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Sometimes They Really ARE Out to Get You!

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by ZigZagZeke, Mar 19, 2013.

  1. ZigZagZeke

    ZigZagZeke Eugene Silver Supporter Silver Supporter 2015 Volunteer

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    I am deeply concerned about our nation and where it is headed. Based on my concerns, some would call me a “gun nut”, a conspiracy theorist, a radical Liberal, a radical Conservative, or maybe just a nut. What I truly am is a radical Constitutionalist, and I’m afraid we could be in the process of losing this nation, its freedoms, and its future.

    First let us examine in a holistic way what is going on in this nation at the moment. We have been carrying on a war on terrorism for over 10 years now at a cost of $80B per year. That war effort has resulted in the creation of the DHS and TSA, the Patriot Act, the NDAA, and the recent purchase of enough ammunition by DHS to shoot every person in America 5 times. We now have warrantless searches and interception of American citizen’s private communications, and secretly approved searches and interception of private communications of American citizen’s. The President has been granted the power to assassinate American citizens overseas on his own authorization, while the same aerial drones used in those assassinations overseas have been authorized for “reconnaissance” purposes within the United States. Bid specifications for drones to be used within the United States include a requirement for “weapons delivery capability”. DHS, in addition to billions of rounds of ammunition, has ordered thousands of “personal protection” weapons, better known when in civilian hands not as “personal protection” weapons, but as “assault” weapons, while at the same time the most powerful attempts in history are being made to disarm the populace, and militarize the domestic police forces.

    It seems very strange to me that the very same people who worry that their personal safety is threatened by their next door neighbor owning guns are seemingly unconcerned about these much greater dangers.

    Each and every safeguard afforded us by the Bill of Rights is being quickly limited, eroded, and negated:

    The 1st Amendment is being limited through efforts at criminalizing “terrorist” and “hate” speech. The 2nd Amendment is being dismantled through the banning of certain weapons and accessory types from civilian possession. In both cases the same tactic is used, a special class of speech or weapon is carved out and then sliced off.

    The NDAA and the Patriot Act negate the protections in the 4th , 5th, 6th, and 7th Amendments, allowing such clear violations of the Constitution as indefinite detainment without charges, warrantless searches, secret warrants and indictments, denial of a fair and speedy trial by jury, and the right to confront accusers and refute evidence.

    The federal government continues to use the commerce clause disingenuously to bypass the 10th amendment and usurp powers reserved by the Constitution for the individual states.

    Those of us who look around and make note of all of these things recognize that all of the tools are rapidly falling into place that would enable a despotic administration to declare a national emergency and effectively suspend the Constitution, and with it our rights as citizens indefinitely. But if we voice our fears along these lines we are then declared to be speaking from the lunatic fringe. We are marginalized, discredited, and ridiculed by people who ought to know better, but have a pathological need to believe that all is well and that there is nothing to fear. They would have us believe that the world is a benign place, where none of these protections would ever be needed anyway. Their need to do so arises from a deep, unarticulated fear that if they admit to the possibility that these protections are necessary, they might have to actually think about possible unpleasant outcomes, and the possibility that they might have to stand up and defend these rights. They prefer to irrationally believe that America is different, and will continue to be different from all the other great empires, which have eventually fallen into ruin and despotism. They prefer not to contemplate the depth of evil to which powerful politicians, bureaucrats, and military officers are prone to sink without strong prohibitions concerning the exercise of raw power.

    I am afraid for this nation. You can call me paranoid if it makes you feel better. But it doesn’t negate the facts. Look around you. Wake up!
     
  2. salmonriverjohn

    salmonriverjohn N.W Oregon coast, Gods country Well-Known Member

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    Freedom at what price? They call us a free nation and yet we are subjected to the whims and wills of those whom sit in power as kings and queens on thrones. Think as they tell us to think, do as were allowed and no more, speak against such power and be persecuted for exercising the first amendment of the very constitution that we gave so much for and crafted to call our own. Speak out and be labeled a radical, a non conformist. Act, and be called a criminal for exorcising those very same rights. This nation was built on the backs of and with the blood of those who were trying to build a better nation, to escape the tyranny of others. I too feel a sense of fear for our nation as a whole, as we have allowed ourselves to be led into the same bondage that was fought so hard and costly to escape.

    Wake up? Yes, wake and realize that in the span of just one generation all could be lost. Because if we stand by and allow this madness to continue it surely WILL be lost.
     
  3. mancat

    mancat Kitsap County Well-Known Member

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    what can you say. it may have to come down to some of these "tools" being used before people really realize how much of a threat they are.
     
  4. ZigZagZeke

    ZigZagZeke Eugene Silver Supporter Silver Supporter 2015 Volunteer

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    I remember a similar time in our history. Nixon was president and the same attitudes were being expressed, but the target was not guns, but freedom of speech. There were "enemies" lists and outspoken prominent anti-war figures and popular performers died mysteriously and suspiciously (Morrison, Hendrix, and Joplin), and 4 people shot dead at Kent State, shot by the National Guard, all in a period of less than 12 months. In the end, Nixon overreached his abilities and his power structure, and was more or less peacefully deposed. We might see the same with Obama. Tensions are building and something will pop somewhere sooner or later.
     
  5. osterr1999

    osterr1999 Silverton, OR Active Member

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    So the question is what do we do about it? I still vote, but have given up on my vote making a difference. My new focus has been that I will teach my kids what the constitution really is about and why is it so important not to allow the government or anyone else to step on their rights. Teaching them about our founders and their thoughts on government and it's relationship to the people is the only way I can think of to fight back. I have also committed to pointing out the wrongs I see around me so that the kids can see real life examples of the government acting outside of what it was ever intended to do.
     
  6. JackThompson

    JackThompson Valley of the Demons Well-Known Member

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    For now, I see our best chances at actual change being to support leaders and public servants that feel as we do. Let them know we support them and help them make change.

    That and prepare.
     
    hker71 and (deleted member) like this.
  7. crankshaft

    crankshaft oregoncity New Member

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    #1 your not a nut
    #2 your right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  8. deen_ad

    deen_ad Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Let me make this right.
    You are not a nut or You're not a nut.
    #2 You are right or You're right.
     
    HahnsXD, mancat, hker71 and 3 others like this.
  9. GuyBMeredith

    GuyBMeredith Salem, Oregon Active Member

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    Jim Crow laws are back.

    The basis for most gun bans is the same as for the Jim Crow laws. We decided in 1964 that laws based on bigotry, ignorance, demonization and just plain hate have no place in a progressive society (be sure to emphasize that word progressive to antis), but here they are back again.

    We need to push this into the face of elitists and bigots big time. Black people had no rights back then, their freedoms were taken away and we passed laws to make those freedoms rights. We need to point out that the writers of the Constitution understood this and produced the Bill of Rights.
     
  10. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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  11. 3MTA3

    3MTA3 DMZ between Liberty and Tyranny Behind Enemy Lines Bronze Supporter

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    This time around:
    2014 Democrats take the House in a landslide. Senate majority increases to 2/3rds. Merely a coincidence that a new voting system will be used for its first time.
    2015 Constitutional convention repeals the 22nd ammendment
    2016 Obama elected Supreme Leader for Life (sound familiar?)
    It goes downhill from there
     
  12. DoubleTapDrew

    DoubleTapDrew Oregon Well-Known Member

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    That's the scariest part (so far). After all thats happened from 08-12 people STILL reelected him! Maybe to win this thing back we take the democrat approach and need a relatively unknown conservative candidate that is easy on the eyes, has a silver tongue, and LIES THROUGH HIS TEETH. "I'll give you everything you've ever wanted and make all your dreams come true". Oh by the way, I lied.
    It's scary that Claire Wolfe's quote seems to be coming true and no effort on either side is stopping it.

    I hope a charismatic republican emerges to really excite people. If the GOP continues to throw up the same RINOS that party is dead. Maybe that would be a good thing and the Libertarians can take over. Who knows.
     
  13. One-Eyed Ross

    One-Eyed Ross Winlock, WA Well-Known Member

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    Until the Republicans give up on abortion and gay rights, they'll have issues. The religious right has a death grip on the Republican party, and, regretfully, it might be the actual death of the party.

    In it's place I'd love to see a real libertarian party, with the central premise to get government OUT of our lives. One of the reasons I've liked the Dem governors here in Washington these last few go arounds, they've been do nothing governors. I like that.
     
  14. kumabear17

    kumabear17 Issaquah Active Member

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    I agree with you on the Republican Party comment. Some call it “Principle” and I can agree, but I don’t like telling anyone how to live.

    As to Washington Governors, I struggle with your belief nothing has been done. In her first 4 years she spent the surplus we had built up, drove Boeing to Chicago, mismanaged the 520 bridge, supported raising the gas tax and I just can’t think of all the rest. I know, it was the Legislature’s fault and those crappy State Engineers who designed the bridge, but she still signs off on it. Our new Governor is just starting slow. He is the farthest to the Left we’ve had in many years and, like Obama, don’t be surprised at what he ends up doing especially if he gets a 2nd term.
     
  15. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    We will not forget their names... We will not forgive.
     
  16. One-Eyed Ross

    One-Eyed Ross Winlock, WA Well-Known Member

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    I agree about Inslee...not someone to trust. He definitely deserves any bad words that go his way.
     
  17. SOrez

    SOrez SOR Active Member

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    As long as there are more people receiving benefits and people working for the government nothing will change.

    As was said on late night tv,they are not illegal aliens,they are undocumented democrat voters.

    Can you really tell any difference in the 2 politcal parties,other than type of corruption.
     
  18. ZigZagZeke

    ZigZagZeke Eugene Silver Supporter Silver Supporter 2015 Volunteer

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    People receiving benefits are not the problem. "Benefits" include disabled veterans, people who've earned Social Security retirement benefits, people who are truly disabled and cannot support themselves, and people who have through no fault of their own, lost their jobs. Remove those people from Romney's 47% and it's more like 7%. The NeoCon meme that all government benefits are undeserved and wasteful is what lost the election for Romney and may continue to cause Republicans to lose in the future. It's time to slap down that talk radio idiocy. It might sell worthless arthritis remedies and male enhancement supplements, but it's killing the Republican party.
     
  19. jfw

    jfw Clackamas county Active Member

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    Based on my concerns, some would call me a “gun nut”, a conspiracy theorist, a radical Liberal, a radical Conservative, or maybe just a nut

    Ooh! Don't forget domestic terrorist! Thats a term i am certain will be applied sooner or later...
     
    ZigZagZeke and (deleted member) like this.
  20. Kelzebubba

    Kelzebubba Fort Worth, TX/USA Public Outhouse Active Member

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    No one is more of a slave than he who thinks himself free without being so. - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe