Spreading out hazmat and shipping fees.

[Peteralexander78]

If you were going to split an order of powder and
I would suggest that you divide the total hazmat/shipping cost into the total price of products to get a percentage, then multiply each buyers product total by that percentage increase.

Example:

4 buyers split $1000 order. Total hazmat/shipping adds $100 to that total for grand total of $1100. Dividing $100 into $1000 gives us 10% hazmat/shipping percentage

Buyer 1 is buying $630 worth of product. His total is $630+$63=$693

Buyer 2 is buying $170

If you were going to split an order of powder and or primers with another buyer(s), how would you split the haz mat and shipping fees?

I would suggest that you divide the total hazmat/shipping cost into the total price of products to get a percentage, then multiply each buyers product total by that percentage increase.

Example:

4 buyers split $1000 order. Total hazmat/shipping adds $100 to that total for grand total of $1100. Dividing $100 into $1000 gives us 10% hazmat/shipping percentage

Buyer 1 is buying $630 worth of product. His total is $630+$63=$693

Buyer 2 is buying $170 worth of product. Her total is $170+$17=$187

Buyer 3 is buying $120 worth of product. His total is $120+$12=$132

Buyer 4 is buying $80 worth of product. It's total is $80+$8=$88

This seems more reasonable than splitting hazmat and shipping cost evenly four ways.

If there is a group buy I want in. I'm ok with paying upfront.

 

[OldBroad44]

If you were going to split an order of powder and or primers with another buyer(s), how would you split the haz mat and shipping fees?

I would suggest that you divide the total hazmat/shipping cost into the total price of products to get a percentage, then multiply each buyers product total by that percentage increase.

Example:

4 buyers split $1000 order. Total hazmat/shipping adds $100 to that total for grand total of $1100. Dividing $100 into $1000 gives us 10% hazmat/shipping percentage

Buyer 1 is buying $630 worth of product. His total is $630+$63=$693

Buyer 2 is buying $170 worth of product. Her total is $170+$17=$187

Buyer 3 is buying $120 worth of product. His total is $120+$12=$132

Buyer 4 is buying $80 worth of product. It's total is $80+$8=$88

This seems more reasonable than splitting hazmat and shipping cost evenly four ways.

I'd do the sane thing but express it in a way that's easier to understand. And I would give an example. Before I agreed to do the joint order I'd say "Each person will pay a share of the hazmat/shipping fees that reflects their share of the order. So if your order is 30% of the total order, you would pay 30% of the fees." So the guy with the $80 order has 80/1000 of the total order, or 8%. So he needs to pay 8% of the $100 fees, which is $8. So he will owe his order of $80 plus $8 of the fees or $88.

 

[American123]

Sometimes to figure out what's fair it helps to change the situation to one exactly parallel but with numbers more extreme. What if one buyer was buying $1 worth of goods and one was buying $40,000 worth? If they split the shipping and hazmat fees the guy with the $1 order would have to pay $1000 in shipping and fees. This theoretical case makes it clear that dividing the shipping and fees evenly when different people have different size orders is not fair.

One often runs into this situation when several people eat dinner, and split the check. This really only works if nobody cares too much about paying a bit more than their share and everyone keeps their choices within an expected range. Say 30 to 50. If there are four people and one orders a $2,000 bottle of wine, there are likely to be real problems. Unless everyone is wealthy and generous, if one person orders even twice as much as the next highest order there might be resentment. Unless these four eat together regularly and split checks, and the guy with the high order this time usually has average or low orders. But notice that in the gunpowder order one person ordered more than three times as much as the next highest. So while plenty of times people ordering dinner split the check, it isn't a good model for how to split the gun powder fees because the amounts each are buying are too far from equal.

I comprehend that entirely, and using exaggerated numbers as examples to think about a problem is a great strategy. I liked the example about splitting restaurant checks. I just flat out won't do it unless I am with someone (like family) where the money exchange will even out easily. I've had my wife's idiot drinking buddies try to pull that stunt on us before where we buy a modestly price meal and no drinks and they are 3-4 drinks into their bill with a meal and then say "let's split the check." Basically - "hey pay for my drinks." My attitude about that can be summarized with two words and they rhyme with duck stew.

 

[dangerranger60]

All of the group buys I have been a part of used a company that shipped free after a certain amount. That was the point of the group buy was to get over that min amount! Then its just an even split of the Haz Mat fee.
Everyone took advantage of the free shipping because we banded our orders together.
When I quit doing group buys was during the Obummer years when powder was commonly back ordered, and they would send what they had and then send the rest later. Each package had another fee. And with the market as it is no one is giving shipping incentives. DR

 

[OldBroad44]

I comprehend that entirely, and using exaggerated numbers as examples to think about a problem is a great strategy. I liked the example about splitting restaurant checks. I just flat out won't do it unless I am with someone (like family) where the money exchange will even out easily. I've had my wife's idiot drinking buddies try to pull that stunt on us before where we buy a modestly price meal and no drinks and they are 3-4 drinks into their bill with a meal and then say "let's split the check." Basically - "hey pay for my drinks." My attitude about that can be summarized with two words and they rhyme with duck stew.

Right. I'm a big fan of specifying separate checks before the group orders the meal. That's partly for the inverse problem. If we're going to split the check, I feel obliged to try to make my order cost about the same as the others. But I have celiac disease, and need a gluten free diet. The problem is extreme enough in my case so that a piece of bread would likely kill me from anaphylactic shock in minutes. Not optional fussiness on my part; a matter of life or death. Very often on a fancy menu with fifty entrees there will be just three I can eat, usually seafood. I love seafood. But seafood dishes are usually among the most expensive. If I have to keep my order about the same price as others in many cases there would be nothing on the menu I can eat. I just call for separate checks so I can order whatever I want without being unfair to the other diners. Even in pre-covid times I don't eat out often, and since I don't fix seafood at home its lovely when I eat out to have a lovely chunk of NW wild-caught salmon with a glass or two of a good Pinot Gris. Mmmmmm. Now I'm hungry.

 

[DizzyJ]

Sometimes to figure out what's fair it helps to change the situation to one exactly parallel but with numbers more extreme. What if one buyer was buying $1 worth of goods and one was buying $40,000 worth? If they split the shipping and hazmat fees the guy with the $1 order would have to pay $1000 in shipping and fees. This theoretical case makes it clear that dividing the shipping and fees evenly when different people have different size orders is not fair.

One often runs into this situation when several people eat dinner, and split the check. This really only works if nobody cares too much about paying a bit more than their share and everyone keeps their choices within an expected range. Say 30 to 50. If there are four people and one orders a $2,000 bottle of wine, there are likely to be real problems. Unless everyone is wealthy and generous, if one person orders even twice as much as the next highest order there might be resentment. Unless these four eat together regularly and split checks, and the guy with the high order this time usually has average or low orders. But notice that in the gunpowder order one person ordered more than three times as much as the next highest. So while plenty of times people ordering dinner split the check, it isn't a good model for how to split the gun powder fees because the amounts each are buying are too far from equal.

My assumption in a group order is that people will be ordering more than one lb of powder. Otherwise it's more than likely going to cost more than just picking it up from the store.

Additionally, you're limited to 50lbs total per order IIRC, so the exaggerated numbers don't really hold water in a real life example. One guy may want an 8lb jug, someone else may want 3-5 lbs, etc.

When divided up, I don't think the shipping numbers are going to be that different, again, I'm a real life situation where you've got several people going in on the order.

Again, JMHO on the matter and from my previous experience of going in on such orders.

Dizzyj.

 

[DizzyJ]

In general though, in the past I've usually just ordered 2-4 8lb jugs by myself as the costs even out.

 

[OldBroad44]

My assumption in a group order is that people will be ordering more than one lb of powder. Otherwise it's more than likely going to cost more than just picking it up from the store.

Additionally, you're limited to 50lbs total per order IIRC, so the exaggerated numbers don't really hold water in a real life example. One guy may want an 8lb jug, someone else may want 3-5 lbs, etc.

When divided up, I don't think the shipping numbers are going to be that different, again, I'm a real life situation where you've got several people going in on the order.

Again, JMHO on the matter and from my previous experience of going in on such orders.

Dizzyj.

Actually, the exaggerated numbers do help sort out the ethical situation.

And in this real life example, if they just spit the fees, guy1 will his 630 lbs of the order would pay just $25 of the fees. Guy4 with his 80 lb of the would also pay $25 in fees. Guy1 would be paying a shipping rate of about 4%. Guy4 would be paying a shipping rate of about 30%.

The way to make the deal happen is to make it clear and obviously fair rather than depending on three other guys to pay most of guy1's fees and just not care about it.

 

[Camelfilter]

Closing this thread, simply because:

#13. Group buys are prohibited without express permission from Joe Link.

Folks whom choose to set up group buys outside of NWFA can figure out how to split costs any way they wish.

No sense even discussing such any further on here.