Three pistols out to 205 yards found out that's beyond pistol range 🤪

[sagia308]

Well at least the rough Rider still look like the best grouping see most of the hits and one big hit for the 40 cal

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[Pandaz3]

Well heck his windage was off!

 

[OldBroad44]

Some of the old time revolver shooters could do those shots. But you were talking good eyes, big front sights, and knowing exactly how much holdover to use with the specific load at various distances. Hold over is often not possible with SD semi autos because the front sight isn't big enough. Instead they the shooter has to correct for bullet drop by aiming higher. Thats a less precise approach than aiming directly at target but holding the front sight up a bit over the back.

I played with hold over at close distances, shooting at tiny targets, where it also matters. So lets suppose you put up a paper plate with the targets being magic marker rings that are dime size. Fancy its the brain of a big rattlesnake in your campground, and you wouldn't usually shoot a snake, but if you leave this one you might find it on top of your sleeping bag at night to keep warm. And a rattlesnake isn't your favorite choice as a bed mate. So even though you usually walk politely around poisonous snakes on the trail, in this situation you are thinking in terms of a dangerous campground vs a nice rattlesnake stew. So where do you shoot in order to hit the center of the rattlesnake brain (tiny ring) at distances of five, ten, fifteen, and twenty feet?

With the 6" revolvers I ordinarily carry in the woods, with the loads I usually carry, if I use an ordinary sight picture, at point blank range the bullet will be too low by about an inch, because the sights are about an inch above the bore. And the bullet will be too low to hit the snake brain reliably at 5 feet and 10 feet and maybe at 15 feet too. So, aiming at the center of the ring, I hold half the front sight above the back sight at 5'. 1/4 the front sight at ten feet, 1/8 of the front sight at 15 feet, "A smidge" at 20 feet, and beyond that right on.

Its easy to learn to do this sort of holdover automatically.

 

[Pandaz3]

I can use that a bit with a semi auto, but you are right my 6'" GP-100 357 works better.

Kind of like using 'Buckhorn' sights on a rifle.

 

[OldBroad44]

I can use that a bit with a semi auto, but you are right my 6'" GP-100 357 works better.

Kind of like using 'Buckhorn' sights on a rifle.

If I ever pick up a high capacity plastic wonder, it might be a CZ P07 Suppressor Ready. The very high front sight should make it possible to do holdover.

 

[Diamondback]

Since I'm already looking at Suppressor Height sights for a 1911 build I'm revising the pencil-out on (less for a can than for Co-Witness with a red dot) this makes me wonder if an SH sight is tall enough to incorporate some holdover indicators by thinning the sight near the top and fattening it at bottom.

As for 200 yd with pistol, the Mk 18 and Midwest ASDW would like a word...

 

[OldBroad44]

If I ever needed to challenge a good handgun shooter to a shooting contest of my choice, I think I would set up tiny targets at variable distances between five and fifteen feet, shot in an order that did not make it easy to learn to correct. Like three shots at 5, 15, and 10, one shot per target, in that order. I'd be figuring that many people never practice at those ranges. And those who shoot exclusively at ranges might never have fired at anything that close.

 

[oremike]

If I ever needed to challenge a good handgun shooter to a shooting contest of my choice, I think I would set up tiny targets at variable distances between five and fifteen feet, shot in an order that did not make it easy to learn to correct. Like three shots at 5, 15, and 10, one shot per target, in that order. I'd be figuring that many people never practice at those ranges. And those who shoot exclusively at ranges might never have fired at anything that close.

I'm in, win or lose, I like gun games.

 

[OldBroad44]

Since I'm already looking at Suppressor Height sights for a 1911 build I'm revising the pencil-out on (less for a can than for Co-Witness with a red dot) this makes me wonder if an SH sight is tall enough to incorporate some holdover indicators by thinning the sight near the top and fattening it at bottom.

As for 200 yd with pistol, the Mk 18 and Midwest ASDW would like a word...

I think thinning the top half of the sight by filing just a bit off both sides would work great. Our eyes can determine half very easily and accurately. But 1/4 or less is much harder. Maybe you could even file off the top quarter a little more so you would have two indicators.

When I modify sightS I reblack them with magic marker.

 

[Diamondback]

I think thinning the top half of the sight by filing just a bit off both sides would work great. Our eyes can determine half very easily and accurately. But 1/4 or less is much harder. Maybe you could even file off the top quarter a little more so you would have two indicators.

Good point, though *my* eyes aren't that good LOL. Uncorrected, standing at the road end of a Handicap Parking space I can't even read the sign a carlength in front of me. I was thinking "steps" at 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 height, actually.

 

[oremike]

I think thinning the top half of the sight by filing just a bit off both sides would work great. Our eyes can determine half very easily and accurately. But 1/4 or less is much harder. Maybe you could even file off the top quarter a little more so you would have two indicators.

When I modify sightS I reblack them with magic marker.

I have only a couple handguns with fixed sights. Most have adjustable target type sights.

 

[OldBroad44]

Good point, though *my* eyes aren't that good LOL. Uncorrected, standing at the road end of a Handicap Parking space I can't even read the sign a carlength in front of me. I was thinking "steps" at 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4 height, actuall

Its your corrected vision that matters.

Figure one change in sight thickness at the half way point. For my six inch revolvers, I would put that indicator on a target at five feet. Practically speaking, I'm unlikely to shoot at anything closer than that using the sights at all. So I wouldn't need an indicator on the lower half of the sight. Its very easy for our eyes to evaluate half . but anything else is harder. So that one indicator would allow us to much more accurate do both 1/2 and 1/4 holdovers. And an additional indicator that marked the top 1/4 of the sight, if workable, would allow us to very accurately do 1/2, 1/4, and 1/8 holdovers. And do more accurate extrapolations in between.

However, I'd suggest you figure out where the holdovers are before altering the sights. That info might suggest a different place for your indicator. Holdover for short distances is actually a correction for the fact that the bore is below the line of sights. But the bore of a 1911 is closer to the line if sights than for a revolver, isn't it? However, the loopy trajectory of the 45 could mean that being able to do holdover at even modest distances could extent the range a good bit.

 

[Koda]

not certain why anyone would ever need to shoot a self defense pistol out to 200yds?, but the bigger question I have is if @sagia308 has ever participated in his own posts here?

 

[Diamondback]

Consider that the concept is a 7" Longslide, 7.5" threaded barrel if I can find one, and the taller sights need to work through an RMR, Acro or similar. There's no alteration here because the base gun is only a "paper design" not even built yet--I'm trying to optimize this thing as far as I can before I even start ordering parts. Granted, a highpower thunderboomer like a Super or a .450 SMC might have a different trajectory than their cooler-loaded parent cartridge... not to mention switching between the hot stuff and regular ACP.

Then again, this is going to be my first built-from-scratch project that's not an AR... and either a Longslide OR a Super are challenging enough to do for pros, combining both into a First Build could be a bridge too far.

 

[OldBroad44]

All my revolvers have adjustable sights. Yes, people with fixed sight guns may also need to do holdover to correct for sights that don't fit the load. However I'm talking about sights adjusted to be dead on at 50 yards. And holdover is needed for distances much beyond 50 yards to correct for bullet drop. Or at very short distances when shooting at tiny things to correct for the fact that the sights are higher than the bore axis.

 

[OldBroad44]

not certain why anyone would ever need to shoot a self defense pistol out to 200yds?, but the bigger question I have is if @sagia308 has ever participated in his own posts here?

SD is not the only purpose of a handgun, even those handguns for which that is the primary purpose. However SD scenarios at long distances are possible. What if you are 200 yards away and someone or some group starts shooting at you, and a handgun is all you have? Might be nice to know its 200 yard capability if it has any.

 

[Koda]

SD is not the only purpose of a handgun, even those handguns for which that is the primary purpose. However SD scenarios at long distances are possible. What if you are 200 yards away and someone or some group starts shooting at you, and a handgun is all you have? Might be nice to know its 200 yard capability if it has any.

It is for a pistol designed only for self defense. But I hear ya, its just that... Sagia308 himself who does this didnt even hit his target not once. How practical is it to defend yourself with a self defense pistol at ranges greatly exceeding its design intent?

 

[Pandaz3]

It is for a pistol designed only for self defense. But I hear ya, its just that... Sagia308 himself who does this didnt even hit his target not once. How practical is it to defend yourself with a self defense pistol at ranges greatly exceeding its design intent?

If it's all you have.......

 

[2Wheels4Ever]

not certain why anyone would ever need to shoot a self defense pistol out to 200yds?, but the bigger question I have is if @sagia308 has ever participated in his own posts here?

Nope, he just dumps his video link in search of those illusive YouTube views.

 

[Koda]

Nope, he just dumps his video link in search of those illusive YouTube views.

yup, he only has 95 subscribers though so not enough of a following to make money on youtube. My guess is hes just having fun doing his thing and filming it, its just odd then to not discuss with others if he truly enjoys what hes doing.