WA county OR, notify LEO of CHL.

[Grunwald]

This is the only part I don't agree with. I have a hard time imagining a situation where someone informs an officer that he has a weapon prior to using it on that officer. It also makes the assumption that a citizen should first demonstrate he has government permission to be armed by starting out with the CHL. We need to stop training law enforcement to equate gun possession to criminal intent.

What concerns me most about BPD is that we keep swearing in rookie officers from CA that have preconceived notions about guns that are based on Nazi party ideals instead of Oregon law.

There is a video on youtube where a case in New Hampshire went before a judge and the cop told the judge "that in Rhode Island .." and the judge cut him off and said "this isn't Rhode Island".
It was great.

 

[The Heretic]

This again?

This has been discussed before here ad infinitum.

I live in WA county (just on the very literal edge of it - the county line with Yamhill is at the end of the private road I live on - about 1000 feet).

I have respect for LEOs - I used to be a federal LEO - I worked with LEOs at all levels.

In a traffic stop there is no really valid reason to up the stress level of the LEO by informing them you have a firearm unless there is a reason they will encounter the firearm during the stop.

The vast majority of traffic stops involve the stopped driver sitting still behind the wheel of their car, never moving about, not exiting the car, just giving your license and registration and insurance info to the LEO.

If this does not involve you needing to handle or expose your firearm, if your firearm is not in view and won't be in view, then there is no need to tell the LEO you have a firearm with you. The same goes for your passengers.

The situation changes if you need to expose the firearm, place it in view, handle it, etc., or the LEO asks you to get out of the vehicle or needs to search you or the vehicle. At that point it is probably best to inform the LEO you have a concealed firearm on your person or in the vehicle.

As for the LEO knowing you have a permit, yes they do - they know it the second they run your plate. But just because you have a permit doesn't mean you have a firearm on you, and just because you don't have a permit doesn't mean you don't have a gun.

Until they look at your face, they don't even know who is driving the vehicle - it could be someone else besides the registered owner (I have let my daughter borrow my car a number of times).

 

[The Courier]

A big bumper sticker that says "I AM CARRYING A LOADED FIREARM" might be a little over the top but no cop could claim he didn't suspect you we're packing. However by having that sticker you may be subject to vehicle vandalism and breakins.

 

[orygun]

I'm one that tells the officer that I have a CHL and if I have a gun or not. It's a courtesy thing, but I have no legal obligation to do so. If I get pulled over it's because I'm driving too fast and I'd just as soon not piss the cop off. Never had a problem doing this.
The last time I got pulled over was in Crook county east of Prineville. I told the Deputy that I had a gun and where it was. His response was great. "Don't shoot me, and I won't shoot you." He let me go. I was only doing 80 in a 55.... Eastern Oregon is a bit different than the Valley.

 

[orygun]

My understanding is that they are only able to see that you have applied for a CHL and not your current status as a CHL holder, but that is just repeated rumor.

And it's incorrect. I first found out from a Deputy that I had a CHL. I got pulled over for speeding on my bike. During the stop he asked me if I had a gun on me. I asked him why would he ask that and he told me that his info said I had a CHL. I got home to find it in my mail box.

 

[oli700]

In a traffic stop there is no really valid reason to up the stress level of the LEO by informing them you have a firearm unless there is a reason they will encounter the firearm during the stop.

this is the fact, anyone else doing anything different is either misinformed of the "rules" or is looking for brownie points or is a wanna be cop "hey I'm a good guy I got a gun too, need any help?".......lame. Everyone is much better off keeping their mouth shut and being courteous, answer questions honestly with yes sir, no sir. A good rule of thumb for any situation is not to divulge any information that isn't asked for

 

[The Heretic]

Everyone is much better off keeping their mouth shut and being courteous, answer questions honestly with yes sir, no sir. A good rule of thumb for any situation is not to divulge any information that isn't asked for

Exactly.

Most LEOs are good guys, but they are trained to get you to admit facts you shouldn't.

Last time I was stopped the LEO kept asking me why I did what I did (passed over a double yellow line) and my answer was "no good reason". He kept asking, trying to lead me to say I was in a hurry, etc., almost like he wanted to engage me in a debate - each time I just gave him the same answer "no good reason" and it was the truth - there wasn't a valid good reason. I was in a hurry and I had been following this guy doing 20 MPH under the limit and I got impatient and passed him where it was somewhat safe but illegal to do so.

He gave me a ticket, but apparently changed his mind or forgot and didn't file it. I got my check back in the mail informing me he never filed the ticket.

Unless I feel that the LEO will need my cooperation to catch a dangerous felon (who isn't me) or something like that, I will not volunteer info to a LEO.

It is a sad commentary on the state of affairs, but this is how the world is now - law enforcement and the judiciary will use what you say against you even if you are not guilty of breaking any laws, and even if you are guilty, you are best represented by a lawyer who will protect your rights.

 

[spookshack]

Last time I was pulled over in Washington Co., it was by the State Police. I did not notify the trooper that I had a CHL. When he approached, I had my hands palms up on the top of the steering wheel nearly pressed to the windshield. I was very polite when answering his questions and only received a warning.

I have informed and not informed LEO in the past about my CHL. Didn't really matter one way or another..... Currently, I prefer NOT to say anything more than I need to (LEO is not your friend). See link above.

 

[orygun]

this is the fact, anyone else doing anything different is either misinformed of the "rules" or is looking for brownie points or is a wanna be cop "hey I'm a good guy I got a gun too, need any help?".......lame. Everyone is much better off keeping their mouth shut and being courteous, answer questions honestly with yes sir, no sir. A good rule of thumb for any situation is not to divulge any information that isn't asked for

No, it is not fact. I have friends and family in law enforcement. A while back I polled them all because of a similar thread on here. Every one of them said that they would like to know that fact and saw no threat in a citizen telling them so.
Not everyone will share this opinion. Fortunately for me, every cop I've encountered as thanked me for letting them know.

 

[Steve M]

Ya'll need to stop getting pulled over. Around 20 years ago I got pulled over and given a verbal warning for going 22MPH, nothing since and that includes years of driving in several states and cities around the country.

 

[The Heretic]

Ya'll need to stop getting pulled over. Around 20 years ago I got pulled over and given a verbal warning for going 22MPH, nothing since and that includes years of driving in several states and cities around the country.

Cops will pull you over just because they don't like how you look, what you drive, where you drive (if you are a minority in a predominantly white neighborhood), who is with you, or, as recently illustrated back east, the fact that you have a CHL.

I was pulled over because the LEO didn't like the sticker on my helmet (one said "Capable of evading high speed pursuit" and another said "Legalize Freedom"), he dived right into debating those issues with me, berated me because I was unemployed and was riding my motorcycle on a sunny day instead of looking for a job, and so on. He let me go with no warning or ticket - after 30 minutes.

There are LEOs that have a grudge against people who look like their FIL or MIL or their father who beat them, their good for nothing BIL/SIL, you name it, they don't really need a reason to pull you over - they will invent one, and if you think they don't, then I have some swampland you might be interested in purchasing.

 

[Koda]

There is a lot of good intentions in disclosing but dont assume that it will always go over well, not all officers are supportive of lawful carry.

What I want to know is what are the officers doing to respect the privacy of the CHL holder when they have passengers in the vehicle? Really that is what we should be feeding back to the sheriffs office. Defeats the whole purpose of "CHL" when your asked if you have your firearm on you.

 

[slimmer13]

No, it is not fact. I have friends and family in law enforcement. A while back I polled them all because of a similar thread on here. Every one of them said that they would like to know that fact and saw no threat in a citizen telling them so.
Not everyone will share this opinion. Fortunately for me, every cop I've encountered as thanked me for letting them know.

Whether I am armed has as much to do with a traffic stop as whether he is armed. His personal feelings on the matter are irrelevant. Luckly we are not subject to what most LEO's would "like to know".

Do trained MMA fighters inform as such?

He either already knows or he doesn't. If he knows and asks then tell the truth, if he knows and doesn't ask or doesn't know, get your ticket and be on your way.

 

[orygun]

Whether I am armed has as much to do with a traffic stop as whether he is armed. His personal feelings on the matter are irrelevant. Luckly we are not subject to what most LEO's would "like to know".

Do trained MMA fighters inform as such?

He either already knows or he doesn't. If he knows and asks then tell the truth, if he knows and doesn't ask or doesn't know, get your ticket and be on your way.

This is mostly true. It's always a personal choice as to how you handle any given situation. He'll know if you have a CHL, but not if you have a gun at that time. It's your choice to either give that info or not.
All I was stating was that is is not a fact that the officer's stress level will rise because you told him you're packing. Also, if it was a fact that it's going to cause a problem, then WA Co wouldn't have sent this news letter out.
As a side note, one of the friends I asked about this is a county sheriff. He's a defender of the Constitution and everything it stands for. He told me that I can tell the officer that it's none of his business if asked about having a gun on my person at that time, but also said he sees no threat to the officer if I volunteered that info.
Like Heretic said in an earlier post, "To each their own".

 

[orygun]

What I want to know is what are the officers doing to respect the privacy of the CHL holder when they have passengers in the vehicle? Really that is what we should be feeding back to the sheriffs office. Defeats the whole purpose of "CHL" when your asked if you have your firearm on you.

That is an interesting position. Not one I would consider because I'm likely only driving a car with friends and family in it, but still a good point.

 

[pchewn]

I went through the HASSLE and COST and FINGERPRINTING and whatnot to get a CHL. I sure as heck am now going to CONCEAL my gun from the police, and that includes not telling them about it. After all, it is not a "Conceal from everyone except the police" permit.

It makes no sense at all for the exact same agency that issued me the concealed permit now insists that I REVEAL whether or not I am carrying!

 

[The Heretic]

There is a lot of good intentions in disclosing but dont assume that it will always go over well, not all officers are supportive of lawful carry.

Agreed. LEOs are selected from the same pool of people as any other job, and the number of people who are anti-gun (at least until convinced otherwise) is, IMO, increasing. There is also the fact that some people going into LE work because they want the authority position.



I have met and even worked with a few that were like that.

What I want to know is what are the officers doing to respect the privacy of the CHL holder when they have passengers in the vehicle? Really that is what we should be feeding back to the sheriffs office. Defeats the whole purpose of "CHL" when your asked if you have your firearm on you.

Interesting issue.

Suppose I were to go with my boss and/or co-workers to lunch and it was my turn to drive there.

Of the people I work with, I think only one is possibly pro-gun, others are probably anti-gun. Some of these people have the responsibility to give feedback on my workplace performance.

Over the years I have met more than one person who used such a position/responsibility to damage coworkers reputations due to a grudge held with regards to any number of things ranging from religion to politics. I saw one employer let go two guys who sometimes talked about guns at work.

As I told a co-worker the other day when he brought up religious beliefs, there are at least four things you don't talk about at work or for that matter with co-workers:

Politics
Religion
Sex
Salary/wages (at least not specifics)

 

[deen_ad]

What concerns me most about BPD is that we keep swearing in rookie officers from CA that have preconceived notions about guns that are based on Nazi party ideals instead of Oregon law.

VPD just hired a new chief from CA. I hope he doesn't bring his anti-gun attitude with him!



Deen
NRA Life Member, Benefactor Level
"Defender of Freedom" award
NRA Recruiter
Second Amendment Foundation Member
Washington Arms Collectors Member
Arms Collectors of SW Washington Member

"Having a gun is like a parachute, if you need one and don't have it you may never need it again"

 

[deen_ad]

Agreed. LEOs are selected from the same pool of people as any other job, and the number of people who are anti-gun (at least until convinced otherwise) is, IMO, increasing. There is also the fact that some people going into LE work because they want the authority position.

You might want to look at the number of new owners and those that get their concealed permits for your REAL answer. One state had more people sign up for new permits than signed up for Oblammer care.


Deen
NRA Life Member, Benefactor Level
"Defender of Freedom" award
NRA Recruiter
Second Amendment Foundation Member
Washington Arms Collectors Member
Arms Collectors of SW Washington Member

"Having a gun is like a parachute, if you need one and don't have it you may never need it again"

 

[Mongo1]

I think any cop that is from calif should have to go through training about gun laws in the North West but would prefer they not be hired at all.