Waiting for Gun Hording Idiots to Run out of Money.

[Whitey375]

And certain powders. Tell me where I can get W748

How much do you need?

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[Burt Gummer]

It isn't that hard to buy all the ammo you want at reasonable prices, including .22. You just need to type 100 words per minute and have your CC info memorized LOL.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

How much do you need?

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Two 8 lb cans would be good, at non gouging prices.. it's my 5.56 and 7.62 powder and I am ready for a few big projects, otherwise

 

[Rix]

These weird holier than thou rants, on various topics, from this one, to fitness, to shtf preps etc, kinda aggravate me.

 

[Mastershakelock]

These weird holier than thou rants, on various topics, from this one, to fitness, to shtf preps etc, kinda aggravate me.

Agreed.

Stop acting so entitled. No one owes you a damn thing. You don't deserve a Sig at the $300 price you think you should have it, not up to you.

You're also not special for being a massive gun & ammo hoarder.. Many saw this coming years ago.

 

[AMProducts]

This is what should concern everyone. Ammo is the cheapest thing in the world to make. Why we aren't getting Wolf, Mexican, South American, French importers trying to supply this insatiable demand IS what everyone should be asking as to WHAT is blocking the supply chain and WHY.

When I did some research to learn from someone who's kid was working for Remington who had pulled back to a 3 day one shift work week, that told me something. When I was told that huge brass auctions (ex mil brass) was being 'gamed' by out of country, non identifiable buyers, that got my attention.

Power and primers are as easy to make as digging the crap out of the ground and packaging it up. We haven't been in any real war with serious ammo being shot in YEARS. China is not buying up AMMO, but steel.

You can worry, or not. But what ever the case, my issue is this. Is something coming? Maybe.

Will the gun hoarders do anything about it? No.

History has proven that only a small few will dump their lives and fight to the death in a life changing struggle against the very system they have bought into. They will follow the leader, the propaganda. It's history.

So black helicopters or not, I see a ton of people with guns that will eventually wake up to saying 'yeah, let's just get a jet ski' and give up the ghost of trying to 'act as if' where if they had their guns on credit cards, those bills come due.

For the record I only have a few guns now, brought it WAY back down from what I had. If things get bad you can't stuff a car full of guns and live, You will need to move, and you can't do that with 50 guns in the trunk.

Ammo is far from the cheapest thing in the world to make, it's actually insanely expensive to make with very thin margins, the only thing that allows it to be sold as cheaply as it is the quantity it's produced in.

The major expenses in ammo production is machinery, raw materials, and know how. It's easy for every guy to go out and start an assembly operation (reloading), but very few can do end-to-end manufacturing, in fact this is nearly impossible.

 

[Burt Gummer]

It isn't that hard to buy all the ammo you want at reasonable prices, including .22. You just need to type 100 words per minute and have your CC info memorized LOL.

Damn. MidwayUSA has trashed most of their notifications now. Just when I had a system down pat, figures.

 

[AlphaCoyote]

Why aren't the Chinese or Phillipinos or Taiwanese or Malasians all over this .22LR shortage? Any one of them should be able to throw down a factory without EPA oversight, and start cranking out .22LR at a ferocious pace. It's not like the US shortage is going to end in the time it takes them to recoup their capital outlay. The law of supply and demand says that when demand goes up, the increase in price brings new producers to the market, thereby stabilizing the price. Where are the producers?

Or is it possible that the new pricing reflects the increased cost of raw materials? When I started shooting NRA competition in about 1971, .22lr standard velocity ammo was about 3.5 cents a round. [I know, because the instructor would yell at us when we jerked a round, "Well, that was a waste of 3 and a half cents."] Adjusted for inflation, that $.035 per round in 1971 would be $.20 per round in today's dollars. Go to one of the online CPI calculators and check it out. That box of 50 that cost $1.75 in 1971 should be costing about $10 by that standard.

Maybe we just got spoiled over the past 30 years by a failure of the industry to increase prices to keep up with inflation.

I don't think we're EVER going back to readily-available 5 cent per round .22LR, let alone the 4 cents or 3 cents people talk about so nostalgically. With people willing to pay more, why would manufacturers and retailers charge less?

Economics 101. Capitalism. Supply and demand. Love it or leave it.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Glad I'm a paranoid prepper who stocked up long ago. Yep, back then we were just crazy survivalists

 

[BroncoFan]

Glad I'm a paranoid prepper who stocked up long ago. Yep, back then we were just crazy survivalists

All these Johnny Come Lately's sure have made it hard on us long-time repeat offenders.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

All these Johnny Come Lately's sure have made it hard on us long-time repeat offenders.

They come in like preppers but late to the game

 

[Whitey375]

Two 8 lb cans would be good, at non gouging prices.. it's my 5.56 and 7.62 powder and I am ready for a few big projects, otherwise

Oh dang, lol. I have 4# and figured I could help someone out. Good luck.

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[AMProducts]

Why aren't the Chinese or Phillipinos or Taiwanese or Malasians all over this .22LR shortage? Any one of them should be able to throw down a factory without EPA oversight, and start cranking out .22LR at a ferocious pace. It's not like the US shortage is going to end in the time it takes them to recoup their capital outlay. The law of supply and demand says that when demand goes up, the increase in price brings new producers to the market, thereby stabilizing the price. Where are the producers?

The chinese have no reason, because norinco is essentially banned from selling imports here in the US, the only time that stuff gets in is when it goes through a few middle men.

The Phillipinos have no interest because they can make centerfire ammo, and sell it for a higher margin.

If you look at most of the .22LR ammo that's out there in terms of origin, the principle foreign stuff we get is wolf, which is generally russian, there is some lapua match ammo that gets imported. The main reason: margins are too low. Except for this year and 2008, .22 ammo never has this much demand. This is the same reason all the big companies arn't adding production capacity, because they got burned in 1994. They added production capacity when the market was tight, and once everyone met their capacity people didn't buy again for 18 months, this is why no one is adding capacity, because this condition won't last.

 

[Burt Gummer]

Or maybe they are sick of sending us real goods in exchange for little slips of paper aka monopoly money by now.

 

[JVK]

No one seems to know anyone who's buying -> I'm not seeing any mention of anyone buying anything anywhere.

Is everyone who's doing the buying doing so in secrecy? We all just happened to not know anyone who's bought anything? I have a (3) letter acronym for you. It's not the next one.

What is the NRA's position on this? Time to kick down memos from e-mails.

Only/A few hundred-thousand people/entities are holding large stakes? (Wild Guess??)

The inherent nature of hording among the firearm community is its own demise.

What is the point by then?

 

[Archer762]

A gun shop owner was just telling me that guys who never shoot are still coming in and trying to buy bulk. He always asks them "how many rounds do you shoot per month?" and the answer is usually none, or maybe some 22, but then they want to buy a case of 223 or several bricks of 22.

Fine with me. Those guys will have bills to pay in a few months, and will be selling at a loss. Just like the PMag and AR panic buyers that are already selling. Just look at the classifieds now: already a ton of low-end thrown-together ARs with cheap red dot sights, and no one's buying. A lot of this stuff was paid for with plastic.

 

[knuckle Head]

A gun shop owner was just telling me that guys who never shoot are still coming in and trying to buy bulk. He always asks them "how many rounds do you shoot per month?" and the answer is usually none, or maybe some 22, but then they want to buy a case of 223 or several bricks of 22.

Fine with me. Those guys will have bills to pay in a few months, and will be selling at a loss. Just like the PMag and AR panic buyers that are already selling. Just look at the classifieds now: already a ton of low-end thrown-together ARs with cheap red dot sights, and no one's buying. A lot of this stuff was paid for with plastic.

I already ran across a guy with a full can of 5.56 tracers, selling at a 1/3 below what you would pay at midway or anywhere else. I bought some it,
I do not generally like tracers because you tracer both ways, but a ricochet against the right object can cause some evil people some serious problems. An I keep one mag full tracers, just so when shtf and a bunch deadbeats come want some of my stores. When lowlife see tracers come at them they do not think about how it is giving away my position, they think about all those red streaks hitting around them and zinging past them and turn run with pooh dripping out of their drawers.

 

[knuckle Head]

Damn. MidwayUSA has trashed most of their notifications now. Just when I had a system down pat, figures.

I had oodles and oodles of stuff on midway with a notify me, I would turn on the computer and see I had anywhere form 1 to15, literally 15 emails from midway saying stuff was in. As you can imagine the email was anywhere from 30 minutes to two hours old. I clicked on each email and the link inside and yeah you guessed it, they had already sold out.

Now I have to got back into the system and click notify me again.

I think some people are sitting around buying it all up and then gouging people for three and four times the normal rate.

But as others have said and I have posted they will run out of people to gouge and be forced to sell it one day.

 

[nextgenar]

Interesting what some people think of as hoarding. I recently looked around and realized I had over a dozen bricks of 22 lr. I didn't intentionally hoard it, I just picked up a little here and there and it added up. Do I really need a dozen + bricks? No. So I gave one to my nephew for his birthday, and sold 4 bricks + 280 rounds of CCI hollowpoints on here. (Thanks Paul from Sutherlin.) With the cash I got, I bought my wife a new bicycle and 4 boxes of 30-06 ammo because I got a new 742 carbine 06 and didn't have any ammo. So having "extra" ammo on hand can come in handy on occasion. : )

 

[nextgenar]

They are definitely falling, and becoming more available I picked up a dmps ar last week at Wal-Mart for $617 and yesterday they had 223 ammo for $5.27 per box