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Hey Gang. Went to the range today with a couple of our .45s. Been shooting 230gr fmj or jhp seems like forever. I bought some Privi Partisan 45acp in 185gr just for grins and giggles along with some Speer Gold dot jhp also in 185gr. I had been doing some reading on using 185gr hp for defense ammo. Print said it was "faster" in the mid to upper 900s. Recoil was reportedly supposed to be somewhat lighter as well. Wifey was shooting her Desert Eagle Gov't and I was using my Sig p220. I will preface the rest of this post with the caveat of don't believe everything you read. Recoil? Meh. Unless one is very recoil sensitive neither of us could tell any difference in recoil. We started off with a mag of good old 230gr fmj just for comparison's sake. The recoil from both weights of slugs felt the same to each of us. Recoil felt reduction? Not today. Point of aim 5-7 yards- same. The interesting thing was that wifey's 1911 has been FLAWLESS through over 1000 rounds of 230fmj/jhp. Today she had her very first FTFs and FTEs ever with this firearm. This happened with the Privi Partisan ammo. Something about those rounds the Desert Eagle did not like. At one point she told me "Your reloads are way better than this stuff!" I just had to laugh. She's honest that way. The Speer was, as expected, letter perfect in both weapons. Even in 185gr jhp Speer will remain my primary self defense ammo. Personally still prefer the 230 gr offerings from Speer. OK that's it. Just one couple's recent experience with some new ammo. I will only carry ammo that is proven 100% trustworthy using the Pop's test- like we did today. Hope every one else had a good day too. Relaxing after dinner now. Sigh. Life is good.
 
I'd like to recommend you try the Liberty Ammunition in .45ACP which is a 78gr. Copper Bullet rated at 1900fps out of a 5" tube. You might be surprised.
 
A few years back a friend wanted to trade Hornaday 185 gr XTP's for my cast bullets. He gave me close to 1000 of them. I loaded them to about 850 fps, and my wife loved them. I'm like you, they did not seem special to me, But if she likes them what do I care. She now has what amounts to a lifetime supply of them to use as SD ammo! You just never know till you try them! DR
 
Right now I'm still rolling with the same rounds most Puget Sound LE used when I was in college, Speer 23966 or when I can get it 53966 (230-gr. Gold Dot JHP, difference is 20 or 50 rounds in the box)--in fact, the exact same rounds that went into those mags fifteen years ago. LOL I have some Federal HST's also in 230gr and would have followed local LE in the transition to HST, except like a dumbass I forgot to keep my lot number info... so the HST's and deadstock Dots will be burned on my next qual, replaced with fresh HST.
 
Interesting and thoughtful thread. Thanks all. Kinda looks like it is boiling back down somewhat to fast vs slower rounds and they all work. I have shared my old Grand daddy's take on the whole issue at least once before. "Boy, you want to get run over by a Mack truck going 50 or a sports car doing 70? They both will kill ya". I continue to like the defensive Speer rounds in 230 and [now] in 185 grains. Hornady Critical Defense also performs perfectly in our 45s. I don't buy much of any one of them as they are all for carry load out. Load, carry, shoot, buy more...we all know the cycle with high dollar defense ammo. Fun stuff!
 
Interesting and thoughtful thread. Thanks all. Kinda looks like it is boiling back down somewhat to fast vs slower rounds and they all work. I have shared my old Grand daddy's take on the whole issue at least once before. "Boy, you want to get run over by a Mack truck going 50 or a sports car doing 70? They both will kill ya". I continue to like the defensive Speer rounds in 230 and [now] in 185 grains. Hornady Critical Defense also performs perfectly in our 45s. I don't buy much of any one of them as they are all for carry load out. Load, carry, shoot, buy more...we all know the cycle with high dollar defense ammo. Fun stuff!

I am NOT trying to revive a war that has gone on since before Algore ran the wires for the net but, this is why I still like the .45. Makes a nice large hole no matter what.:)
Seriously though one thing I often think of is real shooting these days. So many of them are caught on tape now to see. Drugs are what concern me. The latest is an LEO shoot in CA that soon went national. LEO is shooting this guy at VERY close range and he is not going down. He had grabbed something off the LEO's belt which lead to the shoot. He does not drop what he has in his hand until he finally goes down at like the 7th hit. All I could think of watching this is if that had been a gun in his hand, could he have kept squeezing the trigger? No idea what caliber or ammo the LEO was using. It does make me carry Speer +P GDHP's in my 9's though. Watching something like that all I can think of is if I had one of my "mouse guns" I would have to just hope it slowed him down long enough for me to at least keep him from shooting me. The drugged up zombies seem to keep going after they are dead and just don't know it.
 
I hear you Alex1401. Perhaps we can all agree on the two points you made so cogently. First an .45acp round will always be at least .45 size going in and coming out. That's one big hole! It won't shrink. Secondly, most crazed drug fueled BGs will take more than one round to stop their immediate threat. For me I will always defer to the 45 for self defense. Loves my 9s. They have a place. The .45acp has my heart.
 
I have a 50 round box of 45 acp 230 grain HST. Even the standard velocity stuff expands well. I also picked up a box of .380 HST micro for the LCP. It shows I care for her. And a big upgrade from the ball ammo. I've been watching for the 9mm hst micro. The stuff gets high marks for penetration and expansion.

The .45 expanded to around .85" and 14" of penetration in a heavy cloth, ballistic gel test. :)

1-45acp230JHPp45hst2sFedPrem-2.jpg
 
Hard to go wrong with gold dot or HST.
I like them both. My thoughts are in the realm of buy some ammunition and test it out of your pistol. Stick with the brands that have been making quality ammunition for years. Why? It just works.

Now truthfully my thoughts about caliber is up to the person that is going to be pulling the trigger. If you want .45 and shoot it well, then do so. If you want 9 mm and shoot it well, so be it. Just pick something and then train with it and carry it!
Remember that a pistol "almost" NEVER stops the threat in just a couple of shots.

Not picking on 45 acp, I love the round, but just read this article.

The Lessons Of Tim Gramins | American Handgunner

What I got from the article is that regardless of the caliber you use it is ALWAYS about shot placement!
;)
 
Something THAT pretty for (obviously) professional marketing photography was probably shot into water or a special recipe of large dimensional sized ballistics gel.
I used to do product photography. I gotta tell you it would be hell to convince a model to let you shoot them five times and dig out the bullets and wash them all nice for a nice picture like that. I think you're right.
 

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