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Should we be on the offense instead of defense?

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by Karma, Jan 11, 2013.

  1. Karma

    Karma the woods in Oregon Active Member

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    I was just watching the news and found myself wondering why we (gun owners) always seem to find ourselves playing defense concerning our rights. With other far more controversial issues out there, why do we allow this to happen?

    A great example would be abortion. You would be hard pressed to find any liberal out there who at the mere mention of seem the topic, who won't scream at the to of their lungs about "rights". I have yet to see the right to abortion spelled out in the constitution as is the right to best arms. Still, the topic of abortion doesn't seem to be something up for discussion. To make matters worse, i saw on the news that we borrowed over 500 million from China that went to fund abortions. Taxpayers are funding this whether they believe in it or not, yet the second amendment hangs by a thread.

    My thought is, what would happen if conservatives launched a full scale attack on the liberals for a change on a issue close to their hearts such as this? Would they forget about attacking us in order to preserve their "rights"? Would they think twice about attacking others rights the next time? I'm just tired of defending my right to bear arms to a bunch of people who constantly are looking to attack that right. Maybe the offensive would be a nice place to be for a change. Just a thought.

    Let me be clear, that my intent isn't to discuss abortion. I'm just Linkin at those two issues that are largely left vs right, that have or country divided in half. There are some definite differences in how the perceived rights are treated.
     
  2. speeddemon94

    speeddemon94 The Rogue Well-Known Member

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    Because like all rights, it's never a problem until it is. So we get comfortable and complacent, and we never seem ready when things like this pop up.


    Complacency kills.
     
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  3. Just Me

    Just Me Peoples Republik of Oregon Active Member

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    I must shamefully admit that I have been one of the complacent ones. I did not join the NRA until last week. This week I hear biden mention bho using the EO, so last night I joined OFF. Is it good that I joined the groups that have been on the front lines for so long? Yes. Is it too late? I don't know. I can tell you that I am not patting myself on the back for finally joining the fight. On the contrary, I feel like the guy who was late to the fight and only brought one box of ammo.

    As for Karma's point about going on the offensive, you are correct. Can you imagine if we approached home defense like we have the fight for the 2A? The bad guy is at the bedroom door with an axe and here we are scrambling to find some .22 rounds for our single shot derringer.


    ** I will also add that just joining 2A rights groups is not enough. I WILL become involved in the political process as a voice for 2A folks, whether it be town hall meetings, candidate forums, or anything else. My voice will be heard.
     
  4. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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    It is diffiicult to debate facts or help the uninformed understand that the media is government/corp controlled - the key word is controlled - and has a handed down agenda by its owners.

    What is interesting is that for the very first time a lot of pro 2A and gun enthusiasts are just now realizing this for the first time over an issue they care about greatly. They are confused at to why 'the facts' are not being discussed openly on 'the news.' Why key words and lies are repeated constantly on every channel.

    Well wake up. We do not have real unbiased truthful MSM news in this country. If this is your first time getting this message you are late to the party. Many other truths about a lot of subjects have been distorted or deleted by the gov media before the current gun grab issue. These other lies might have been gobbled up by you like candy because on these other issues the message was comforting, and if it was on TV, it must be true.

    When they fully control everything that is covered in the MSM (and they do) then you have the minds of the vast majority of the sheep in your grasp because sheep will always follow an authority figure's message via the boob tube over any facts shared otherwise. Their beliefs or opinions are handed to them - they are not formed by individual, rational thought.

    Greatly successful, but very poorly executed freedom-stealing false flag events were only made successful with the complicity of a complete locked down filtered media in this free country of ours.

    What you will now most likely see going forward are more Sandy Hook and Joker type scripted/patsy events to push a gun registration/grab over the goal line. The media hype (and lies) will be on full volume. Since the only defense to such media and gov deception will be 'its video games' or other inept BS, my guess is that strict 'gun control' is a sure thing, not if, but when.

    The 98% cannot even comprehend these previous sentences because they are so inurd to the system of lies around them that they are functioning zombies. Sadly, that is just the way things are and that probably won't change.
     
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  5. EZLivin

    EZLivin SW of PDX Well-Known Member

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    I think gun owners are inherently too "logical" and "polite" in comparison to their rabid anti-2nd Amendment rivals. That politeness shows up in every other rabid-Left vs logical-Right argument too. Gun owners expect the rabid-Left (and their representatives) to succomb to their logical and historical arguments, which will NEVER be the case since logic and history means nothing to emotionally-driven, rabid anti-Second Amendment Leftists.

    I don't know about going after one of their "pet" so-called "rights," but I do think pro-2nd Amendment folks need to get off their a**es and make it clear(visually and audibly) to their representatives, and to the opposition, that they represent a significant percentage of the population.
     
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  6. kibs45

    kibs45 Portland Active Member

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    I can't tell you how many times I have sat down and tried to talk reason them, get them to agree with, and see my points, but then hear either "but I just know better", or "I still don't agree". I haven't figured out why people are so willfully ignorant, but it seems to be an epidemic. I don't know that being a rabid person is better, but the logical reasoning sure hasn't worked so far. Personally I quit bending over backwards to be cordial. It accomplished nothing.
     
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  7. gehrheart

    gehrheart fidalgo island Well-Known Member

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    yes.

    We should alway be on the offence for liberty. ALWAYS.

    Defence means your to late...
     
  8. EZLivin

    EZLivin SW of PDX Well-Known Member

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    Yes. But step back in history for a moment. The Vietnam Era. The country was sucked into it via a false flag, and the MSM of the time were willing accomplices. MSM cheerleaders began reporting "kills" on the nightly news so Americans could scream and cheer whenever we whacked more of "them" then they whacked of "us." The Gov and MSM controlled it all. But something happened. Young people had had enough. Opposition formed on the campuses. Demonstrations sprung up, and some innocent people were killed by our own troops (National Guard). Demonstrations persisted, opposition to the war increased, and eventually we pulled out of Vietnam. I think the mood at home was the reason we got out.

    So I would argue that Gov and MSM collusion is not the only force out there. They are successful until people have had "enough." It is up to every generation (and individual person) to define what "enough" is.
     
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  9. dmancornell

    dmancornell Portland, OR New Member

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    The welfare/police state was created to bribe/lull people into compliance. The bar for what's enough has been raised so high it is practically impossible to roll back the regime.
     
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  10. just dan

    just dan PDX Active Member

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    In short, Yes. Yes, we should be on the offense. We should be and should remain proactive. Just joining the NRA, OFF or any other group isn't enough.
    Become one of them. Demonstrations. March on the capitol. Be courteous and kind, but be proactive and firm.

    Just my opinion.
     
  11. fuhr52

    fuhr52 Lane County. Oregon Well-Known Member

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    More innocent lives are snuffed out daily by doctors in the name of convenience and woman's rights than from gun violence, but that's ok it's normal. The real issue, in my opinion, is what is in the way of the socialist take over of the United State. That would be the first and second amendment. They are the two that keep the Republic in check. The Biden task force is nothing more than smoke and mirrors to justify an attack on the second amendment.
     
  12. EZLivin

    EZLivin SW of PDX Well-Known Member

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    If it isn't rolled back I'll bet it collapses under its own weight. Historically, that is what happens. But getting from "here" to "there" won't likely be pleasant. And who can say what "there" will look like either. But I don't think the people decades ago that predicted a breakup of the US into a different sort of confederation of regions or states are too far off the mark. The distinction between the West Coast/Northeast and the rest of the country is really evident. That doesn't mean the USA is going away, but it could mean the governing and political structure will look significantly different a decade or two from now. I look back at pre-Revolution/post-Revolution, pre-Civil War/post-Civil War, pre-WWII/post-WWII for examples of how, in a short time, the US can change. I think we are at one of those key inflection points again.
     
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  13. Karma

    Karma the woods in Oregon Active Member

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    I just find it funny that we as a group, are made out to be violent, unstable, and aggressive, when nothing is further from the truth. We tend to sit back and live life, until its almost to late, then we act. On the flip side, libs trend to participate in violence, get angry at the mention of their pet projects, and attack any rights that they don't personally care about. I just think maybe we should learn from them.

    I learned when i was a kid, that if you don't fight back against bullies, you become a target for every bully around. On the other hand, if you punch that SOB and drop him like a rock, people bullies tend to streer clear. I'm tired of getting picked on. I'm tired of a group demanding that we don't say merry Christmas. I'm touted of attacks on our RIGHTS. I'm tired of a relatively small group of bullies wiping out all that our country was founded on. It seems high time we figuratively punch them in the end of the nose so that they steer clear from here on out. We collectively need to figure out the best way to do that.
     
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  14. Dave Workman

    Dave Workman Western Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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  15. DMax

    DMax Yamhill Well-Known Member

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    There is very little offensive legislation ever goes on for our liberty. Example what WY just did to separate their 2A Rights from the Feds. So the next time Oregon gets a republican majority why not push legislators to do the same. Do you really think the progressives wrote the obammycare bill during the debate Hell no it’s been a work in progress forever waiting for the opportune time to ram it through.

    When things are going well in the economy everyone feels fat and happy that is the very time to shore up liberty in all ways possible to defend against tyranny. Even though many on here think the fix is in and it over. If that really is the case they should just turn in there guns and let the rest of us come up with a strategy to take out the opposition because it is war for our liberty. Reaching across the isle is a liberal term to shut up the opposition and take the pressure off them so co dependant thinkers back of and think it will not be that bad. SO in essence they are counting on us to settle.

    When you see guys like Schrader we all take a little sigh that says OOOO Good the liberals like us again is all going to be alright. It’s all a mental game to lull everyone into a false sense of security. That’s how obammycare got through who doesn't want free for liberty when you are not taught what liberty means and does. I don't think for one moment the fix is in when there are always another solution/strategy that the opposition has not counted on and we have not come up with.

    Logic vs. Emotion.

    No ones knows how that usually works out than married couples.

    Yes Dear
     
  16. Burt Gummer

    Burt Gummer Portland Completely Out of Ammo

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    So well said, and a great observation. Right to the point, not like my diatribes.

    Of course, TPTB know that the Ponzi economy cannot go on this way forever, so they are prepping for all these people, formerly bribed into compliance, with cameras, bullets, and camps.
     
  17. LogicBomb

    LogicBomb Grants Pass Active Member

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    not one step back
     
  18. Just Me

    Just Me Peoples Republik of Oregon Active Member

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    I agree 100% and will be doing so.