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Should we weigh 22LR for better accuracy?

Discussion in 'Ammunition & Reloading' started by mr.revolverguy, Dec 20, 2015.

  1. mr.revolverguy

    mr.revolverguy Ohio Active Member

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    Ok I know this has been debated a number of times and this is not meant to start an a big bruhaha. I also know that there is a sticky and possibly more in depth analysis. My range day was strictly meant to test my new toy but the data started me to thinking about this again.

    I got the ProChrono Digital-Link add on which allows you to control the unit via bluetooth and gives you some additional information like barometric pressure and temperature as well as timing of each shot. For these test I am using an IPhone to control and record everything from the Digital Link module.

    In testing this product today and watching what was happening on my target this question came back up for me. Should I be weighing these cartridges? Seeing so many comment that this procedure made no difference I have never tried it, but now I am wondering if the old benchrest marksmen knew something or had some knowledge that has slipped away with time.

    I also know that most discussions have said it depends upon ammo. Well I did test Wolf Match Extra, SK Standard Plus and CCI SV today across 4 rifles and saw the same patterns on target.

    Curious of your thoughts about what I noticed today. Would I have even seen a difference in weight of these cartridges?
    Digital Link

    DSC02712.jpg
    Anschutz Weaver 3-9
    DSC02716.jpg
    Target 5 shots fired at 50 yards:The two shots on the outside of the group are the first two shots. Pay close attention to how they registered across the chronograph. These shots would be numbers 11-15
    DSC02718.jpg
    Data From Digital Link Pro Chronograph
    Chrono.jpg
    Chronograph Data/Graph Generated by Digital Link:Shots 11 and 12 were my first shots on the target and were the outermost, which at first made it seem as if it were going to be a large group but the last 3 shots, 13, 14, 15 tightened things up quite a bit.
    Image-1.jpg

    I will be posting more pictures and data from the other rifles and ammo at http://www.dayattherange.com
     
    Sgt Nambu likes this.
  2. ConcreteJungle

    ConcreteJungle Eugene Well-Known Member

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    should you be weighing each round...YES!
    if you want consistent results, then you need more controls in place. one of the controls would be to weigh each round and separate them based on their weights. then you group them together based on the weight and shoot them in those groups.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2015
  3. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf SE Portland Well-Known Member

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    Are you the guy that only posts stuff to pimp his own website? Oh yea. Almost forgot.
    Yea, sometimes I'll weigh down my cargo pockets with .22lr ammo but why bother?
    You can reload most all handgun ammo for $30/1000.
     
  4. Velzey

    Velzey Estacada, Oregon Gunsmith Gunsmith Bronze Vendor Bronze Supporter

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    If got a 60+ year old Remington model 37 with a vintage 15x unertl scope on top...It doesn't care what I feed it....It groups 3/4" groups or less all day long! At 50 yards+.

    I've known allot of old time .22 bench shooters and they found a commercial round that shot well in their gun, and they bought a bubblegum load of it! Never a mention of weight...
     
    mjbskwim, ron and BoonDocks36 like this.
  5. Certaindeaf

    Certaindeaf SE Portland Well-Known Member

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    And if you're ever trying to actually shoot a group (and not be Mr. Internet Hollywood Pimp Daddy), never ever use a "shootnsee" and destroy the aiming point with bullet strikes. just saying
     
  6. Mark W.

    Mark W. Silverton, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    My Savage MKII FVT with a Mueller 4.5-14 APT mil dot scope will make a 1/2" 5 shot group all day long with CCI Blazer or Federal Lightning 22LR. With quality target ammo even better.
     
    BoonDocks36 likes this.
  7. Lilhigbee

    Lilhigbee SE Portland Visit Target550.com Gold Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I'm not sure what the advantage of weighing them would be. The difference could be in the bullet, brass, powder or primer, or more likely, a combination of all of them. Unless you are going to pull each one down and weigh each component separately (not sure how you separate the primer from the brass) the variation doesn't really mean anything.
     
  8. BoonDocks36

    BoonDocks36 Oregon, in the boondocks Christian. Conservative. Male.

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    Could The first two shots be off due to barrel warmup ? ? ?

    I have a Custom accurized 10-22, and I once used 22 Magnum brass as my ~targets~ If I hit but only say half a cartridge was gone, that was an 8, 9 was if the cartridge only had one side left, think a large C cut out . . . The TEN FACTOR was separating the Rim from the base . . .

    My scores were consistently at least 98/100 out of ten shot groups. Shooting was done out the back door of my VW BUS, and snow on the ground, no winds absolutely Zero Winds.

    Four Power scope . . . Twenty Five yards . . . . Years later, on my on 20 acres, I would head shoot squirrels for dinners . . .

    But I grew up with a 22 in my arms, let's see . . . Over 55 years now ? ? ? Maybe 54

    I'm so old God let me name Dirt . . .

    I gave Docking lessons to Noah, on that Ark he Piloted . . .

    Gave Gardening instructions to Adam's Off Spring . . .

    All of the above really happened, but, Well some of the above happened only in my Mind ! ! !

    philip, stretching the Truth is about the only excercise that I can do, until my Rotator Cuff Surgery is 100% healed . . . But the MEDS are Great ! ! ! :D
     
  9. SinisterSouthpaw

    SinisterSouthpaw SW WA Active Member

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    ....and don't forget to measure the rims to see if some rounds might have more or less primer--oh and base to ogive measure with a comaprator made for rimfire cartridges--and balance to make sure the primer got distributed evenly all around---all this and weighing for a factory rifle------as the great one said---har hardy har har
     
  10. Capn Jack

    Capn Jack Wet-Stern Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Just fire a box of cartridges from several different manufactures. See which manufacturer your rifle likes best and go from there. Anything else is "Pik 'n Fly $hit out of the pepper.":p
     
    Lilhigbee likes this.
  11. Capn Jack

    Capn Jack Wet-Stern Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    The DPMS Bull Barrel on my AR seems to like the cheapest, ArmScor and the most expensive, CCI Stingers and nothing in between.:rolleyes: Go figure....:p
     
  12. thorborg

    thorborg portland oregon Well-Known Member 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    If you're looking for poor mans target loads; Weighin no good without measurin. To speed things you can even buy a go no go sizing tool.
    But honestly, seems like a lot of equipment and falderal for shooting spit wads. Not knockin your passion, Lord knows a lot of us spend a lot of time diddling with things that make no sense. puzzling is the application of that level of technology on a product that is unable to be controlled or standardized as you can with hand loading the centerfires.
     
  13. Joe13

    Joe13 NW of Vancouver Opinionated & Blunt Bronze Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    Unless your weighing the individual components then it is meaningless.
     
  14. Capn Jack

    Capn Jack Wet-Stern Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    If you're not zeroing in a squirrel shooter, it's just an exercise in trying to stack holes.:D

    But I love it....:p One hole groups are easier with a .458.:eek:
     
    rick benjamin likes this.
  15. mr.revolverguy

    mr.revolverguy Ohio Active Member

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    I appreciate the comments, this was about finding poor mans accurate 22 ammo yes :)and these were sorted by rim thickness. I have been blessed to be a member of a great club and friends that let me borrow or use their equipment. I think weighing and sorting may make a difference in the local club match where they limit the type of ammo you can use by putting a price limit on it. With more expensive ammo possibly the manufacturer has done the sorting for us?

    Didn't mean to piss anyone off either or pimp my own website, this was a serious question for me. My website is purely my way of continuing to support our 2nd amendment rights since I physically can't anymore for uncle sam. It is meant to be a place where anyone could read an unbiased review. I dedicated my entire young adult life to serving the great United States of America so your opinion and willingness to freely express your opinion about me pimping a website is ok with me. But if you visit said website you will find not one advertisement or sponsor, I get nothing at all in return. Excuse my ignorance but I thought pimping had a little something to do with getting something in return financially?:)
     
    rick benjamin likes this.
  16. rick benjamin

    rick benjamin USA, Or, Damascus Secure the drama Silver Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    I like your work, we think along the same paths.
    I weighed and sorted.
    Measured rim thickness and sorted.
    Re-crowned the muzzle.
    Then around 2008, boolits vanished from the shelves.
    put down my tools, haven't picked them back up yet.
     
  17. noylj

    noylj high desert Active Member

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    Real target shooters sort by head space (rim thickness). Never read a single article showing any improved accuracy, but that is what many Olympic/Bullseye/etc. competitors do.
    Many folks believe in consistency so much, that they trim cases that head space on the case mouth, thus destroying accuracy by increasing head space.
    All you can do is try it for yourself and see if it is worth it.
    However, unless you are shooting 100 yds or more, I can bet it is a waste of time.
    Look at exterior ballistics and SEE if the velocity variation really makes any different to the POI, given your own abilities. Out to 50 yds or more, you'll see that almost any velocity virtually overlaps the trajectory of any other velocity you are going to see.