The way we can EFFECTIVELY fight measure 114

[ilikegunspdx]

What can we do about measure 114 individually? I believe the court case(s) to overturn this unconstitutional law is the most effective way to fight this.

We have seen in the last months that court cases are extremely effective in striking down these gun control laws, one after another. This is largely due to the Bruen decision that said the right shall not be infringed and shall be based on the gun laws that existed in 1791 (the time when the second amendment was created).

We need to push that imo and continue to build precedent that these unconstitutional gun laws will not stand! The body of precedent cases we can help create builds an inpenetrable fortress for protecting our gun rights far into the future (perhaps forever).

Perhaps this piece of sh!t legislation passing is just what we need to make us shift from the old "support the nra and they will fight it via lobbyists" (which is now ineffective Imo) to fighting these laws in court (which is now very effective post-Bruen imo). This could not have happened pre-Bruen so we have an unprecedented opportunity right now to make a difference by shifting our efforts to striking down these laws in court.

I think we need to identify the lead group who will be effective in fighting this in court and support them.

Read More

 

[Longwalkhome]

Kali has been fighting this kind of crap legislation for decades, it's been like a tennis match for them with the ball bounced court to court. The fights on here but the left is seeing weakness and will pass more legislation. Folks could have won this fight right away by voting out the dems but instead just like kali the same outcome is guaranteed unless you vote out the gun grabbers.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Kali has been fighting this kind of crap legislation for decades, it's been like a tennis match for them with the ball bounced court to court. The fights on here but the left is seeing weakness and will pass more legislation. Folks could have won this fight right away by voting out the dems but instead just like kali the same outcome is guaranteed unless you vote out the gun grabbers.

Those decades were pre-Bruen. The landscape has changed and the Supreme Court has given us the foundation for striking down these laws. The CA mag ban will likely be struck down as soon as December 2022 because it is proceeding now in a post-Bruen decision landscape.

Not arguing with you on the voting part at all btw. Just saying we now are in a landscape where the courts can strike down these laws and every one of them struck down creates further precedent to strike down the next one. It's like a snowball that will grow into an unstoppable avalanche.

 

[Stomper]

Those decades were pre-Bruen. The landscape has changed and the Supreme Court has given us the foundation for striking down these laws. The CA mag ban will likely be struck down as soon as December 2022 because it is proceeding now in a post-Bruen decision landscape.

Not arguing with you on the voting part at all btw. Just saying we now are in a landscape where the courts can strike down these laws and every one of them struck down creates further precedent to strike down the next one. It's like a snowball that will grow into an unstoppable avalanche.

Agreed. If the anti-2A's want restrictive gun laws or to repeal the 2A altogether, they can via a constitutional convention that requires participation of 2/3 of the States to happen, and 3/4 of the States to ratify any proposed amendments via a convention or congressional submittals.


Good FRAKING luck with THAT!

 

[DivCurlGrad72]

What can we do about measure 114 individually?

As you wrote, a financial donation to whomever takes on this case. It's gonna take money, a whole lotta spending money …

 

[Longwalkhome]

Those decades were pre-Bruen. The landscape has changed and the Supreme Court has given us the foundation for striking down these laws. The CA mag ban will likely be struck down as soon as December 2022 because it is proceeding now in a post-Bruen decision landscape.

Not arguing with you on the voting part at all btw. Just saying we now are in a landscape where the courts can strike down these laws and every one of them struck down creates further precedent to strike down the next one. It's like a snowball that will grow into an unstoppable avalanche.

We got very lucky Trump worked at filling vacant seats with good judges that obey the constitution. We will get a good lead on the war but this election brought in new judges. If Brandon gets to appoint SC judges we can say goodbye to the constitution. It's why we need to fight now while we have good judges.

I guess we will see if folks really want a constitution with protected rights.

 

[arakboss]

We got very lucky Trump worked at filling vacant seats with good judges that obey the constitution. We will get a good lead on the war but this election brought in new judges. If Brandon gets to appoint SC judges we can say goodbye to the constitution. It's why we need to fight now while we have good judges.

I guess we will see if folks really want a constitution with protected rights.

That is why the Senate was so important and I am afraid we might have lost that opportunity. Let's hope 2A friendly SCOTUS members stay in good health for a long time.

 

[User 1234]

On December 12, 2022 the federal trial judge in California is holding a hearing on Bruen's impact on the status of California's gun control laws (mag ban, AW ban, and I believe one other regarding ammo background checks). He's almost certain to affirm his own prior rulings against these laws. Then CA will appeal to the 9th, but hopefully not obtain a stay.

 

[skilletboy]

Those decades were pre-Bruen. The landscape has changed and the Supreme Court has given us the foundation for striking down these laws. The CA mag ban will likely be struck down as soon as December 2022 because it is proceeding now in a post-Bruen decision landscape.

Not arguing with you on the voting part at all btw. Just saying we now are in a landscape where the courts can strike down these laws and every one of them struck down creates further precedent to strike down the next one. It's like a snowball that will grow into an unstoppable avalanche.

I quite agree with this sentiment. I don't see how 114 passes any type of scrutiny after Bruen. 114 isn't even going to be enforceable for smaller sheriff departments.

 

[Ura-Ki]

There is some really great news floating around these days, Post Bruen, the courts are going to have a VERY hard time agreeing with the state or other bad actors, and THAT is the best thing we have going for us! As we are about to see in Kali with the Nutty Ninth, they are going to get their arses handed to them big time, IF they don't square with Judge Benetias who is ruling once again on the Mag Ban. IF the 9th allows Kali to Challenge it again, and push it back to the 9th circuit once more, SCOTUS will force their hand, they have already been told that basically, you were wrong, here's how to do it right, get on with it and get it over with! There are several Justices on the court eager to take more of these cases under Bruen now, FINALLY using the correct analog to strike all this down with!

So, what does Oregon's situation look like Post Bruen?
A lot of folks believe the Mag Ban will not hold up, and that's true, BUT,..........What about the rest of it?
Here is where Justice Thomas was thinking ahead, not only in Text as Informed by Relevant History and Tradition, BUT, he took things way further, anticipating the states and other bad actors would attempt to skirt his ruling, so he gave us more tools, and This is where we have the Bad Actors LEVO by the ballz,
The Historical aspect is where we nail them, and that is Permit to Purchase, Training Requirements, and Fee's/Taxes! I spent the last several weeks digging,, and there is NO Historical Text anywhere in the Several States, Nor Militia service requirements, NOTHING that required Training, or a Permit, or any Fees to practice a right! In Fact, one was actually REQUIRED to report to Militia duty so equipped with his Musket, Powder and Shot, as well as such provisions to see him through for a time! THATS the Nail in LEVO's coffin!

Going forward, once we know who our Gov'ness is, if it's Drazan, We make a serious Push for Constitutnal Carry, and we use LEVO's 114 against them, one too many steps to practice a right! One too many Back Ground Checks for the same purpose!

Last, Once we get 114 throttled, we need to go after LEVO in civil court and make them go away once and for all, we already know they are crooked as hell, and we need to crush them and their church once and for all, and we are going to have to do it all on our own!

 

[ob1]

@Ura-Ki ......

I'm sure you know that I am eating up your above post with a spoon, but the thing that I am wondering about is the MONEY. We have just received a lesson on economics 101 neatly packaged with Tuesday's butt spanking. We have no reliable financing base with big pockets. All of the hard work we have accomplished to this point has been out of pocket by us, down to wearing out our shoes, passing out flyers and signs.
We have no Bloomberg's, Soros, etc. Hell, from my impressions, we didn't even have the Dam NRA...except to show up to get more money and then leave after a little chest thumping. That wasn't support, it was a dam buzzard stopping by because it smelled fresh blood !
I understand that an effort such as you describe takes on it's own momentum once it gets off the ground. The problem is getting from full stop to stick up and rotate. Even those guys in North Carolina had a hill to help get them up. Once up, we hand off to the attorney(s) to present using the precedents you cited.

I am thinking that babe that Johnny Depp hired.
I hereby volunteer as a rep for her team

 

[Ura-Ki]

@Ura-Ki ......

I'm sure you know that I am eating up your above post with a spoon, but the thing that I am wondering about is the MONEY. We have just received a lesson on economics 101 neatly packaged with Tuesday's butt spanking. We have no reliable financing base with big pockets. All of the hard work we have accomplished to this point has been out of pocket by us, down to wearing out our shoes, passing out flyers and signs.
We have no Bloomberg's, Soros, etc. Hell, from my impressions, we didn't even have the Dam NRA...except to show up to get more money and then leave after a little chest thumping. That wasn't support, it was a dam buzzard stopping by because it smelled fresh blood !
I understand that an effort such as you describe takes on it's own momentum once it gets off the ground. The problem is getting from full stop to stick up and rotate. Even those guys in North Carolina had a hill to help get them up. Once up, we hand off to the attorney(s) to present using the precedents you cited.

I am thinking that babe that Johnny Depp hired.
I hereby volunteer as a rep for her team

Good questions! I don't have hard answers yet, but I do know that both GOA and FPC have suit's ready to go, there is Money going toward those two groups, and a few other lessors, so, we need to back those two parties financially to help them help us! I hold less then zero hope of the NRA or OFF having anything but token support, so we're on our own in this fight! I would imagine several Gun Shop owners will help fund as much as they can, a few may even file suit in their own, giving GOA and FPC a "Victim" to play! Might also need to find someone to play the victim being denied their rights by this!

I'm any case, WE the PEOPLE, needs to support those challenges any way we can, it's our only chance at getting this through the entire circus to the very end!

 

[ob1]

I think we need to identify the lead group who will be effective in fighting this in court and support them.

I agree.

I also believe that we need to take into account the performance of "said groups" in the last few months leading up to Tuesday. Dropping off a few signs and then asking for more money doesn't cut in a fight against "The most restrictive anti-gun rights bill in the country". Anyone who has read post 11 knows who I am talking about.

@Ura-Ki
"I would imagine several Gun Shop owners will help fund as much as they can, a few may even file suit in their own, giving GOA and FPC a "Victim" to play!"

I find it amazing that the above hasn't already happened. Were we the only ones that took 114 seriously ?
Instead they wait until the guillotine falls and then say "oh, we shoulda done more".

Accountability not blank checks.

Don't feed the buzzards.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Oregon and Washington Democrats are planning bills to end their State preemption in 2023. Portland wants to go full NYC with prohibited places.

 

[taku1946]

Just one Question, When will this go to the Supreme Court ?
Oregon Firearms Federation
and
NRA ( don't make it a pro con NRA thread)
NRA has the legal and the money.
Give to OFF so they also have the money.
Both need to get active on this IF it passes. We're still at 70% counted.

 

[arakboss]

Just one Question, When will this go to the Supreme Court ?
Oregon Firearms Federation
and
NRA ( don't make it a pro con NRA thread)
NRA has the legal and the money.
Give to OFF so they also have the money.
Both need to get active on this IF it passes. We're still at 70% counted.

When we are all driving electric cars.

 

[Longwalkhome]

Supreme Court ruled on our rights recently and affirmed them yet still 114 was allowed on the ballot. I guess oregons state government doesn't read Supreme Court rullings or 114 wouldn't legally be on a ballot.

 

[Ura-Ki]

Don't forget, LEVO has also stated that they will be pushing their I.P. 18 next, likely to the state legislatures this time, we need to stop that from ever seeing daylight!

We need a civil suit against them ASAP, tie them and their supporters up fighting on the defensive, make them bleed cash till fold and pack up!

 

[ob1]

I think we need to identify the lead group who will be effective in fighting this in court and support them.

I agree.

I also believe that we need to take into account the performance of "said groups" in the last few months leading up to Tuesday. Dropping off a few signs and then asking for more money doesn't cut in a fight against "The most restrictive anti-gun rights bill in the country".
Accountability not blank checks

 

[Librarian]

See the new pinned thread, https://www.northwestfirearms.com/threads/measure-114-litigation.431016/#post-3420446

Quick guess: 2025 is soonest. I'd like to be wrong.