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Toomey/Manchin Bill Worse Than It Appears

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by TheHumungus, Apr 15, 2013.

  1. TheHumungus

    TheHumungus Portland Active Member

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  2. BSG 75

    BSG 75 Oregon Well-Known Member

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    All four senators from Oregon and Washington are liberal Democrats. Don't waste your time.
     
  3. TheHumungus

    TheHumungus Portland Active Member

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    This attitude is why the liberal fascists are winning. Don't roll over and play dead. Fight!

    Enough pressure can be put on them causing them not to act.
     
    jefe, kumabear17, rocky3 and 3 others like this.
  4. twoclones

    twoclones Tri-Cities, WA Well-Known Member

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    It's NEVER a waste of time to remind your Legislators that you care about your rights. This ^ kind of apathy looses battles.
     
    kumabear17, mosinguy1, corvus and 3 others like this.
  5. PiratePast40

    PiratePast40 Willamette Valley Well-Known Member

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    If you don't let them know how you feel, the next words out of their mouths will be that since they didn't hear any objections, all of the voters must be for it.
     
    kumabear17 and (deleted member) like this.
  6. bill97024

    bill97024 Oregon Member

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    ^^^ What they said. Yes, Oregon and Washington have liberal idiots for representation presently, but they still need to know that they are not representing their constituents when they vote to proceed with legislation that will infringe on our 2A rights, that they are not abiding by the oath they took to defend the constitution of their state and country, and that they are being watched by people who vote. They work for us, not the other way around and they need to hear about it when we are not happy with how they are representing us. I've gotten nothing but patronizing replies from Wyden and Merkley, but I still email them weekly at least and let them know that come election time the decisions they are making today will affect my decision regarding who to vote for to represent me. Keep calling, keep writing, keep the pressure on your congresscritters. Now is not the time to give up, but to redouble our efforts to ensure nothing gets through congress. Stay strong brothers and sisters.
     
    kumabear17 and (deleted member) like this.
  7. BSG 75

    BSG 75 Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Email all you want. With that particular bill, and those particular senators, it's a waste of time. They are all going to vote yes. It's like emailing Sen. Dianne Feinstein or Ginny Burdick thinking you are going to influence their views on "assault weapons". If you get a response, post it here. It will be the usual form letter about how they "respect the Second Amendment" but how they also support "reasonable" measures to keep criminals and the mentally ill from getting guns. But if it makes you feel better, knock yourselves out.

    Don't lecture me about apathy. I went down to the capitol on April 5 to testify at the committee hearing on four gun control bills, but I didn't make the cut. I submitted written testimony and emailed senators. Sen Prozanski responded to my email yesterday and I emailed him and three other senators on the Oregon Senate Judiciary last night about SB 700. Sen. Roblan's office already replied this morning. Put your efforts where they have at least a chance of making a difference.

    They read the polls showing 90% support for universal background checks. They think they are representing their constituents.
     
  8. Don H

    Don H Oregon Well-Known Member

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  9. Vantage

    Vantage Pacific Standard Time Active Member

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  10. Dave Workman

    Dave Workman Western Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Well, that's not necessarily the right approach.
    E-mail and call...let them know there are gun people out there watching them. Now the thing is, if Chuckie hates this bill, there's GOT to be something in it to love....

    Schumer goes nuts over alternative gun measure

    Schumer goes nuts over alternative gun measure - Seattle gun rights | Examiner.com
     
  11. Don H

    Don H Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Did you listen to the interview? Are you saying that Alan Gottlieb is wrong? I'm going to read the bill tonight but Mr. Gottlieb is a good guy so my gut feeling is to believe him. Anyway, I'll read the bill for myself tonight. Thanks.
     
  12. gcban

    gcban Tukwila, WA Active Member

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    I read the article from the Virginia Citizens Defense League and they made an error in my opinion. They state:

    “2. If you say you have a gun for sale and either list it on the internet or post something about it in a “publication,” then the gun MUST be sold through a dealer at that point. If the buyer posts in either place that he is looking for a gun, the gun he purchases will also require a background check. The only way to sell a gun to a non-family member is if you are NOT at a gun show and never make mention of wanting to sell the gun on the internet or in any kind of publication. Basically, you would have to do it by word of mouth only. Good luck with that! What are you going to do – walk down a street and ask everyone you pass if they want to buy a gun from you?”

    That is incorrect. In the Toomey-Manchin Bill:

    SEC 122 – FIREARMS TRANSFERS:

    Go to line item (4). Paragraph (1) (A&B) States that if you advertise to buy or sell on the internet or any other medium OR sell or buy at a gun show than a NICS check must be done.

    This is the main part:

    Paragraph (2) then states that Paragraph 1 (above) DOES NOT APPLY if the transfer is done thru an FFL as if the weapon was a part of their own inventory (NICS or valid CCW permit would be permitted as check), OR the transaction is done by private parties in their home state as long as your state allows private sales, as most do. Based on that language, for forums like this one it would be business as usual for private transactions.

    That’s the way it reads as published now. I am against any change but my gut feeling tells me that this version is going to squeak by the Senate and maybe even the house if there are enough good pro gun riders (amendments) that following along. That way the House, The Senate and the divider and chief can all say they did something. Just my 2 cents. -G
     
  13. twoclones

    twoclones Tri-Cities, WA Well-Known Member

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    I think that supporting the Toomey-Manchin Bill just might be the best way to get the other bills defeated. And I wouldn't mind being able to buy a handgun while out of state...
     
  14. Botte Hork

    Botte Hork Camas WA Well-Known Member

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    I like Gottlieb and his SAF. I don't really understand why there is the need for him to have multiple organizations doing pretty much the same thing (SAF, CCRKBA, keepandbeararms.com) with pretty much the same people (Gottlieb, Tartaro, Versnel and our own Dave Workman).

    Don't get me wrong, I'm a life member of SAF and I think they do good work, but I'm getting the idea more and more it's a lot of fog by the same people.
     
  15. Don H

    Don H Oregon Well-Known Member

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    The Common Sense Gun Lobby Citizens Committee For The Right To Keep And Bear Arms
     
  16. Dave Workman

    Dave Workman Western Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Easy to explain. (and I'll probably get the tax statuses bass akwards..)

    SAF is a 501 C3 tax exempt foundation that does strictly educational and legal work. NO LOBBYING, no political campaigning or endorsements...NOTHING legislative.

    CCRKBA is a 501 C4 that does grassroots organizing and activities, takes positions on issues, works with politicians, works on issues... DOES NOT do lawsuits, except on rare occasions like the Seattle parks gun ban.

    They have clearly divided responsibilities and missions.
     
  17. Botte Hork

    Botte Hork Camas WA Well-Known Member

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    Fair enough, thank you Dave!

    It was a little confusing to see the different groups with pretty much the same folks (and the lovely 1993-ish websites that SAF and keepandbeararms.com have ;)) and gave me a bit of a 'smoke & mirrors' taste in the mouth. This makes sense, thanks again. And keep up the good work! I felt better sending money towards SAF than throwing it onto the lavish big NRA pile. My tax return next year will agree. ;)
     
  18. quneur

    quneur Mukilteo, Wa Member

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    The NRA should sponsor a program for FFL record storage. For a small monthly fee for storage on their system, the FFL could send all their records to the NRA electronically. So, if the ATF wants to see the FFL records, let the NRA deal with them.
     
  19. Diamondback

    Diamondback A cold, wet green Hell Well-Known Member

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    Easy way to explain SAF/CCRKBA is they're kind of like NRA (weapons safety ed) versus NRA-ILA (the political arm, separately chartered and separate tax status). That a good comparison, Dave?
     
  20. tiggers97

    tiggers97 United States Well-Known Member

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