This is how criminals get guns...

[RicInOR]

I'm more than a little surprised that there aren't some of us calling for responsible firearm ownership? How many of you have guns on the shelf in a closet, drawer with your underwear or by the bed? I don't want/expect an answer.

It's a fact that peoples houses get burglarized. To have unsecured firearms in your home is flat-out irresponsible! Those people that DO have unsecured fire arm are a HUGE part of the problem! And, of course I'm not talking about someone who takes the time to break into a locked steel box.

I don't agree with your point.

Leaving a gun out where a child can get at it is irresponsible.

However, in a home, with locked doors? Dogs? Alarms?


What I hear from this is the same as saying the gun owner who has an NRA bumpersticker brought the burglary upon themselves. The Crim, follows you to your home and later breaks in to get your guns.

Likewise, if a bad guy comes into your house, you should leave and not interfere with him. Otherwise you pushing him towards violence. You should have insurance to protect your stuff.

I am not saying no one should use a safe. I have ones to hold some of my guns. But I also have guns in strategic places around my house. I also have no young children. Nor anyone who has issues. When I am dressed and about I have strapped up. But there are times when I am not - like before breakfast.


But that I keep guns not in a safe is not a cause of the problem.

 

[balaperdida]

I'm more than a little surprised that there aren't some of us calling for responsible firearm ownership? How many of you have guns on the shelf in a closet, drawer with your underwear or by the bed? I don't want/expect an answer.

It's a fact that peoples houses get burglarized. To have unsecured firearms in your home is flat-out irresponsible! Those people that DO have unsecured fire arm are a HUGE part of the problem! And, of course I'm not talking about someone who takes the time to break into a locked steel box.

Blame the victim.

 

[Mikej]

I don't agree with your point.

Leaving a gun out where a child can get at it is irresponsible.

However, in a home, with locked doors? Dogs? Alarms?


What I hear from this is the same as saying the gun owner who has an NRA bumpersticker brought the burglary upon themselves. The Crim, follows you to your home and later breaks in to get your guns.

Likewise, if a bad guy comes into your house, you should leave and not interfere with him. Otherwise you pushing him towards violence. You should have insurance to protect your stuff.

I am not saying no one should use a safe. I have ones to hold some of my guns. But I also have guns in strategic places around my house. I also have no young children. Nor anyone who has issues. When I am dressed and about I have strapped up. But there are times when I am not - like before breakfast.


But that I keep guns not in a safe is not a cause of the problem.

Blame the victim.

Question : Do you believe a firearm owner has a responsibility to keep their firearms under lock and key when not at home.

Yes.

No.

Simple question.

 

[PaulB47]

I wondered what that helicopter was doing when he was up there. That was in my own stomping grounds!

The fact is, with 300 million guns in circulation, there will always be enough available to arm the criminal population.

There are also drawbacks to pushing the idea of "keeping guns from criminal hands". It's called gun control, and it affects the law abiding more than it affects criminals.

I'm not saying you should not bother to use gun safes. I'm just saying we need to keep a good fix on reality. The real problem is that government has made it dangerous to protect one's property. Yes this homeowner should have shot the burglar, but who takes such risks these days?

Yes.

No.

Simple question.

Answer: Neither yes nor no. It's the firearm owner's choice what to do, and nobody else's business.

 

[Mikej]

It's the firearm owner's choice what to do, and nobody else's business.

When my neighbor starts doing things, or not doing things, that affect my quality of life and liberty, THAT is MY business!

You can argue about it all you want but "Responsible" gun owners keep their firearms secured. Whether it be with dogs/alarms/safes/chains/buried/trunk of the car/on their person, what ever. It's like they say, there are no "Accidental Discharges", only "Negligent Discharges". You leave your guns out and they get stolen, you're negligent, and should be liable.

 

[PaulB47]

Nope. You are advocating gun control.

If someone leaves a hammer out, and the hammer is stolen and used to kill somebody, should the original hammer owner be liable? How about a stolen car?

Gun control is not an example of government helping peons. Never was, never will be.

Now it is possible that in a free country, a person might bring suit and charge negligence and make it stick, with guns or with any other tool. But that is a matter for that court and jury, not for general (i.e., government) solutions. In most cases, though, it makes sense to hold the criminal responsible for his misdeeds, not his victims.

 

[BoonDocks36]

Question : Do you believe a firearm owner has a responsibility to keep their firearms under lock and key when not at home.

Yes./No.

Simple question.

Your Avatar says it all . . . Bingo ! ! ! one more onto the Ignore List, Blaming the Victim is too easy.

I know One Marine Gunny from the early Sixties in RVN, who Sleeps with a Benelli 12 Gauge with extended, and other features, Under his Pillow is a 1911, you Tell HIM where to keep his Armament and he will duplicate your Avatar In YOUR FACE,

philip

 

[mjbskwim]

Your Avatar says it all . . . Bingo ! ! ! one more onto the Ignore List, Blaming the Victim is too easy.

I know One Marine Gunny from the early Sixties in RVN, who Sleeps with a Benelli 12 Gauge with extended, and other features, Under his Pillow is a 1911, you Tell HIM where to keep his Armament and he will duplicate your Avatar In YOUR FACE,

philip

WOW that's like the most macho thing I have ever heard
Tell him to get a life
Or I can if you aren't up to it

 

[Member 5605]

A reason why insurance should never cover a firearm loss unless you have proof it was busted out of a locked safe.

Cabinets of wood are not valid.

 

[CoastRange57]

Seems to be a lot of defense for the common criminal here and giving them a pass on stealing unsecured fire arms. I keep some guns secured. I keep some hidden in various places. The fact is that the security of my home and weapons is just that. If somebody breaks into my home and steals my weapons, it is ALL on them, since they are the criminal azzholes who stole them. Making me responsible for another's crime is complete bullsh*t.

I have an alarm system that has an exterior alarm, silent alarm, it lets me know via text , e mail within 30 seconds of an alarm. I have 2 neighbors who will come over to see what is going on, very well armed. I also have a Aussie pit mix, and a German Shepard granddog there 4 hours a day. They do not like strangers, and would simply lay the wood to anybody who tried to break in.

If for some reason after all that some one steals my guns, they got very lucky. Making me responsible for what those criminals do after burglarizing my house is crap.

When does society start blaming the criminal for being criminals and punishing them as such ?

 

[CoastRange57]

Oh and for those who thought the dude who I started this thread about was going to post bail and walkout, he is still in custody, with over 9 FTA No bail counts, and a host of other charges. The only place he is going is to the state pen for about 10 years, unfortunately only 10 years probably.

http://www.co.washington.or.us/Sheriff/Jail/who-is-in-custody.cfm?alpha=D

 

[Caveman Jim]

View attachment 272898

Wait a minute, why didn't you put a second lock on that big honkin sucker on the left? Boy, you in a heap O trouble.....

 

[U201491]

I don't agree with your point.

Leaving a gun out where a child can get at it is irresponsible.

However, in a home, with locked doors? Dogs? Alarms?


What I hear from this is the same as saying the gun owner who has an NRA bumpersticker brought the burglary upon themselves. The Crim, follows you to your home and later breaks in to get your guns.

Likewise, if a bad guy comes into your house, you should leave and not interfere with him. Otherwise you pushing him towards violence. You should have insurance to protect your stuff.

I am not saying no one should use a safe. I have ones to hold some of my guns. But I also have guns in strategic places around my house. I also have no young children. Nor anyone who has issues. When I am dressed and about I have strapped up. But there are times when I am not - like before breakfast.


But that I keep guns not in a safe is not a cause of the problem.

Yep the rest sounds just like the anti's.
A locked home is enough if the Criminals would get what they deserve. Stop blaming the
gun owners for the crimes of the criminal retards on anyone but the criminal retards.
If someone steals a gun then uses it against another, it deserves capital punishment with very very few exceptions. I cannot think of even one at this time.

Anyone that blames the law abiding gun owner of anything because some azz retard criminal stole his gun is no better than Prozanski or Obama or the rest of the Brady bunch. Until the actual crime gets what it deserves then no one has any room to infringe on anyone's 2nd Amendment rights in any way.

.

 

[boogerhook]

I'm more than a little surprised that there aren't some of us calling for responsible firearm ownership? How many of you have guns on the shelf in a closet, drawer with your underwear or by the bed? I don't want/expect an answer.

It's a fact that peoples houses get burglarized. To have unsecured firearms in your home is flat-out irresponsible! Those people that DO have unsecured fire arm are a HUGE part of the problem! And, of course I'm not talking about someone who takes the time to break into a locked steel box.

I fully understand what you are saying, but I'd like to add something for consideration:

1. Safes are not as safe as we would like to think. The most expensive ones, rated TL30 will resist a mere 30 minutes to compromise against tools. Many of the smaller digital lock handgun safes can be opened in a few minutes with tools such as key-jugglers, tubular lock picking tools, etc. Most of our lock boxes only serve to prevent the drive-by attempts of either burglar or child in your home.

2. Although I keep my stuff locked up, even guns and ammo/mags separate, I understand people that want to ensure instant access when needed. The thought of malfunctioning quick access technology is scary to some - obviously more scary than their fear of having their guns stolen. I have solved the problem by having redundant safes & guns, meaning the chances that two safes would malfunction when I needed one of them to open are rather minute.

My understanding is that most ineligible people obtain still their guns from friends and family. Theft is a concern, no doubt, but probably not the largest ...

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

When my neighbor starts doing things, or not doing things, that affect my quality of life and liberty, THAT is MY business!

You can argue about it all you want but "Responsible" gun owners keep their firearms secured. Whether it be with dogs/alarms/safes/chains/buried/trunk of the car/on their person, what ever. It's like they say, there are no "Accidental Discharges", only "Negligent Discharges". You leave your guns out and they get stolen, you're negligent, and should be liable.

Where does it end?

Do we also have to lock up our car keys, kitchen knives, prescription drugs, chainsaws, power tools, non-power tools such as hammers or household chemicals? And are we going to be jailed or sued into bankruptcy if a criminal breaks into our home, steals them and uses one in an unlawful manner to cause harm to another?

 

[Mikej]

So a number of firearms owners don't lock up their firearms, and don't believe they should be forced to, or to be held responsible for any act committed by someone who would gain possession of their unsecured fire arms. Check. It's a relatively free country so that's your right/choice I suppose.

Having my arms, reasonably, secure gives me comfort when I'm not at home. I'll leave it at that.

 

[DuneHopper]

All great discussions here, but I am still thinking its not how you secure your firearms its how you advertise your wares. I hate that this forum is public sometimes because even in the hidden threads it could be seen, but gun owners do at times create a victim stance by how they advertise what they have.
I can go to any parking lot in Walmart and find a gun owner in 1 minute, I can drive neighborhoods and see with in 1o minutes who owns then, its not rocket science but criminals are opportunistic people a safe or locks help slow down or prevent stolen property but they have to know you have firearms. I do not think letting people to easily know you have firearms at home is a good idea unless you know them, I make allot of deals firearm related and no one comes to my house.

Whether anyone cares or not I am going to give some tips from my perspective, take em or leave em.

1. Remove firearms stickers from your vehicle, do not display your guns in a rack or get tinted windows. This goes for spouses car as well.
   
2. At gun shows be aware of cars following you even close to your neighborhood.
3. When going hunting, shooting etc, back you vehicle into Garage, driveway etc so its harder for driver going by to see.
4. Dog or no dog put on fence beware of dog and no trespassing establishing that further access is a trespass allows you certain defensive rights.
5. When you leave for the day leave the stereo on in the house and or TV, get motion active lights if you have pets they set them off and it looks like a person going in an out of the rooms then have those on timers to go off late.
6. Do let neighbors you trust know you have guns and if they see someone other then you carting them off call the police.
7. Keep at least one gun per adult in the house open and accessible when home.
   
8. Due display support for military and police this gives criminals butterflies or worse as they are afraid they will be sized up and often avoid homes of vets and police and supporters.

I could go on but you get the picture, I am not saying do not be proud of organizations you belong to or how to defend your property. But those of you with Armed service pasts or LEO think for a minute when you are out and about or driving do you not by instinct size up situations? Of course you do, now get this clear that is 100% what criminals do to find our guns. They look for the easiest return with the easiest access they victimize those whom allow them selves to become victims. All I am is saying is making it harder.
And if you want the world to know you have firearms thats your business and I envy you that privilege me I have to be careful for many reasons.

Think I am nuts or insane thats cool, but we need to break this down to see how its done.

DH

 

[308]

So a number of firearms owners don't lock up their firearms, and don't believe they should be forced to, or to be held responsible for any act committed by someone who would gain possession of their unsecured fire arms. Check. It's a relatively free country so that's your right/choice I suppose.

Having my arms, reasonably, secure gives me comfort when I'm not at home. I'll leave it at that.

Mine are always secured when I'm away and it has more to do with my risk tolerance than someone telling me I should...I've never been one to do what I'm told..lol

 

[WasrNwarpaint]

I hate that this forum is public sometimes because even in the hidden threads it could be seen, but gun owners do at times create a victim stance by how they advertise what they have.

the political section should be private..... members only ...being public just invites trolls that would not normally take the time to join

 

[Caveman Jim]

So a number of firearms owners don't lock up their firearms, and don't believe they should be forced to, or to be held responsible for any act committed by someone who would gain possession of their unsecured fire arms. Check. It's a relatively free country so that's your right/choice I suppose.

Having my arms, reasonably, secure gives me comfort when I'm not at home. I'll leave it at that.

I am not going to be forced to do anything by the ignorance of politicians. I am a responsible person and i dont do irresponsible things.
Mikej, what America has is a people problem, not a lot of Americans have brains so do not promote that we should be FORCED to do anything because of the simpletons out there....
Life was simpler back in the day with less warnings on products. Today we have a natural selection of people who will not survive this life because the fail to read......