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So I transfered my CHL and...

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by 1337BaldEagle, Feb 20, 2014.

  1. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    I noticed that their informational pamphlet was different than the last time I checked!

    So, I'm writing the office again but this time...


    Dear Sheriff Riley,
    I am writing this upon receiving my CHL (transferred back to Linn County). On Reading the enclosed pamphlet I noticed the rules, regulations and the advice your department gives CHL holders. Two portions of the pamphlet stood out to me first one that read:
    “Schools
    Persons who possess valid concealed handgun licenses are not prohibited from carrying their weapons on school property.”
    Second:
    “State Forest Lands
    You may NOT possess loaded firearms on State Forest lands that have been designated by the Forester as “Designated Recreation Areas”. These areas may include, but are not limited to campgrounds, camping areas, day use areas, trailheads, staging areas, and boat launch sites. (OAR 629-025-0050)”
    The reason this stood out was because the last time I received this pamphlet several years ago the “schools” section was typed different then. I notified Sheriff Tim Muller at the time that the Oregon Court of Appeals heard on March 29, 2011, Oregon Firearms Educational Foundation V Board of Higher Education and Oregon University System A142974 and that they ruled in favor of Oregon Firearms Federation sighting that:
    “Thus, the question here, as in Doe, is whether the challenged enactment--
    7 OAR 580-022-0045(3)--represents the sort of exercise of "authority to regulate" that is
    8 preempted by ORS 166.170(1). Although it is clear from the legislative history that the
    9 legislature did not expressly contemplate whether a state agency's administrative rules
    10 might be encompassed within the preemption of ORS 166.170(1), this particular rule
    11 would seem on its face to be the type of regulation that was intended to be preempted.
    12 Administrative rules, unlike internal employment policies, have the regulatory force and
    13 effect of law.”

    …” Accordingly, the rule exceeds
    10 the agency's authority, ORS 183.400(4)(b), and is invalid.
    11 OAR 580-022-0045(3) held invalid.

    The Oregon Court of Appeals ruled that since Oregon Administrative Rules carried the “force of law” any OAR made, with respect to firearms, regulates them. If the municipality has not been “expressly authorized by state statute” (ORS 166.170) then their OAR is invalid.
    I would like to know where in ORS does the State Legislative Body “expressly authorized by state statute”, “the Forester” to regulate firearms through OAR 629-025-0050 shown in your pamphlet under State Forest Lands.
    I believe there is none.
    The statute sighted supposedly giving authority is ORS 530.050. This statute gives the Forester the right to make OAR, just like ORS 351.070 allows the OUS to make OAR. No were in either statute does the State Legislative Body “expressly authorized by state statute” the regulation of firearms.
    There are several examples where OAR’s have been overturned or modified to comply with ORS 166.170. One example is with ODFW. They admit on their website here: http://www.dfw.state.or.us/resources/hunting/big_game/regulations/weapons.as that:
    “In 2003, the Oregon Attorney General reviewed the statute and determined the Oregon Fish and Wildlife Commission (Commission) cannot limit what firearms can be carried or possessed during hunting seasons.”
    I contest that the section on State Forest Lands within your pamphlet is inaccurate and that OAR 629-025-0050 would not hold a test from the Attorney General or the Oregon Court System.
    I hope you will take my argument seriously since I rather like camping and if I was barred from taking my firearm the result would be me not going.
    I type all of this with the upmost respect for you and for the legacy you are continuing within the law enforcement community.


    Sincerely,



    How does this sound?
     
  2. Caveman Jim

    Caveman Jim West of Oly Springer Slayer 2016 Volunteer

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    Maybe it pertains only to long guns (rifles) up in forest lands?
     
  3. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    It wouldn't matter. Oregon law restricts municipalities other than the legislature from making OAR's for "firearms, ammunition, how they can be possessed, transferred or purchased." And a CHL in Oregon doesn't just apply to handguns. It applies to long guns as well. So, on either account I don't think it matters.
     
  4. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    Is it really an "argument" or is it a point? If I was the person receiving this the word "argument" just stands out as confrontational. Just my opinion though.

    Is the person you are sending this to one that is able to make changes? If not should you be writing someone else?
     
  5. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    Well, last time I wrote the Sheriff the "Schools" section changed from "you can't carry" to "you may carry" so I'm assuming that Linn County Sheriff has some input in what his pamphlets say.

    As for "argument" I just viewed "argument" as a "case being brought" much like what you would find at a debate team setting. Not a argument as in yelling screaming or intense disagreement.
     
  6. Nwcid

    Nwcid Yakima and N of Spokane Well-Known Member

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    No worries and I do understand what you are saying. I was just commenting that "argument" could make someone defensive. Not saying it is right or wrong. There are people/companies that spend/get paid lots of money to word things best, I am not in that profession. I do deal with a lot of people and I can say for sure presentation can make a huge difference.
     
  7. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    OP - your letter seems good to me.

    You are not accusing the Sheriff of any wrongdoing, you are bringing to his attention what appears to be an error.
    This seems like a good thing to me.