time for a divorce

[scrappydoo]

what the crap is "left libertarianism?" left and libertarianism are opposites, according to the political spectrum i was taught.

I'll post a better definition when I get home from work. But the gist of it is we're left on social issues, libertarian on just about everything else.

 

[Trlsmn]

I stopped reading after "Dear American liberals, leftists, social progressives, socialists, Marxists, and Obama supporters, et. al." Threads like this do nothing but promotes an attitude that divides us as Americans. It poisons the well to the point that our politicians can't debate or govern. It does nothing but cause the political gridlock like we've had in the last few years.

You need both sides to represent the various views of ALL of us. Everyone needs an advocate and one party can't represent everyone's interests. It would ruin this country if business had all the power, just like it'd ruin this country if labor had all the power. Compromise is such a derogatory word on this forum but it's the closest we can get to fairness for everyone.

You guys take your hate of liberals to the extreme. Left Libertarianism is becoming more common and many of us are firearms enthusiasts. But we can't hang out on this forum without being called libtard or some other derogatory term. How many members has this site lost because of this vitriol and why is such disrespect allowed here? This site is NWFirearms not NWExtremeConservatism.

I stopped reading your post after:

"I stopped reading after"

 

[Trlsmn]

what the crap is "left libertarianism?" left and libertarianism are opposites, according to the political spectrum i was taught.

+1 Liberalism and Libertarianism are very different ideologies.

I'll post a better definition when I get home from work. But the gist of it is we're left on social issues, libertarian on just about everything else.

Socialism is totally opposite of what Libertarians are all about.

 

[The B]

I'll post a better definition when I get home from work. But the gist of it is we're left on social issues, libertarian on just about everything else.

there's a large body of Americans who are politically active and refer to themselves as "left" or "liberal," who are, in fact, actually far-right in political thought. it's astonishing, i know- but you're probably not the least bit "left," dude.

what do you think libertarian is? it's ultra LIBERAL in the traditional sense of the word- LIBERTY... individual, personal liberty. nothing else is more important- including leftist legislation. the left is the exact opposite, believing in collectivism- they love to pretend they're for "liberty," but are in fact only for mass conformity to leftist ideals under the guise of utilitarianism (which is an ethical standard any real liberal should be utterly opposed to anyway).

to be left is to be pro-government, pro-regulation, pro-LAW. to be right is to be pro-individual liberty, anti-big government, anti-regulation. you cannot be left and liberal (again, using the traditional sense of the word)- they're polar opposites. if self-professed "liberals" realized this, they'd gasp in horror, drop their lattes, and stop voting for democrats.

 

[Trlsmn]

there's a large body of Americans who are politically active and refer to themselves as "left" or "liberal," who are, in fact, actually far-right in political thought. it's astonishing, i know- but you're probably not the least bit "left," dude.

what do you think libertarian is? it's ultra LIBERAL in the traditional sense of the word- LIBERTY... individual, personal liberty. nothing else is more important- including leftist legislation. the left is the exact opposite, believing in collectivism- they love to pretend they're for "liberty," but are in fact only for mass conformity to leftist ideals under the guise of utilitarianism (which is an ethical standard any real liberal should be utterly opposed to anyway).

to be left is to be pro-government, pro-regulation, pro-LAW. to be right is to be pro-individual liberty, anti-big government, anti-regulation. you cannot be left and liberal (again, using the traditional sense of the word)- they're polar opposites. if self-professed "liberals" realized this, they'd gasp in horror, drop their lattes, and stop voting for democrats.

Exactly! that's why I like to say that the words "Liberal" and "Progressive" are hollow shells that have no relevance to their actual original meaning.

 

[Doubletap]

Let's see...I think it started when Madeline Murray O'Hare complained that she didn't want any prayer in our schools, and we said OK.

Then someone said you had better not read the Bible in school -- the Bible that says thou shalt not kill, thou shalt not steal, and love your neighbor as yourself. And we said, OK.

Dr. Benjamin Spock said we shouldn't spank our children when they misbehave because their little personalities would be warped and we might damage their self-esteem. And we said, an expert should know what he's talking about so we won't spank them anymore. Then someone said that teachers and principals better not discipline our children when they misbehave.

And the school administrators said no faculty member in this school better touch a student when they misbehave because we don't want any bad publicity, and we surely don't want to be sued. And we accepted their reasoning.

Then someone said, let's let our daughters have abortions if they want, and they won't even have to tell their parents, after all, it's only a human life. And we said, Wow, no more personal responsibility, that's a grand idea!

Then some wise school board member said, since boys will be boys and they are going to "do it" anyway, let's give our sons all the condoms they want, so they can have all the "fun" they desire, and we won't have to tell their parents they got them at school. And we said, that's another great idea!

And then some of our top elected officials said that it doesn't matter what we do in private as long as we do our jobs. And agreeing with them, we said it doesn't matter to me what anyone, including the President, does in private as long as I have a job and cable TV.

And the entertainment industry said, let's make TV shows and movies that promote homosexuality, profanity, violence, and illicit sex. And let's record music that encourages rape, drugs, murder, suicide, and satanic themes. And we said it's just entertainment, it has no adverse effect, and nobody takes it seriously anyway, so go right ahead.

We sit by, and watch as those who don't like the values this country was founded on take to the streets, spewing their ignorance, and demanding acceptance of their abhorrent lifestyles, and "progressive" agendas. We allow insanity like political correctness to be shoved down our throats, afraid to call " wrong " by it's true name, more concerned with "offending" someone, than standing up for what we know is "right".

And now we're asking ourselves why our children have no conscience, why they don't know right from wrong, and why it doesn't bother them to kill strangers, their classmates, and themselves.

Probably, if we think about it long and hard enough, we can figure it out. I think it has a great deal to do with... "We reap what we sow".

 

[scrappydoo]

there's a large body of Americans who are politically active and refer to themselves as "left" or "liberal," who are, in fact, actually far-right in political thought. it's astonishing, i know- but you're probably not the least bit "left," dude.

what do you think libertarian is? it's ultra LIBERAL in the traditional sense of the word- LIBERTY... individual, personal liberty. nothing else is more important- including leftist legislation. the left is the exact opposite, believing in collectivism- they love to pretend they're for "liberty," but are in fact only for mass conformity to leftist ideals under the guise of utilitarianism (which is an ethical standard any real liberal should be utterly opposed to anyway).

to be left is to be pro-government, pro-regulation, pro-LAW. to be right is to be pro-individual liberty, anti-big government, anti-regulation. you cannot be left and liberal (again, using the traditional sense of the word)- they're polar opposites. if self-professed "liberals" realized this, they'd gasp in horror, drop their lattes, and stop voting for democrats.

Your definition of liberalism is the classical liberal definition and hasn't been prominent since before the Great Depression. You know full well that liberal today refers to modern liberalism (or social liberalism), is different from classical liberalism, and differs from that belief by including the concept of social justice.

Even your definition of libertarian is one-sided and only includes the minarchist aspect of this broader term. Libertarianism includes and is part of many other philosophies other than just your singular definition. Libertariansim has heavy influences from anarchism and can be taken to that extreme, or you have the other end of the spectrum with libertarian socialism. Your definition is very close to anarchy, and without further clarification would be very difficult to defend against that charge.

In fact, differentiating between libertarianism and anarchism in the context of taxes will always introduce a social aspect as a defense. So Trlsmn's post that "Liberalism and Libertarianism are very different ideologies" (and his inference that they aren't compatible) invalidates libertarianism itself because it can not be distinguished from anarchism without also validating social liberalism.

 

[Grunwald]

what the crap is "left libertarianism?" left and libertarianism are opposites, according to the political spectrum i was taught.

Today, the word liberal is used or misused 180 degrees from its true meaning. The root of the word is liberty - freedom from government and corporate interference. None of the people that the conservatives are calling liberal are liberal. Most who call themselves liberal aren't as well.

As to this divorce, I want my own option. I want the scientists, don't want religion. I want to use natural resources, including energy - while researching new technology and switch when it makes sense. I want to have the military, but use it only for home defense and not as mercenaries for who knows whose interests. I want cops that ensure public safety not enforcement for idiotic rules that a bunch of lame brain politicians came up with to fleece the general public. I want government cut down to a minimal size and most of the regulations gone. I want corporate laws rewritten so that there is no such thing as a corporate shield. You own shares in a corporation and it screws me, I am entitled to any of your assets to get justice. I want the borders protected, and I don't want to hear "press one for English" when I call someone within the US. Lean English or go back to hence you came (I came from another country and learned. Are these people more special than I?) (see I even learned that it is "more special than I" and not "me").
Of course, if the idiots in Washington DC would just follow the US Constitution, we would not be having these discussions.

 

[Trlsmn]

Today, the word liberal is used or misused 180% from its true meaning.

I'm going totally off topic here. If you want to make a degree symbol; here is how it's done within Microsoft Windows:

Hold down the ALT key and type 248 on the numeric pad, then release the ALT key.

180°

That is all.

 

[MA Duce]

It is exactly this type of us vs them mentality that has this country in gridlock. I say take everyone with THAT mindset and boot them, and keep the rational minds who understand that only by working together can this union survive. (OTBW #7 and #9 are mutually exclusive. The corporations are run by the greedy bailout CEOs and Wall Street manipulators.)

 

[Father of four]

"22. Would you agree to this? If so, please pass it along to other
like-minded liberal and conservative patriots and if you do not agree, just hit delete. In the spirit of friendly parting, I'll bet you answer which one of us will need whose help in 15 years."

Yes! Sign me up!

 

[Smoke It]

Yeah, but all of the Wall Street bankers are Republicans, they should go with the "conservatives" All of the welfare fraud due to unfunded verification and investigation is just peanuts compared with what those Republicans stole...........................elsullo

you want to follow the money well start now and you'll see who stole the money lets start with 1.3 trillion stimulus this was just a pay off for everyone who voted for that crook B hussain O
Not to mention fanny and freddy another 1.5 trillion wake up elsullo

 

[Just Jim]

Here Comes 2008 Again in [Market-Ticker]

jj

 

[Just Jim]

I stopped reading after "Dear American liberals, leftists, social progressives, socialists, Marxists, and Obama supporters, et. al." Threads like this do nothing but promotes an attitude that divides us as Americans. It poisons the well to the point that our politicians can't debate or govern. It does nothing but cause the political gridlock like we've had in the last few years.

You need both sides to represent the various views of ALL of us. Everyone needs an advocate and one party can't represent everyone's interests. It would ruin this country if business had all the power, just like it'd ruin this country if labor had all the power. Compromise is such a derogatory word on this forum but it's the closest we can get to fairness for everyone.

You guys take your hate of liberals to the extreme. Left Libertarianism is becoming more common and many of us are firearms enthusiasts. But we can't hang out on this forum without being called libtard or some other derogatory term. How many members has this site lost because of this vitriol and why is such disrespect allowed here? This site is NWFirearms not NWExtremeConservatism.

Politics isn't for those with a sensitve nature

jj

 

[Doubletap]

 

[sprocket3]

You can have my subaru when you pry it from my cold dead hands.

Yeah.. I just got a new Outback and like getting 30 MPG instead of 14 mpg to run up to the woods. It's cut my gas bill in half and drives better on the highway.