WA is doing it's best to drive gun owners out or make them criminals: anyone else planning on moving?

[Bushman]

Been planning on moving away since the 90's.
Dam Californians have ruined this area.

And 30 years later you are still here??

 

[Bushman]

I dont disagree. This is the end of the line. We fight now or the 2a in wa. is dead (hopefully your state isn't next). For those of us working hard to stop these laws from being passed, its time to put it in overdrive. For those on the fence about taking action, this is most likely your last chance.

This is the time to encourage and motivate, not get all doom and gloom, everything is hopeless.


Thats not what I find most depressing, its all the gun owners who refuse to take any action or have given up. Its like playing for a sports team where 3/4 of the players go home or lay down on feild because there 10 pionts behind.

I dont believe that we cant beat these laws, If gun owners would put in the work. The 1639 defense fund has raised $115k in about a year. There are 600k cpl holders in wa. Obviously they didnt all even donate $1. There where over one milion no votes for 1639. If EVERYONE that cared donated $20 we could have millions of $ to fight these laws. Thats one example.


Either way, this thread brings me down, so Im out.

You are in a room with 100 people. Out of those 100 people, 70 of them are anti gun, 30 of them are pro gun. Even if all of the gun owners voted (which I have every year), they are still outnummmmmberrrred.

 

[Bushman]

I would not rely on big steps when 50% cannot take 30 minutes to nearly effortlessly fill out and return a ballot for free.

These are the people in your community. Who you will rely on. They work there. They are your jury pool.

No thanks.

First time I got called for jury duty, they went through the people who got selected to go to get questioned by both the prosecutor and defense attorney for jury selection in court. I was the only person with a college degree. 1/4 was unemployed (back in 2009). I paid more in taxes than anyone in the pool grossed in a year...Most made about $10 an hour. I was actually surprised about how much they knew about us when we went in, it was scary. They also went through and asked you questions about your background too. I was the only person who did NOT want to be there and did EVERYTHING in my power to get out of there. Most were happy to get the $10 a day for a DUI case.

 

[Bushman]

Agree to disagree. I also support the outlawing of pooping on public streets, trivial vandalism, trivial theft, etc. all of which are benign bad behavior for which the cost to enforce is probably larger than the problem, if we take your view. But in the aggregate it's gross, offensive, and/or causes real direct and indirect harm.

When folks use/waste single use plastic items, foam, etc. these items will last for generations and in the aggregate costs us significantly in cleanup or harm to our environment and wildlife. The costs are direct and indirect, just like the examples I gave. Throwing a plastic shopping bag in the ocean may seem trivial, but you shouldn't have the GUN to begin with, and that GUN does great harm to our society and life. When a litterer collects a bag or straw and throws it carelessly and it ends up in the ocean, it harms something directly or indirectly. And that robs me and others of something irreplaceable; a clean environment to enjoy and clean aquatic life, which is part of the circle of life. It harms fish, mammals, birds, shellfish, etc. to the point of changing their DNA structure.

Your line of thinking is the exact same as the anti 2nd amendment nanny state. Force our beliefs down on everyone for the "greater good". Don't believe me? I changed the word bag to gun in the bolded area of your post....YOU can choose to use a rolled up newspaper if you like. I'd like to use my plastic straw please, those rolled up news paper straws don't last 4 minutes in my drinks...screw you Costco...


Change of DNA structure? You do realize evolution means changing DNA structure...long before there were plastic straws...

 

[Bushman]

State's can create as many Laws they want.. But there is only One set of Laws we must abide by..
..Our Constitution..

Make sure you read that to the court at your sentencing...

Throw in a "I'm a Sovereign Citizen!" while you're at it.

 

[Bushman]

Patriots dont run

Are you bearing arms against the regulations? I seem to recall the "Patriots" in the Oregon standoff dropped their weapons and ran when the FBI made arrests. One got shot and killed. Others went to jail. Thanks to a certain privilege they all got off despite NUMEROUS documented felonies seen world wide on TV. Stealing cars, taking over federal buildings.

 

[Bushman]

I read what our Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Franklin, Madison, Adams wrote, & marvel at their foresight. Ever wonder the responses were when they considered breaking away from England? Ever wonder what would have happened if true Patriots hadn't answered to the call? April 19th, 1775 The shot heard around the world When the British tried to seize American guns. No different today as it was back then. Oath of Office protect the Constitution against enemies both Foreign & Domestic.

And they only went down in history as great heroes because they won. Prior to that the papers called them terrorists who were shooting at federal agents. I have a Masters degree, multiple rentals and a very high paying job. I have something to lose that most don't, and I have the sense to realize that you will either be shot and killed or sent to prison, you're not Jason Bourne or Rambo. As such I have the resources to move and continue a glorious life without dying or being raped in prison, where freedom is not illegal. I get what you are saying but I don't see you actually fighting, just posting about it here from the safety of your living room...

 

[Bushman]

OoRah

And they come with hundreds of people in armor, automatic weapons, thermal scopes and armored vehicles, with hundreds of thousands more to hunt you down anywhere you flee. But good luck with your shotguns and .22's!!

 

[Bushman]

Sorry the multi quote wasn't working, lol.

 

[Bushman]

I can stop voting, emailing,writing, donating, etc. and just give up. If that would be more beneficial to wa. gun owners. Regardless of what the odds may be, a lot of good people will be living in wa for a long time to come. Not everyone has the means to pack up and leave, nor does everyone want to. People feeling hopeless and not doing anything is a big part of the problem here. listening to how it's hopeless and everyone is just going to leave doesnt help encourage anyone to continue the fight.

I will say this, I am almost as angry with the lack of action and motivation from gun owners as I am with the people making the laws.

Gun owners should be encouraging everyone to fight, no matter where they live, no matter the odds.

Odds? I don't think some people who say stay and fight no matter the odds understand the statistical concepts here. In statistics you have an observed and expected outcome. Majority rules in voting and pro gun people here are outnumbered. It's not a matter of chance. You don't just look at 70% of people voting consistently in favor of gun laws each time and say, there's only a 70% chance of it passing. You look at the track record of observed outcomes. If there have been 5 gun votes in the last 5 years here and we lost them all, guess what, you have a 100% observed probability of gun regulations passing based on the sample size of trials. The observed probability is 100% while the expected probability is 50%. The observed probability is what matters here. And this observed probability is not a matter of random chance like flipping a coin where sometimes you end up with more heads than tails in say, 10 flips.

 

[arakboss]

@Gunflint1 Here, forward this to all your buddies--it shows precisely how they're going to play the wordsmithing game about "evil highpower sniper rifles" next.

http://healthyinfluence.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/gun-violencemessaging-guide-pdf-1.pdf

Great link. Do you have a link for similar tactics that our side has produced?

 

[arakboss]

@Gunflint1 Here, forward this to all your buddies--it shows precisely how they're going to play the wordsmithing game about "evil highpower sniper rifles" next.

http://healthyinfluence.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/gun-violencemessaging-guide-pdf-1.pdf

You can be sure these tactics and others used by the Brady and Bloomberg machines will be in full force this year in Oregon in a effort to pass gun grabbing Ballot Measures.

Who will be funding the push back against these gun grabbing Oregon Initiative Petitions this year? Typically Companies and their lobby arms would be paying to run ads against Initiative Petitions that aim to hurt their industry but I don't see that happening in this case. Hope I am wrong.

 

[arakboss]

Why is that? I love Florida women and weather much better than Vegas, but the property taxes, hurricanes and sink holes worry me...And it's not just one house that I'd be paying property taxes on. I pay 40K a year property taxes here in WA because I own rental properties....so yeah, the no state income tax is BS, real estate investors like me take it up the bubblegum here.

I heard former Gov. now Senator Rick Scott say over 500,000 people moved to Florida last year. Many of those came from New York. You have to wonder at what point Florida's quality of life will be affected in a negative way.

 

[ACO]

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Speaking only for myself :
The song :
Should I stay or should I go , comes to mind here.
Especially the lines : If I stay there will be trouble , if I go there will be double....

What is happening here in Washington , can* easily happen in other states
( *will happen , more than likely )

The choices seem to me to be :
Stay and fight here , now...
Move and fight later..

Whatever the reasoning , motivation , line of thinking , etc...
Gun owners need a far better public image and a united front if we are to have a legal future.
Andy

 

[Diamondback]

Great link. Do you have a link for similar tactics that our side has produced?

You think our side has EVER been able to get our crap together even half that well?

 

[TC64]

Vegas is the next Washington/California/Oregon/Illinois etc, when it comes to Socialist control. Have you considered Idaho or Montana?

 

[TC64]

In the long run, the courts will decide the fate of the 2A. Not your neighbor that goes duck hunting twice a year.

The courts are just another arm of the government. I think it's going to come down to millions of gun carrying Americans, LE, and the military, to step in to uphold the Constitution and it's amendments. When the current President said the swamp needs to be drained he was correct, but it can't be done by voting because the government indoctrination centers (schools) have trained generations of ignorant people. Young voters are more concerned with video games, Pod eating, Smart phones, and someone taking care of them so they don't have to work.

Rant over....please move on.

 

[leadcounsel]

Speaking only for myself :
The song :
Should I stay or should I go , comes to mind here.
Especially the lines : If I stay there will be trouble , if I go there will be double....

What is happening here in Washington , can* easily happen in other states
( *will happen , more than likely )

The choices seem to me to be :
Stay and fight here , now...
Move and fight later..

Whatever the reasoning , motivation , line of thinking , etc...
Gun owners need a far better public image and a united front if we are to have a legal future.
Andy

No. Other states that are not already infected have begun immunizations against liberals and gun control to prevent this.

Oklahoma, West Virginia, Idaho, etc. About 10-15 states have really aggressively taken pro gun measures such as total sanctuary status, castle doctrine. Anti federal gun law enforcement, constitutional carry. Etc.

Image isn't the issue. Lack of care or understanding of thd need to vote is the issue. 100% of gun owners MUST vote for the pro gun candidates in every election. Drives me nutz when Pro gun folkd won't vote for Trump, for instance! They were willing to let Hillary win! So stupid.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

No. Other states that are not already infected have begun immunizations against liberals and gun control to prevent this.

Oklahoma, West Virginia, Idaho, etc. About 10-15 states have really aggressively taken pro gun measures such as total sanctuary status, castle doctrine. Anti federal gun law enforcement, constitutional carry. Tc

And just how long will that last...?
I do not see that lasting or as continuing trend.

You and others , may of course be of a different opinion or viewpoint...
I will stick with mine.
Andy