Something is fishy

[MikeE]

Obviously it will be necessary to administer lots of exotic drugs in the course of saving his life. Torture may work to some degree and provide a degree of satisfaction, but some skillful use of psychotropic drugs while in a semi-comatose state probably works better in terms of finding out what you want to know. (Does that hurt? How about this? Increase the drip. )

My fear is that the Obongo Regime has minimal interest in dealing with Islamo-fascists given the degree to which the Muslim Brotherhood has infested the Executive Branch under King Barry. If the perps had been White Tea Partiers there would be no mercy.

Torture is un-American, period.

 

[Oregonhunter5]

Torture is un-American, period.

Then you need to make sure you never serve your country, in a outside the box way.
Torture is absolutely needed. And it is what's given you the right to enjoy your life.
You just don't want to admit it though.
Boy.

 

[MikeE]

Then you need to make sure you never serve your country, in a outside the box way.
Torture is absolutely needed. And it is what's given you the right to enjoy your life.
You just don't want to admit it though.
Boy.

First, I'm not your boy.
Next - - Amendment 8, US Constitution:"Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel or unusual punishment inflicted." If A8 is not valid, why would A2 be?
Last - this report just came out from the Constitution Project:
<broken link removed>

 

[Oregonhunter5]

First, I'm not your boy.
Next - - Amendment 8, US Constitution:"Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel or unusual punishment inflicted." If A8 is not valid, why would A2 be?
Last - this report just came out from the Constitution Project:
<broken link removed>

The US Constitution is related to Americans. And if those Americans choose not to be American, they can take a drill bit to there knee cap.

 

[MikeE]

The US Constitution is related to Americans. And if those Americans choose not to be American, they can take a drill bit to there knee cap.

Not sure i follow your logic...

 

[Father of four]

The US Constitution is related to Americans. And if those Americans choose not to be American, they can take a drill bit to there knee cap.

I totally disagree.

We should be humane to Americans but treat everyone else in the world as useless? That is not the American way.

We are and have been a Nation Of People that will and would die to help others anywhere in this world. We stand up and fight against people/governments that torture their citizens. Now granted this guy may be as guilty as anyone ever can be but he should still have his day in court. We are supposed to be a Nation that lives by morals not rules of the jungle.

 

[Father of four]

Choosing to not read an American his/her Miranda Rights because the government wants a person to answer questions just aint right. Telling a suspect that they have no rights, have no chance to have an attorney present, etc...is un-American.

Anyone of us could be blamed to be against the USA and to be treated that way would be OK?

We better be careful what We let Our government do or it could come back to haunt us.

 

[fxdc]

I think they gave up their US rights when they set the bombs off!!!!

Just as a burglar , rapist, any POS that would come in your home in the middle of nite or day..... They gave up their rights as soon as they decided to violate mine!!!!!!

And I remind you all it is a HOMELAND SECURITY issuse., AS IN.
My home!
MY LAND!
MY SECURITY!!!!

 

[Father of four]

I agree when the fight is on, but not the same to me after the battle is over and the opponent has surrendered.

Just my .02

 

[MikeE]

Constitutional rights exist for our own protection. The way it works is, even a POS bomber has constitutional rights. That way those rights are safeguarded for you if you need them.

 

[CascadeSam]

The poor mass media! Many in the mass media were hoping that the bombers would turn out to be angry white conservative Christian men who were former Boy Scouts from a Red state.

 

[salmonriverjohn]

Right - because nothing is as important in a criminal investigation/prosecution as screwing up the evidence by making it inadmissible in court because it was obtained under torture - and violating the 4th, 5th, 6th, and 8th amendments to the US Constitution (we had to destroy the Constitution in order to protect it...). Who cares, as long as it makes me feel better, as a TV viewer...?

Do you believe for even a second that torture isn't still going on, or have real value? If someone had your wife and kid held and were going to execute them at 12 pm and you just happened to run upon one of their comrades who held all the info in his pea brain as to their location etc. are you going to tell me that you wouldn't extricate every finger nail and Black and decker drill their knee caps to get the information out of them by 11 AM? Id bet those rights wouldn't mean squat to you then.

I stand by my original thoughts, this bastard needs to sing like a canary at what ever means necessary. And as far as his rights, as a terrorist that has committed mass murder with a weapon of mass destruction, be it an American or foreigner, he gave up those rights. Why do you think he wasn't given Miranda rights.

 

[salmonriverjohn]

Food for thought.

Quote
"The National Defense Authorization Act states how the military is to be funded, but also includes a number of controversial provisions on arresting and holding suspected terrorists, which at first drove Obama to threaten a veto.

He retreated from that threat after Congress added provisions that took the ultimate authority to detain suspects from the military's hands and gave it to the president. Congress also clarified that civilian law enforcement agencies -- such as the FBI -- would still have authority to investigate terrorism and added a provision that asserts nothing in the detention measures changes current law regarding U.S. citizens.

Still, the signing on New Year's Eve as few people were paying attention angered civil liberties advocates, who argue that the law for the first time spells out certain measures that have not actually been tested all the way to the Supreme Court, including the possibility of detaining citizens in military custody without trial for as long as there is a war on terror". End quote.

 

[Both Eyes Open]

So sure, we can debate his rights or lack thereof, what really blows my mind was how all the people of Watertown lost their rights. Warrantless searches (and seizure, anyone else hear the cop and milk story?) as well as removing innocent people from their homes at gun point only to search them! Seems it was a good martial law training course!

 

[MikeE]

Do you believe for even a second that torture isn't still going on, or have real value?

Just read this:
U.S. Tortured Detainees and Got Little of Value: Report - Bloomberg

 

[salmonriverjohn]

Just read this:
U.S. Tortured Detainees and Got Little of Value: Report - Bloomberg

And your point is?

 

[Archer762]

article today said the first died because his brother drove over him while cops were wrestling with him on the ground

 

[MikeE]

And your point is?

That torture is illegal, immoral, and doesn't work.
Here is a quote from retire Brig. General David Irvine, former army intelligence officer and interrogation trainer, and member of the Constitution Project Task Force report on torture after 9/11.

BRIG. GEN. DAVID IRVINE: Public record strongly suggests that there was no useful information gained from going to the dark side that saved the hundreds of thousands or tens of thousands of lives that have been claimed. There are many instances in that public record to support the notion that we have been badly misled by false confessions that have been derived from brutal interrogations. And unfortunately, it is a fact that people—people will just say whatever they think needs to be said if the pain becomes more than they can bear. Other people are so immune to pain that they will die before they will reveal what an interrogator may wish to know.
I’ll just say, in conclusion, that in 2001 the United States had had a great deal of experience with tactical and strategic interrogations. We had been very successful over a long period of time in learning how to do this and do it very, very well. Unfortunately, when the policies were developed that led us to the dark side, many of those who were involved in formulating those policies had no experience with interrogation, had no experience with law enforcement, had no experience with the military, in how these matters are approached. One of the most successful FBI interrogators prior to 2001 was a guy named Joe Navarro. And Joe is noted for having said—and he was probably one of the handful of strategic interrogators qualified to interrogate and debrief a high-value al-Qaeda prisoner. But Joe said, "I only need three things. If you’ll give me three things, I will get whatever someone has to say, and I will do it without breaking the law. First of all, I need a quiet room. Second, I want to know what the rules are, because I don’t want to get in trouble. And third, I need enough time to become that person’s best and only friend. And if you give me those three conditions, I will get whatever that person has to say, and I will get it effectively and quickly and safely and within the terms of the law." So, we can do it well when we want to. We need to do more, looking at our history, to remind us what worked and why it worked, and not resort to what may seem at the time to be expedient, clever or necessary.

www.democracynow.org/4/17/2013/

 

[Angie]

I think they gave up their US rights when they set the bombs off!!!!

Just as a burglar , rapist, any POS that would come in your home in the middle of nite or day..... They gave up their rights as soon as they decided to violate mine!!!!!!

And I remind you all it is a HOMELAND SECURITY issuse., AS IN.
My home!
MY LAND!
MY SECURITY!!!!

And you are 100% certain this kid did this why? Because the media told you he is the suspect? Because the police arrested him? This is why we have trials instead of lynch mobs in today's society. Unless, of course, the police tag you as a suspect of a high profile case. Then we have guilty with no chance of proving yourself innocent because the .gov deems you unworthy of your Miranda Rights even though you are a citizen.

Currently, the only evidence I've seen is that they were at the location. I'm sure the .gov has collected more evidence, but I doubt you've been allowed to view it. Perhaps I'm wrong.

 

[Father of four]

Great post Angie!!!!