purpose, the form of which may be prescribed by the director of licensing and shall be personally signed by the purchaser and by the person effecting the sale, each in the presence of the other, and shall contain the date of sale, the caliber, make, model and manufacturer's number of the weapon, the name, address, occupation, and place of birth of the purchaser and a statement signed by the purchaser that he or she is not ineligible under RCW 9.41.040 to possess a firearm.

(b) One copy shall within six hours be sent by certified mail to the chief of police of the municipality or the sheriff of the county of which the purchaser is a resident; the duplicate the dealer shall within seven days send to the director of licensing; the triplicate the dealer shall retain for six years.

 

[Nwcid]

Yes there is record of the FIRST sale just like any other sale though an FFL.

IF there was registration like on NFA items, or cars or other items with titles then with each sale the information HAS to be transferred with the item. With registration at any time the .gov can look up an see exactly who owns want. That is just not the case.......... WA has NO idea where the guns are, just who the gun went to after an FFL transfer.

On top of that I do not have to carry a card proving prof of ownership like I do with the items I own that are registered.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Yes there is record of the FIRST sale just like any other sale though an FFL.

IF there was registration like on NFA items, or cars or other items with titles then with each sale the information HAS to be transferred with the item. With registration at any time the .gov can look up an see exactly who owns want. That is just not the case.......... WA has NO idea where the guns are, just who the gun went to after an FFL transfer.

On top of that I do not have to carry a card proving prof of ownership like I do with the items I own that are registered.

however the state of Washington has a specific searchable computer that will tie the gun to your name. in most other states the state has to contact the ATF and request a "trace" where they call the manufacturer, then the distributer, then through the 4473s....

in WA they type that gun in and it's instantly to the last FFL transfer. a friend of mine recently did a police ridealong, they searched his name on the patrol car computer for fun, and BAM! it brought up a list of the pistols he bought from FFLs by make, model, and serial

if that ain't registration I don't know what is.. maybe Registration-Lite?

 

[Nwcid]

Yes it shows the ones he bought but not IF he still has them. It does not show who the current owner is. It does not show any he bought from FTF.

With registration they know for sure where the gun is (or at least should be) by address of the registered owner. When that owner wants to sell either FTF or FFL then that information would also transfer to a searchable data base. Right now even if your friend was to sell that gun to someone else via FFL even in WA state it will ALWAYS show him as an owner since the "registration" does not transfer with the item.

Like with NFA stuff the ATF knows where each item is and when it was transferred between each owner. Along with that no one else is allowed to be in possession of the item. Right now if I want I can loan my gun to any legal person I choose for a long as I choose.

 

[schibbyzoltan]

You do not know the gun laws in WA. You can buy a pistol at age 18, You can not but it from a FFL, where you must be 21 to purchase it. You must 21 in WA to purchase handgun ammo from a store. Your dad can pick it up for you.

Since you are under 21 and can not get a CPL, to transport firearms make sure it is unloaded, in a case and out of easy reach as in behind or under your seat and you will be good to go.

I highly recommend Kitsap Rifle and Revolver club. Website is gunsafety.org
I will be there all day Monday with access to several firearms. You are welcome to come try then and see what you like before spending several hundered dollars on a gun.

I also suggest avoiding Gig Harbor it has become very crowded and makes me feel usafe.

Send me a PM if you want to come out

Pardon my mistake, it's finals time and I've got a bit going on.

So I'm a bit confused, how can I buy a handgun at 18 just not from an FFL? So like if I wanted to purchase a handgun from you, I could legally give you X-amount of dollars that you wanted for it and it'd be legal?

As for the storage of it, that's how I have always practiced handling my guns. I drive a truck so my ammunition goes on the passenger floor and the guns go behind my seat in their cases. I've spoken to a local police officer and he said I was in the clear if anything was to happen.

I'm a member at the GH club. I kind of get where you're coming from about the unsafe thing. There are some interesting people that show up there and some of them have no experience and members get pissed about it. There should be rules on who's allowed to use certain things.

I've been meaning to go to Kitsap for a while and go to the range, I've heard some pretty good things so I might take you up on that offer.

 

[schibbyzoltan]

That is incorrect, Washington has a pistol registry, when you buy a pistol from an FFL you fill out a "purchase application" from the state of Washington, this is a triplicate form that sends copies to the Department of Licensing which maintains a central registry.

there is no requirement to inform DoL of a sale or to fill out the purchase form in a face to face sale, but there is when buying from an FFL. hence any pistol purchased from the OPs dad as a gift will be "registered in his father's name"

RCW 9.41.110

So if I wanted to be safe and law abiding in every case, when I buy a handgun from someone, what would I need to do paperwork wise to notify the Gov't that it's now in my possession?

 

[EMNofSeattle]

So if I wanted to be safe and law abiding in every case, when I buy a handgun from someone, what would I need to do paperwork wise to notify the Gov't that it's now in my possession?

No, the pistol registry is only required for dealers although I guess you can voluntarily fill out the for and send it in. It's a stupid law, but you won't break it by buying a FtF gun

 

[schibbyzoltan]

No, the pistol registry is only required for dealers although I guess you can voluntarily fill out the for and send it in. It's a stupid law, but you won't break it by buying a FtF gun

But what about when say you get pulled over or something and the cop asks if the gun is registered to me. If it was registered to the previous owner, I feel like that's just unneeded problems if that happens.

 

[Nwcid]

But what about when say you get pulled over or something and the cop asks if the gun is registered to me. If it was registered to the previous owner, I feel like that's just unneeded problems if that happens.

He won't ask that because there is NO registration. Hard to ask for something that does not exist. Even if you go to an FFL and fill out paperwork it will STILL shows the all the names that it has ever transferred through an FFL. Since it is NOT registration it does NOT link gun to owner so that information does not "change" each time the gun changes hands.

In WA as long as a gun does not come back stolen then there is no issue. Many times they do not even ask to see the gun. Last time I got pulled over (2 weeks ago) I had one of my guns in my center console where my vehicle registration (paper saying who the truck belongs to). Told the WSP officer I had a gun in there when she asked for my information. I asked her if she would still like me to get the registration out and she replied "Yes". That was the only conversation about guns during the whole thing.

 

[Nwcid]

In states like HI, CA, NY and a few other places they have registration on some or all title 1 firearms. To buy a gun you have to get permission first from the state. Once you have that you buy your gun and all the information is recorded and sent to the state. Now the gun IS registered to you. If they run a check on a gun it will show who legally owns it. If they run a check on a person it will show ALL of the guns they own currently.

If you want to sell a gun the new buyer has to go though the same process and in that way the gun really does come out of your name as it would no longer be registered to you.

 

[Nwcid]

So I'm a bit confused, how can I buy a handgun at 18 just not from an FFL? So like if I wanted to purchase a handgun from you, I could legally give you X-amount of dollars that you wanted for it and it'd be legal?

So you want to be a "safe and responsible" gun owner but you did not take the time to read the link I posted? All the information is in it. Laws are written to say what you can not do, not what you can do. So if there is no law against it then it is legal. So in WA there is NO law against buying, owning, or possessing a handgun if you are over 18. But an FFL can not sell you one as they are Federally licensed and they can only sell long guns to people under 21.

Here is the link again to all of the WA gun laws, Chapter 9.41 RCW: FIREARMS AND DANGEROUS WEAPONS They are pretty straight forward to read.

As for the storage of it, that's how I have always practiced handling my guns. I drive a truck so my ammunition goes on the passenger floor and the guns go behind my seat in their cases. I've spoken to a local police officer and he said I was in the clear if anything was to happen.

Of course you would not have any problems carrying that way since the ONLY law in WA is that is has to be unloaded. There are NO requirements for "in a case", "out of reach", in locked compartments" or any other such foolishness. If it is unloaded you can transport it ANY way you choose.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Rifles only need to be carried unloaded. pistols, if you leave the vehicle unattended, must be locked inside the vehicle and unloaded and concealed from view. that's RCW 9.41.050.

also you cannot carry a pistol on or about your person being under 21 unless it's in a closed cased or secure wrapper, or while hiking, or at the gun club etc etc etc (see RCW 9.41.060 for more details)

meaning practically speaking, you have to have the firearms unloaded and concealed from view in the car in a closed case. once you turn 21, they only need to be unloaded and concealed from view while you're away from the car.

 

[Old506]

Where does it say it has to be unloaded?

Rifles only need to be carried unloaded. pistols, if you leave the vehicle unattended, must be locked inside the vehicle and unloaded and concealed from view. that's RCW 9.41.050.

also you cannot carry a pistol on or about your person being under 21 unless it's in a closed cased or secure wrapper, or while hiking, or at the gun club etc etc etc (see RCW 9.41.060 for more details)

meaning practically speaking, you have to have the firearms unloaded and concealed from view in the car in a closed case. once you turn 21, they only need to be unloaded and concealed from view while you're away from the car.

 

[Old506]

(iii) the licensee is away from the vehicle and the pistol is locked within the vehicle and concealed from view from outside the vehicle