National Should 2A Supporters Become More Proactive vs Reactive To Gun Grabbers Efforts? If So How?

[arakboss]

It seems that most of our efforts to fight the gun grabs are in response to some piece of legislation, ballot intiative, media narrative, etc. To me it feels like we are trying to patch holes where we find vermin sneaking in, instead of proactively building or maintaining the house before they get in. What if we were to put ourselves in their shoes and anticipate what the gun grabbers are going to do ahead of time? How could we use this exercise to proactively blunt their future efforts at grabbing guns?

Read More

 

[Will_White]

Sure, but good luck getting "the ones you have to vote for to protect your rights" to actually do something other then scare monger for donations then roll over when they could do something.

 

[American123]

Seems like stuffing ballot boxes is the way to enact political change and it also seems like it doesn't matter if those ballots are legit or not.

 

[arakboss]

Sure, but good luck getting "the ones you have to vote for to protect your rights" to actually do something other then scare monger for donations then roll over when they could do something.

Wouldn't the gun grabbers be dealing with these same problems. If not, how are they avoiding them? I hate to think that the gun grabbing politicians and advocacy groups are more honest and dedicated to their cause then their pro 2A counterparts?

 

[Yarome]

I would consider our "house" is already built in the form of the 2A and, unfortunately, makes is a stationary target subject to attack from any side. There isn't a lot we can do in the way of shoring it up or "bulletproofing" it from attack and are left in the position of constantly playing defense.

As far as anticipating attacks on our 2A rights, it can be difficult to have the foresight to preempt the vast and addled imaginations of the "woke" BS'ers. However, there is a fairly common infection pattern moving from state to state (first "this one", than "that one", then...). I think the best we can do is stay informed of what is being passed in other states and conclude that it will spur very similar attempts in our own state. "If it was successful there, it's more likely WE can do it too." mentality.

One thing may be commenting and educating our representatives on laws being passed around us, in anticipation of it hitting our shores, rather than only addressing or commenting on issues "in real time" as they land in our own laps. I dunno...

Doing that may help a representative to clarify his thoughts before they are under pressure to introduce similiar legislation in their own respective regions, but that's a tall order since they are more likely to ignore anything that doesn't currently pertain to any active or pending legislation within their jurisdictions. It all get's pre-filter before it hits their desks, so....

What's a guy to do?

The most viable, IMHO... Educate those around us. Our own, those that waffle and even those that might be anti to help form and change opinions BEFORE it's an issue and hope they will communicate and vote responsibly when the time comes. Reach out to youth and encourage interest in responsible firearm use and ownership. Invite a co-worker (and family) to join you on the range, particpate in a hunting trip or simply share your interest with them in the hobby type perspective.

Lend your time and resources to local youth or outreach groups that might benefit from the experience. Get creative and proactive to introduce firearms to those that may not have the opportunity otherwise.

Easier said than done in our busy lives, but even touching one or two people in a positive way can have a ripple effect. Don't let not being able to devote as much time as you think would be necesary to be an excuse. Every bit matters.

 

[arakboss]

I would consider our "house" is already built in the form of the 2A and, unfortunately, makes is a stationary target subject to attack from any side. There isn't a lot we can do in the way of shoring it up or "bulletproofing" it from attack and are left in the position of constantly playing defense.

As far as anticipating attacks on our 2A rights, it can be difficult to have the foresight to preempt the vast and addled imaginations of the "woke" BS'ers. However, there is a fairly common infection pattern moving from state to state (first "this one", than "that one", then...). I think the best we can do is stay informed of what is being passed in other states and conclude that it will spur very similar attempts in our own state. "If it was successful there, it's more likely WE can do it too." mentality.

One thing may be commenting and educating our representatives on laws being passed around us, in anticipation of it hitting our shores, rather than only addressing or commenting on issues "in real time" as they land in our own laps. I dunno...

Doing that may help a representative to clarify his thoughts before they are under pressure to introduce similiar legislation in their own respective regions, but that's a tall order since they are more likely to ignore anything that doesn't currently pertain to any active or pending legislation within their jurisdictions. It all get's pre-filter before it hits their desks, so....

What's a guy to do?

The most viable, IMHO... Educate those around us. Our own, those that waffle and even those that might be anti to help form and change opinions BEFORE it's an issue and hope they will communicate and vote responsibly when the time comes. Reach out to youth and encourage interest in responsible firearm use and ownership. Invite a co-worker (and family) to join you on the range, particpate in a hunting trip or simply share your interest with them in the hobby type perspective.

Lend your time and resources to local youth or outreach groups that might benefit from the experience. Get creative and proactive to introduce firearms to those that may not have the opportunity otherwise.

Easier said than done in our busy lives, but even touching one or two people in a positive way can have a ripple effect. Don't let not being able to devote as much time as you think would be necesary to be an excuse. Every bit matters.

The staying informed part is definitely something we need to work on. We often see members on this forum asking about gun grabbing laws that have already passed and are seeminly unaware of what restrictions were in them. That likely means they weren't much help in keeping the laws from being passed in the first place. I find it difficult myself to keep up with all the gun grabbing laws being floated around and I hang out here pretty much every day. Not sure how we can make that process easier, especially for those with much less interest in the subject?

 

[Yarome]

The staying informed part is definitely something we need to work on.

I kind of like that "Washington Gun Law" youtube channel and wish we had something like that for Oregonians.

 

[Frank RW]

If we could only somehow catch the desire to mass-murder before it gets to that point.

How does one do that tho'? Someone who's never committed a crime doesn't suddenly go mad. It's a build-up.

Perhaps a bit of lack of control too. Dealing with anger issues et al can take years. Not sure how we could possibly have fair "flags" without violating our Rights.

It's not always the offender IMO. People can be really cruel. Enough to make one want to kill 'em all.

 

[American123]

If we could only somehow catch the desire to mass-murder before it gets to that point.

How does one do that tho'? Someone who's never committed a crime doesn't suddenly go mad. It's a build-up.

Perhaps a bit of lack of control too. Dealing with anger issues et al can take years. Not sure how we could possibly have fair "flags" without violating our Rights.

It's not always the offender IMO. People can be really cruel. Enough to make one want to kill 'em all.

There are millions of Americans who have been wronged by others, bullied, etc, that also own guns, and do not use them to harm others as some form of distorted revenge. Excusing "the offender" because people can be really cruel, is making excuses for their lack of self control which they do not deserve. It is there fault if they choose to go on a murder spree, it is not the fault of others.

 

[arakboss]

If we could only somehow catch the desire to mass-murder before it gets to that point.

How does one do that tho'? Someone who's never committed a crime doesn't suddenly go mad. It's a build-up.

Perhaps a bit of lack of control too. Dealing with anger issues et al can take years. Not sure how we could possibly have fair "flags" without violating our Rights.

It's not always the offender IMO. People can be really cruel. Enough to make one want to kill 'em all.

I believe we have to accept that there will be rotten eggs among us. Any large scale efforts to catch these rotten eggs before they do something awful is impossible without subjecting all of society to restrictions and paranoia. Once somebody does something awful like in Buffalo, Philly or Chattanooga then we need to lock them up for life or provide them the means to put themselves out of their own misery (bed sheets and ligature points).

The amount of deaths that occur from law abiding citizens who snap is very very small relative to the population size. A free society has cost. Sometimes the cost is grocery shoppers, school childrens, and players lives.

 

[American123]

I believe we have accept that there will be rotten eggs among us. Any large scale efforts to catch these rotten eggs before they do something awful is impossible without subjecting all of society to restrictions and paranoia. Once somebody does something awful like in Buffalo, Philly or Chattanooga then we need to lock them up for life or provide them the means to put themselves out of their own misery (bed sheets and ligature points).

The amount of deaths that occur from law abiding citizens who snap is very very small relative to the population size. A free society has cost. Sometimes the cost is grocery shoppers, school childrens, and players lives.

There could be a "mass shooting" killing 20 people every day of the year for 100 years in the US (20x365x100=730,000 dead) and it wouldn't even be 1% of those people exterminated that took place during the 20th century at the hands of governments after disarming people and imposing "gun control." Turkey, Russia, Germany, China, Cambodia, Uganda…

The fight for rights really is a fight for life, maybe not yours directly, but definitely descendants.

 

[arakboss]

There could be a "mass shooting" killing 20 people every day of the year for 100 years in the US (20x365x100=730,000 dead) and it wouldn't even be 1% of those people exterminated that took place during the 20th century at the hands of governments after disarming people and imposing "gun control." Turkey, Russia, Germany, China, Cambodia, Uganda…

The fight for rights really is a fight for life, maybe not yours directly, but definitely descendants.

It probably sounds paranoid but I believe the fight to take our guns isn't about saving lives but making it safer for some to subjugate us.

 

[American123]

It probably sounds paranoid but I believe the fight to take our guns isn't about saving lives but making it safer for some to subjugate us.

It's not paranoid, it's observant. A government that continually desires to remove the single effective source of physical resistance to potential tyrannical action can logically only desire to do so if they intended to do something that you would otherwise shoot them over.

 

[Yarome]

A government that continually desires to remove the single effective source of physical resistance to potential tyrannical action can logically only desire to do so if they intended to do something that you would otherwise shoot them over.

Historically, that's been proven true... every single friggin time. Doing it incrementally, so as to go less noticed, within an overall plan is only smart. Full and sudden gun grabs have never gone over too well, but there is absolutely no reason to believe this time is any different than any other time before it.

The best way to circumvent resistance is in small steps and make the other side believe they chose it for themselves.

 

[American123]

Historically, that's been proven true... every single friggin time. Doing it incrementally, so as to go less noticed, within an overall plan is only smart. Full and sudden gun grabs have never gone over too well, but there is absolutely no reason to believe this time is any different than any other time before it.

The best way to circumvent resistance is in small steps and make the other side believe they chose it for themselves.

It's a long game, and generationally, "we" are losing. My grandpa had more gun rights/options than I have. I have experienced more gun rights/options than my kids are growing up with.

 

[Frank RW]

There are millions of Americans who have been wronged by others, bullied, etc, that also own guns, and do not use them to harm others as some form of distorted revenge. Excusing "the offender" because people can be really cruel, is making excuses for their lack of self control which they do not deserve. It is there fault if they choose to go on a murder spree, it is not the fault of others.

I agree in spirit, but yes, I do believe a killer can be a victim too. Perhaps we should consider that instead of ONLY blaming the shooter.

Others I think bear some of the burden. It doesn't justify anything, but still a factor.

 

[Frank RW]

I believe we have accept that there will be rotten eggs among us. Any large scale efforts to catch these rotten eggs before they do something awful is impossible without subjecting all of society to restrictions and paranoia. Once somebody does something awful like in Buffalo, Philly or Chattanooga then we need to lock them up for life or provide them the means to put themselves out of their own misery (bed sheets and ligature points).

The amount of deaths that occur from law abiding citizens who snap is very very small relative to the population size. A free society has cost. Sometimes the cost is grocery shoppers, school childrens, and players lives.

They probably didn't start out rotten. What got them to that point? It's really seems to be a bunch of small things that add up.

I don't think it helps that the media hypes it up to such a point that it's the only thing on the screen. I have to go to foreign news if I want a break.

 

[arakboss]

It's not paranoid, it's observant. A government that continually desires to remove the single effective source of physical resistance to potential tyrannical action can logically only desire to do so if they intended to do something that you would otherwise shoot them over.

If that is the true reason they want our guns, how can we convincingly push that aspect to the public. They never advertise that as the reason for gun restrictions, it's always about saving lives.

On our side we have some who push the ideas that we just want our guns for hunting, sport shooting, self defense, etc. Fewer 2A supporters push the main reason we want guns, which is to resist tyranny. In fact many gun owners would consider that position extreme and unnecessary. But we have many more 2A supporters who will confess resisting tryanny as the main reason for having guns, than the gun grabbers have confessing to wanting our guns to make subjugation easier.

I feel it would help our cause if we could get the gun grabbers true reason out there. This would be especially helpful it were perceived as coming directly from the gun grabbers themselves. That is what I would like to work on.

 

[red442joe]

There is no hope until gun rights people vehemently oppose anti-gun people.
Never be nice to an anti...EVER.

Joe

 

[Knobgoblin]

Real solutions to real problems are complicated and nuanced. The simplistic "ban" laws are designed for mass appeal, which is why uninformed people gravitate to them. Thinking is hard, requires effort, and honesty. Most people I talk to on a daily basis are all about easy, lazy and avoiding harsh truths.
It's an uphill battle.