Wanted: Dead or Alive

[PaulB47]

I was watching some old episodes of that series, and was wondering about Steve McQueen's gun. Looks like a cut down 92. Is that something that was actually used in the old West (after 1892 I suppose!) or was it completely a Hollywood creation? I guess I don't see the point of it (never mind the silliness of long cartridges in a 92).

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[Dungannon]

I'm guessing it was a Hollywood creation, like the Buscadero holsters.

On a slight tangent, I've wondered about pointy toe cowboy boots, ever since my first visit to the western museums in Cody, Wyoming: all the historic 1800's boots were square or round toed.

 

[jbett98]

I've read where the ammo on his holster belt was a larger caliber then the rifle.
It looked better on TV then the ones that actually fit.

 

[albin25]

Generally called a Mare's Leg. The one McQueen used was real but the bullets shown in his belt didn't fit the gun (too big) but looked better on camera. McQueen is said to have been very, very proficient with it. Similar pistols have been used in a number of very popular Movies and TV shows over many years.
Briscoe County Jr, Firefly, etc...

Several Major manufacturers have versions in current production, (Henry, Ross). from 22lr, 357, 45 etc...
ATF says they are pistols.

I had a Rossi Ranch Hand in 357 and still have a Henry 22lr.

Here's my Henry:

 

[Alexx1401]

Wife has been wanting one of those for many years. So far I have managed to talk her out of it. I keep trying to tell her it will not be nearly as much fun as she thinks it will be for the cost. I have never been able to find one for rent to let her try since I'm sure this would be the end of it for her. I figure if one of these days she just comes home with one it will be one of those learning experiences.

 

[PaulB47]

The one McQueen used was real

Yes, but what I mean, was a "mare's leg" ever actually used in the old West, or do all those reproductions now exist only because of that TV series?

In one of those shows he loaded his gun, but he was turned from the camera and looked like he took the cartridges from a pocket rather than his belt. I always wondered how the writers would deal with loading the gun, after they saddled him with obviously wrong ammo in the belt.

Another time a doctor pulled a bullet out of somebody's back who had been shot with that gun. He said the bullet was from a .30-30 although the ones on his belt looked more like maybe .38-55... It was also only half an inch deep in his flesh, took about 10 seconds to pull it out.

 

[Member 5605]

Hollywood creation.

He carried 45-70 on his belt but fired some weak load like .38spc

I used to have a Mares Leg in .44Mag.... fun fun fun. Impractical but fun.

 

[Alexx1401]

Yes, but what I mean, was a "mare's leg" ever actually used in the old West, or do all those reproductions now exist only because of that TV series?

In one of those shows he loaded his gun, but he was turned from the camera and looked like he took the cartridges from a pocket rather than his belt. I always wondered how the writers would deal with loading the gun, after they saddled him with obviously wrong ammo in the belt.

Another time a doctor pulled a bullet out of somebody's back who had been shot with that gun. He said the bullet was from a .30-30 although the ones on his belt looked more like maybe .38-55... It was also only half an inch deep in his flesh, took about 10 seconds to pull it out.

TV and movies never did much care about being accurate. As to if they ever really were used I very much doubt it. Possible but I can't remember ever seeing one other than the modern reproductions.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

I have never seen a "real" , as in from the 1870's through 90's lever action rifle or carbine cut down that way.
I don't think a "real" one was ever made that way.
Now that I said that , 5 of 'em will pop up in a museum or collection.

What I have seen on occasion is a cut down Northwest Trade Gun or various Springfield carbines or rifles at times.
These guns are seen from time to time cut off at the stock wrist and having a extremely short barrel , much like Steve McQueen's gun or a modern "Mare's Leg."
Andy
Edit for pre-coffee typing.

 

[Mark W.]

Model 92's were ONLY chambered in pistol cartridges as the action was not strong enough or long enough for rifle cartridges. You could at the time order one with as short as a 14" barrel and of course matching magazine or if you wanted a button magazine that did not pass the foreend.

There would have been really no advantage to a Mares leg over a handgun at the time save a little more velocity and since double action handguns were on the market before the model 92 it would have been slower in rapid fire not to mention impossible to cycle the action while remaining on target.

Hollywood Bull

 

[albin25]

Back in the day when recycle and re-use weren't lip service buzz-words but a way of life, I'm sure some rifles of many types were cut down for many reasons to continue some functionality for the owner. Horse stepped on the barrel?.. Cut off the damage. Split the stock cracking walnuts?.. Cut off the damage.
Considering how these rifles were the AR of the day I'm sure they were "customized" if they had to be. Do I think they were ever factory-built that way? no. Do any still survive? don't know and don't know how you could tell a recently cut 1892 from a old cut one.
So do I think it "couldabeen"? sure. Factory produced? nope. Was Steve McQueen too short to flip a full-size rifle like Chuck Connors later could? probably. Want a large caliber pistol for your backpack/canoe/atv that's not hard to control? it could be an option

I think the only question that is really important here is...
... is a Mares Leg fun to shoot? definitely!

 

[jackrv]

Model 92's were ONLY chambered in pistol cartridges as the action was not strong enough or long enough for rifle cartridges. You could at the time order one with as short as a 14" barrel and of course matching magazine or if you wanted a button magazine that did not pass the foreend.

There would have been really no advantage to a Mares leg over a handgun at the time save a little more velocity and since double action handguns were on the market before the model 92 it would have been slower in rapid fire not to mention impossible to cycle the action while remaining on target.

Hollywood Bull

I have a 1923 model 92 chambered in 25/20. I didn't know that was a pistol cartridge.

 

[Sgt Nambu]

I've read where the ammo on his holster belt was a larger caliber then the rifle.
It looked better on TV then the ones that actually fit.

That is often true. In Wanted Dead or Alive, Josh Randall's (Steve McQueen) sawed off Winchester "Mare's Leg" looks to be a .44-40, but he has .45-70 rounds in his big, mongo, gunbelt!
They've even shown a scene where Josh is loading his Winchester junior with the short rounds while the .45-70 rounds are in perfect view.

 

[Sgt Nambu]

I was watching some old episodes of that series, and was wondering about Steve McQueen's gun. Looks like a cut down 92. Is that something that was actually used in the old West (after 1892 I suppose!) or was it completely a Hollywood creation? I guess I don't see the point of it (never mind the silliness of long cartridges in a 92).

If they did exist, Paul, they were not well known! I remember that the "Mares Leg" caused as much of a sensation as the show and Steve McQueen did.

 

[Mark W.]

I have a 1923 model 92 chambered in 25/20. I didn't know that was a pistol cartridge.

You got me there I should have said Pistol length cartridges. And the 25-20 is actually a necked down 32-20 just as the 218 Bee (which was also used in a few late Model 92's) is a necked down 25-20.

 

[edslhead]

 

[jbett98]

I'd sure like to see how you get those 45/70 rds through that loading gate.

 

[PaulB47]

You push real hard.

I also don't get the point of the big loops. Yeah, for gloves I suppose, but most of the time you are not wearing them, and how well do you operate a trigger and hammer with heavy gloves anyway?