Thank you Ruger for the loaded chamber indicator!!!

[Glock Jock]

I just can't wrap my head around striker fired pistols. Why would you want a pistol that looks the same no matter what state the action is in. Give me a 3rd gen Smith or Beretta 92 any day, at least I can tell instantly whether or not it's live. To me the whole striker deal is a cost saving method for manufacturers, which they have not passed on to the buyer. Whenever you come in contact with any firearm, point in a safe direction, keep your finger off the trigger, drop mag, rack slide or open cylinder, and never trust any safety device.

Glock tells you instantly if it is cocked. If the trigger is sitting in the middle of the trigger guard it is cocked, and if it is sitting flush to the back of the trigger guard - then it is not cocked. XD's and M&P's don't do that, which is another reason I don't suggest them.

 

[mjbskwim]

Rusty,the point is,you always handle the as if it is LIVE. Indicators don't mean patutty.

OK OP got a reprieve,along with whoever else was in the house
NEVER hand a gun to another person,in a house,when not in battle,when it's loaded or has the mag in it.
Kinda simple. And not sure why you felt the need to drop the striker.

But,sometimes when we talk(write) people don't really listen.
I have a potty mouth and it gets worse when I get mad. I have had discussions with people and started swearing at them.
They ask why I need to swear.
I tell them so they will actually listen to me.

So the moral of the story is,if BDA.45 or anyone else, wouldn't have been insulting,maybe Kreuljer wouldn't have learned anything.

Sometimes the "Oh wow,you got lucky"s don't make a difference.
Remember,we remember the BAD not the GOOD in most cases.Human nature,please don't be a "water walker" and say you don't

Some times we need a little brow beating to get it through or skulls.
Being part German it works for me.
(Thanks BDA.45 for taking the bad guy role,it very easily could have been me)

And it's not a matter of being perfect,just get it into your routine to really UNLOAD any weapon before handing it to someone else.

Mike
Wanna be Water Walker,striving daily

 

[Misterbill]

OP:
I'm very glad you caught your mistake without mishap. I'm hoping the experience scared the chewing gum out of you and that you will use this experience as impetus to get some training.

1. Mag out
2. Lock back slide and eject any rounds present in the chamber
3. Visually and with a finger check both chamber and mag well

This should be your automatic procedure EVERY time you handle a semi auto other than to shoot it or load it. Having this be pretty much "autopilot" routine will save you from yourself even when you're having a day when your brain isn't it's best (we all have them).

The good news is you didn't have a ND. Presumably you were following rule 2 (safe direction) at least so even if you HAD had an ND, no one would have been hurt.

I don't like LCIs because I think they encourage people to ignore proper gun handling routines. But if one saved you from a ND, then good on that.

For those of you having a tizzy over this, take a chill pill. This stuff happens, especially among newer gun owners without formal training. You guys make mistakes of varying levels too, I promise you. No one is perfect. instead of calling the OP names, a little instruction probably would have been more helpful.

 

[ZigZagZeke]

I believe the Remington 700 is known for this. Basically, if the gun goes off without someone hitting the trigger, that is probably accidental. Everything else is more than likely negligent. I'm not passing judgement, just trying to define terms.

Early production runs of the S&W 1500, Mossberg 1500 and other variations of the Howa 1500, 1550, and 1700LS (don't know if the Weatherby Vanguard was included) had a bolt that could be disassembled and reassembled incorrectly, which would result in the rifle firing when the bolt was closed. There was a recall on all of those bolts to make it impossible to reassemble them incorrectly. The recall is still in effect. I sent an S&W 1500 bolt in last month.

Rifle Product Recall
Submitted on: January 6, 2002

IMPORTANT SAFETY NOTICE MODEL 1500, 1550 AND 1700LS SERIES RIFLES BY HOWA MACHINERY LTD. Product Upgrade Registration

Howa Machinery, Ltd. of Japan, is
performing a safety upgrade on all Model 1500, 1550 and 1700LS series rifles manufactured between 1970 and 1993. The affected rifles bear serial numbers from one of the following series on the receiver: PN00010 through PN87159, LS00001 through LS05150, M000001 through M020422, LS10001 through LS10309, B000001 through B028450. The safety upgrade will replace the bolt sleeve to prevent misassembly of the bolt, which might occur on the affected rifles. Such misassembly might result in a hazardous condition in which the rifle can be accidentally discharged without the bolt being fully engaged, causing severe injury. These rifles were distributed by Smith & Wesson, O.F. Mossberg & Sons and Interarms. These rifles may bear the distributor trademark. WARNING: If you own a Howa Model 1500, 1550, or 1700LS series rifle with a serial number from one of the serial number series referred to above: USE OF YOUR RIFLE MAY RESULT IN AN ACCIDENT AND SEVERE INJURY. STOP USING YOUR RIFLE IMMEDIATELY and go to <broken link removed> or call Howa at 800-456-5131 to receive a Bolt Return Kit. Only the bolt sleeve is being upgraded. Your bolt will be returned to you after the upgrade.

NO OTHER HOWA RIFLES ARE AFFECTED. CHECK YOUR SERIAL NUMBER.

The affected rifles were originally sold through licensed gun dealers nationwide, and some of them may have been resold by the original owners through retail gun dealers, trade shows or privately. If you have sold, traded or given away an affected Model 1500, 1550 or 1700LS series by Howa Machinery Ltd. rifle, it is important for you to forward this Safety Notice to the current owner. Howa Machinery Ltd. apologizes for any inconvenience to its customers resulting from this safety upgrade program, but it is important that owners of affected rifles take advantage of this free upgrade program and do not use an affected rifle before it has been upgraded. All work will be done at no charge. Return the bolt only, not the entire rifle. Please do not return your Model 1500, 1550, or 1700LS series by Howa Machinery Ltd. bolt before contacting us through <broken link removed> or 800-456-5131 for your Bolt Return Kit.

 

[coyoteman5]

Your an idiot.... A simple, basic firearms check would have solved that. How much more basic do guns have to be? How much more STUPID do we have to make it for the STUPID people???

Looks like someone can walk on water and heal the sick.

 

[Misterbill]

I just can't wrap my head around striker fired pistols. Why would you want a pistol that looks the same no matter what state the action is in. Give me a 3rd gen Smith or Beretta 92 any day, at least I can tell instantly whether or not it's live. To me the whole striker deal is a cost saving method for manufacturers, which they have not passed on to the buyer. Whenever you come in contact with any firearm, point in a safe direction, keep your finger off the trigger, drop mag, rack slide or open cylinder, and never trust any safety device.

Consistent 3.5-4 lb. crisp trigger pulls and flawlessly functional under virtually all conditions.

I love my DA/SA guns and my SA guns, but striker guns have their appeal as well.

 

[Burt Gummer]

I don't blame people for never sharing stories of mistakes they have made on here.

 

[66PonyCar]

Jeff Cooper's Rules of Gun Safety



RULE I: ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED

RULE II: NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT WILLING TO DESTROY

RULE III: KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET

RULE IV: BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET

 

[titsonritz]

I just can't wrap my head around striker fired pistols. Why would you want a pistol that looks the same no matter what state the action is in. Give me a 3rd gen Smith or Beretta 92 any day, at least I can tell instantly whether or not it's live.

By your rational 3rd Gen Smith and Beretta DAO would also be undesirable because they look the same no matter what state the action is in. So what about AKs and ARs? They do not have exposed hammers either. Bottom line, it's a software issue not a hardware issue.

To me the whole striker deal is a cost saving method for manufacturers, which they have not passed on to the buyer.

That's exactly what the deal is, but if you think about they did pass the savings on to the buyers (well except HK), Glocks, M&P are cheaper than 3rd gen Smith and Berettas.

 

[Phillyfan]

Glock tells you instantly if it is cocked. If the trigger is sitting in the middle of the trigger guard it is cocked, and if it is sitting flush to the back of the trigger guard - then it is not cocked. XD's and M&P's don't do that, which is another reason I don't suggest them.

XD's have a pin that sticks out the back of the slide to indicate that it is cocked. In the dark you can feel it with your thumb to make sure. I think that is better than the Glock indicator.

 

[OLDNEWBIE]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dHXND_9-bE&list=UUxM3Mj_vIzU2wV2z0SvxPjg&index=20

Be sure not to dry fire your pistol, without the magazine in the pistol, since otherwise the striker will bang into the safety drop-down bar. If the striker repeatedly hits that bar a result could be light primer strikes and no bang.

You may already know that the mag disconnect is easily removed allowing dry firing. now I can unsafely fire a chambered round with the mag dropped! Some say lawyers would crucify you in an accident ugh negl... you know what I mean!

 

[Trailboss]

The OP needs to learn his weapon and stop blaming others for his lack of wisdom.

 

[John H]

Safety features are there for that exact reason.

Safeties are there because of people like him. Never understood the need for the loaded chamber indicator.

 

[Kruel J]

The OP needs to learn his weapon and stop blaming others for his lack of wisdom.

Funny, I don't remeber blaming anyone. Did you read the whole thread?

 

[Caveman Jim]

A real man admits his mistakes
A fool blames everything or everyone else but himself.

 

[Simonpie]

I'm reminded of my one and only ride in an acrobatic biplane. I immediately surfed the web and found a list of crashes and causes. Of about 30 crashes, one was unexpected structural failure, one was a guy who regularly pulled 9 Gs in a 7G plane, and 28 ran out of gas.
The analogy?
Yes, safety is your responsibility, but big reliable gas gauges and chamber indicators have a place too.

 

[Pandaz3]

Dude, Can you tell me the difference between a true accidental vs negligent discharge???

That is exactly the reason Ruger still has an active recall out for three screw Blackhawks. They can go off accidentally.

 

[davef]

Ill raise my post count by one on this thread. I think the issue everyones heated about is the fact that the OP said this was the closest he has come to an AD when in fact it was a ND. thats it. Its not an AD if you chamber a round and accidentally pull the trigger. Thats negligence. If you shot the neighbor or your dad in the process the popo wouldnt consider it an accident. It would be negligence.

 

[titsonritz]

Glock tells you instantly if it is cocked. If the trigger is sitting in the middle of the trigger guard it is cocked, and if it is sitting flush to the back of the trigger guard - then it is not cocked. XD's and M&P's don't do that, which is another reason I don't suggest them.

XD's have a pin that sticks out the back of the slide to indicate that it is cocked. In the dark you can feel it with your thumb to make sure. I think that is better than the Glock indicator.

I disagree; the Glock is better setup than the XD. The XD has the pin that protrudes from the back of the pistol showing it is cocked and a chamber loaded indicator pops out of the top of the slide when a round is present. Both of these parts are separate from the firing function, as in additional parts. Glock does the same with parts that are already part of the pistol in the first place, as GlockJock pointed out the trigger in the forward position means it is in the ready to fire position and the extractor has a notch that is both visible and tactile indicating a loaded chamber. Along with the palm grip safety on the XD that makes for a lot of extra parts to break that are not needed in the first place. Same goes for the thumb safety version on the M&P, more useless, redundant parts. But hey, if your into a pistol that was designed with lawyers in mind over the end user than rock on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8dHXND_9-bE&list=UUxM3Mj_vIzU2wV2z0SvxPjg&index=20
You may already know that the mag disconnect is easily removed allowing dry firing. now I can unsafely fire a chambered round with the mag dropped! Some say lawyers would crucify you in an accident ugh negl... you know what I mean!

I'd rather buy a gun that does not have undesirable parts in the first place, same goes for any and all weapons with the lame-o key locks.

 

[Nwcid]

I had some thoughts on this thread last night. Yes the OP broke all the rules and lucked out due to an addition on his firearm.

I also would not use a loaded chamber indicator to determine if my gun was loaded or unloaded. With that said I do like the ones on the newer Glocks where you can feel, in situations where you can not see, that the gun is loaded. This would not be my primary choice and it is a mechanical feature that can fail but is a nice addition.

With that said we all make mistakes and the good news is when we are around to tell the tales. I just had a "safety" feature save me lots of trouble this morning. I got the bike out and ready to ride on Monday and took it to work. This morning when I got off work I had the bike all warmed up in the parking lot. I was waiting for traffic to clear and it seemed like it was taking forever. I found my opening and took off making a hard left onto the street trying to catch the gap in traffic. All of a sudden the bike felt funny and I knew my back end was slipping, I knew what I did and it was bad. Well the traction control caught my dumb move, dropped power so I got traction again and I stayed upright. Had it not been for that feature I am 90% sure the bike and I would have been down in the street.

For those that don't ride a cold tire does not have near the grip of a warm one. I have a 1400cc bike that has 170hp and 100lbs torque at the rear wheel. So my bad was too much acceleration on a cold tire while at a "sharp" angle. The factors that lead to this are I was tired, out for the first time on the bike this year, and being in a hurry. I knew and know better but it still happened.