Sniper Rifles (not)

[VanceInWA]

I just want to get this off my chest. I keep seeing references to "sniper rifles" in various gun forums (maybe not this one; hopefully not). "Sniper rifle" is not a thing, despite that the term is ubiquitous (I suspect RPG games are to blame). A rifle specially designed for accuracy, reliability, concealment, etc. at long ranges (say 1000+ yards) does not automatically make it a "sniper rifle." Even a rifle being actively used by a qualified military sniper to kill an enemy combatant at long range is not a "sniper rifle," it is a specially designed long-range rifle being used by a sniper. See the difference? People are confusing the design of a rifle with the role of the person using it. Depending on its weight, the same rifle may be used for match shooting, varminting, big game hunting, whatever and it does not magically change from a "sniper rifle" in one context to a "hunting rifle" in the other. Okay, done with this rant, but had to get it off my chest...

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[Certaindeaf]

Oh now.

 

[Nosferatu]

I've never hunted snipe, so don't have a frame of reference here.

 

[pharmseller]

Everyone gets shot by a sniper these days.

 

[American123]

I just want to get this off my chest. I keep seeing references to "sniper rifles" in various gun forums (maybe not this one; hopefully not). "Sniper rifle" is not a thing, despite that the term is ubiquitous (I suspect RPG games are to blame). A rifle specially designed for accuracy, reliability, concealment, etc. at long ranges (say 1000+ yards) does not automatically make it a "sniper rifle." Even a rifle being actively used by a qualified military sniper to kill an enemy combatant at long range is not a "sniper rifle," it is a specially designed long-range rifle being used by a sniper. See the difference? People are confusing the design of a rifle with the role of the person using it. Depending on its weight, the same rifle may be used for match shooting, varminting, big game hunting, whatever and it does not magically change from a "sniper rifle" in one context to a "hunting rifle" in the other. Okay, done with this rant, but had to get it off my chest...

Great, just great… now you've spilled the secret that nearly every hunting rifle can be used for the purposes of sniping. I anticipate a huge uptick in heart attacks as politicians now go after these dangerous hunting rifles and all the fudds start having coronaries.

Haha…

 

[Ura-Ki]

I can see your point of view, and I certainly understand where your coming from, so I get it!
I agree the term gets tossed around a lot, probably more then it should, BUT, I think you are ether forgetting something important here, or simply were not aware of it!
As a former service member, some times I filled the roll of Designated Marksman, went through several of the "Sniper Training courses" and deployed numerous times in that capacity. That said, there are in fact, actual Sniper Rifles, tools designed for the express purpose of hunting humans where ever there is a need, usually beyond the expected range of a fighting rifle and the rifleman who wields it! These rifles are built to far tighter tolerances, using very precise tools and equipment, by highly skilled armorers, and then hand fitted to the very unique specifics of the shooter. In this, these rifles are far and beyond any hunting, or target rifle you will ever find, though some are more then capable of matching the range and accuracy, it's also about HOW these rifles are used, as you said, quite different, by a highly trained Sniper. There has been a renaissance of sorts, since the early 1990's folks have sought to emulate the rifles and skills practiced by our men in uniform, and in that, some very good rifles and equipment have become available to the civilian shooting enthusiast, so much so, that it's often very hard to tell any difference between a full custom $16,000 Sako TRG with armorers support, and the off the shelf TRG you can run out and buy for $4000 ( Not including optic, ammo, and accessories) and be out shootin the same afternoon!! You can buy a Remington M-40 clone that is for all intents and purposes, an exact copy of the U.S. Military M-40X, for about 1/4 the price, and very few could tell the difference in performance, until you hand it to an actual sniper!

The point is, there IS such a thing as a Sniper Rifle, and while the term gets tossed about a lot, usually by the uninformed, it none the less does describe an actual tool, rather then a host of similar looking and feeling tools that are NOT!

Keep in mind, throughout the U.S. Military's history, Sniping and Snipers have always been looked down upon, they never had been truly embraced as a legitimate fighting force or skill set, often seen as an ugly necessity instead, to be used only when needed, and quickly forgotten and never mentioned after. In the U.S. formal Sniper Training was a very limited sub-set of training, usually done outside regular training evolutions and kept to the minimum, and when war came, used rarely until it became a necessity, and soon forgotten when the fighting stopped! That all changed in the 90's with the first Gulf War, and our ongoing war on terror, the U.S. Military was faced with a whole host of new challenges on the modern battlefield, and only a trained sniper could address those challenges, so training, ( And the publicity, public acceptance of) has ramped up markedly, and while some still take a very dim view of this unique method of fighting, it has become far more mainstream within the services and far more accepted, and even critical to any future war fighting!
The U.S. Sniper is here to stay, and that's a good thing! And like most things American, has really been embraced tightly and taken to whole new levels of range and accuracy, something both civilian and military can benefit from!

 

[VanceInWA]

I can see your point of view, and I certainly understand where your coming from, so I get it!
I agree the term gets tossed around a lot, probably more then it should, BUT, I think you are ether forgetting something important here, or simply were not aware of it!
As a former service member, some times I filled the roll of Designated Marksman, went through several of the "Sniper Training courses" and deployed numerous times in that capacity. That said, there are in fact, actual Sniper Rifles, tools designed for the express purpose of hunting humans where ever there is a need, usually beyond the expected range of a fighting rifle and the rifleman who wields it! These rifles are built to far tighter tolerances, using very precise tools and equipment, by highly skilled armorers, and then hand fitted to the very unique specifics of the shooter. In this, these rifles are far and beyond any hunting, or target rifle you will ever find, though some are more then capable of matching the range and accuracy, it's also about HOW these rifles are used, as you said, quite different, by a highly trained Sniper. There has been a renaissance of sorts, since the early 1900's folks have sought to emulate the rifles and skills practiced by our men in uniform, and in that, some very good rifles and equipment have become available to the civilian shooting enthusiast, so much so, that it's often very hard to tell any difference between a full custom $16,000 Sako TRG with armorers support, and the off the shelf TRG you can run out and buy for $4000 ( Not including optic, ammo, and accessories) and be out shootin the same afternoon!! You can buy a Remington M-40 clone that is for all intents and purposes, an exact copy of the U.S. Military M-40X, for about 1/4 the price, and very few could tell the difference in performance, until you hand it to an actual sniper!

The point is, there IS such a thing as a Sniper Rifle, and while the term gets tossed about a lot, usually by the uninformed, it none the less does describe an actual tool, rather then a host of similar looking and feeling tools that are NOT!

Keep in mind, throughout the U.S. Military's history, Sniping and Snipers have always been looked down upon, they never had been truly embraced as a legitimate fighting force or skill set, often seen as an ugly necessity instead, to be used only when needed, and quickly forgotten and never mentioned after. In the U.S. formal Sniper Training was a very limited sub-set of training, usually done outside regular training evolutions and kept to the minimum, and when war came, used rarely until it became a necessity, and soon forgotten when the fighting stopped! That all changed in the 90's with the first Gulf War, and our ongoing war on terror, the U.S. Military was faced with a whole host of new challenges on the modern battlefield, and only a trained sniper could address those challenges, so training, ( And the publicity, public acceptance of) has ramped up markedly, and while some still take a very dim view of this unique method of fighting, it has become far more mainstream within the services and far more accepted, and even critical to any future war fighting!
The U.S. Sniper is here to stay, and that's a good thing! And like most things American, has really been embraced tightly and taken to whole new levels of range and accuracy, something both civilian and military can benefit from!

Excellent clarification Ura-Ki, thank you!

 

[3MTA3]

"Simper rifle" the next emotionally charged term that will be used to further disarm us once they do away with all the semi automatic rifles.

A "sniper rifle" will be any rifle, regardless of action that can hold more rounds of ammunition than the legal limit for hunting or has detachable "quick change" magazines. Threaded barrels will be a no-no as will any ammunition Shannon Watts or somesuch deems excessively powerful. No pointy bullets because they look scary. I would also expect scopes to be severely limited in power as well. No bipods either you maniac! .

 

[Ura-Ki]

"Simper rifle" the next emotionally charged term that will be used to further disarm us once they do away with all the semi automatic rifles.

A "sniper rifle" will be any rifle, regardless of action that can hold more rounds of ammunition than the legal limit for hunting or has detachable "quick change" magazines. Threaded barrels will be a no-no as will any ammunition Shannon Watts or somesuch deems excessively powerful. No pointy bullets because they look scary. I would also expect scopes to be severely limited in power as well. No bipods either you maniac! .

If only they knew what I can do with this!


It ain't the tool, it's the intent!

And the skills!
Under 900 meters, your dead!

 

[FireArm]

you're arguing oranges and oranges...

 

[3MTA3]

If only they knew what I can do with this!
View attachment 1104512

It ain't the tool, it's the intent!

And the skills!
Under 900 meters, your dead!

They keep pushing it they just might find out! They are going after every weapon the citizens can use against a tyrant government. Anybody who thinks their "hunting rifle" is safe doesn't realize that after them skeery assautl military rifles and them skeery sniper rifled are gone the next PR campaign with be about hunters cruelly killing Bambi.

 

[3MTA3]

you're arguing oranges and oranges...

This. Is. NOT. CNN...

 

[orygun]

You mean to tell me this isn't a sporterized sniper rifle? Geeze, even the Queen would say it was.

 

[TTSX]

This is an anti material rifle, though the vast, and I mean VAST majority of people will instantly recognize this as a Barrett "sniper rifle." I let it slide just the same as I let clip/magazine and caliber/cartridge slide. Let people enjoy things, Karen

 

[TTSX]

If only they knew what I can do with this!
View attachment 1104512

It ain't the tool, it's the intent!

And the skills!
Under 900 meters, your dead!

What can you hit at 900 meters with that, Quigley? A house?

Kidding. I don't doubt your ability, certainly my own with that thing. What is it, if you don't mind sharing?

 

[Nosferatu]

View attachment 1104524
This is an anti material rifle, though the vast, and I mean VAST majority of people will instantly recognize this as a Barrett "sniper rifle." I let it slide just the same as I let clip/magazine and caliber/cartridge slide. Let people enjoy things, Karen

As long as it doesn't have a 3x9x40 scope

 

[orygun]

As long as it doesn't have a 3x9x40 scope

isn't that 1080?

 

[Ura-Ki]

What can you hit at 900 meters with that, Quigley? A house?

Kidding. I don't doubt your ability, certainly my own with that thing. What is it, if you don't mind sharing?

This is a M-1855 Colt side hammer revolving rifle, series four, Frontier Rifle circa 1864 .50 Caliber. Shoots a 450 grain hollow base conical over 80 grains Holy Black ( FFg), pretty much a match for the more modern .50/100 sharps cartridge rifle or similar! Has both Mil sliding leaf and long range peep rear sight, it's exceptionally accurate if loaded properly!

 

[Nosferatu]

isn't that 1080?

You must be in @Andy54Hawken's math class.

 

[TTSX]

isn't that 1080?

As long as it doesn't have a 3x9x40 scope

Is THAT how they figure out scope price points??