Shooting Instructor Dies After 9-year-old girl fired an uzi at him.

[Medic!]

At first I wondered ''What was the last thing going through this instructors mind''
Then it hit me. A 9mm!
He should have been standing behind her.

 

[FourTeeFive]

Granted, range safety is of utmost importance, and this place seems to be lacking.

Exactly. That's what we're talking about here.

Maybe it's just me, but going to a full-auto meet is a lot different than being in Vegas with the family and saying, "Hey, let's go to Bullets and Burgers and take a video of little Janine shooting an Uzi. Won't they get a kick out of that back home?"

Not quite the usual meet crowd here. Looks like a lot of fingers on triggers, and I guess the "instructors" are OK with that?

 

[humdrum]

At first I wondered ''What was the last thing going through this instructors mind''
Then it hit me. A 9mm!
He should have been standing behind her.

Your taste, my friend, is piss-poor.

 

[IronMonster]

I actually think this is pretty fair piece

http://www.businessweek.com/article...-gun-instructor-with-an-uzi-four-blunt-points

 

[KalamaMark]

My thoughts.

 

[Jessie Russell]

Yesh they have it on YouTube. I couldn't believe it

 

[OLDNEWBIE]

Wow. Kinda amazed by some of the comments in here on a gun forum. According to some, events like the Saddle Butte machine gun shoot should NEVER take place since the majority of people there are inexperienced.
There's numerous kids at that events a well, younger than 9 even, shooting full auto. So it CAN be done safely.

IMO, places like this are essential to the shooting sports. I would bet there are many kids introduced at places just like this by families/parents that are ambivalent to firearms and don't own any themselves.
Granted, range safety is of utmost importance, and this place seems to be lacking. BUT, this incident aside, I'll bet this range had better safety protocols than most people set for themselves when they are out at the local shooting spot in the woods. Who would want to take their 9yo up to Browns Camp for their first time shooting?

I know my kid couldn't handle it yet. Some parents might think their kids are more capable than they really are. I know A LOT of parents that can't be objective when it comes to their kids.
Some guns are more manageable than others too. The Sten for example has something to hold on to.
Kid with UZI at 3:40, It has a folding stock and is pretty stable.

 

[AMProducts]

Wow. Kinda amazed by some of the comments in here on a gun forum. According to some, events like the Saddle Butte machine gun shoot should NEVER take place since the majority of people there are inexperienced.
There's numerous kids at that events a well, younger than 9 even, shooting full auto. So it CAN be done safely.

IMO, places like this are essential to the shooting sports. I would bet there are many kids introduced at places just like this by families/parents that are ambivalent to firearms and don't own any themselves.
Granted, range safety is of utmost importance, and this place seems to be lacking. BUT, this incident aside, I'll bet this range had better safety protocols than most people set for themselves when they are out at the local shooting spot in the woods. Who would want to take their 9yo up to Browns Camp for their first time shooting?

Here's the thing... I've been in the "instructor seat" not with kids, but with cops... frankly there are few things in this world that scare me more than cops with loaded guns... cops with loaded full autos is one of them. After the FIRST student I had, I immediately revised my procedure (the first time he fired the gun).

If I'm doing a weapons familiarization course, I don't give them a full mag. I put 5 rounds in each mag. First they fire 2 mags on semi auto, and if they do ok, then I flip them over to full auto for the next mag of 5 rounds. I do not under any circumstances give them a full magazine, give them one or two shots of semi, and then tell them to click it over to "fun".

My criticism here is less about the business, but more about the instructor's lack of prowess as an instructor. When I was a kid they started us with go-karts, they didn't drop us into a ferarri show us how the controls worked and turn us loose. While that may have been fun, it likely wouldn't have ended well for someone. I'm not saying it can't or shouldn't be done, but you need to put the time in to make sure the outcome doesn't involve being killed by a schoolgirl.

 

[whiskeybill]

As a NRA firearms instructor, I see a fair number of adults that are new to shooting that are uncomfortable with it. They are not practiced in safe firearms handling, and recoil, even in a 9mm pistol, can be uncomfortable for many. There is absolutely no reason to let a small child, no matter how "practiced" they are, shoot a fully automatic firearm. Period. I am one of those "old farts" that grew up learning to shoot a 22 rimfire rifle. My dad wouldn't let me touch a centerfire rifle until I passed hunters safety at the age of twelve, and then I had to hunt with an old Savage bolt action 30-30. I did not shoot a fully automatic firearm until I was in the military, and even then I was not enamored with the idea. I knew that that function was for a very heated battle where one had to get as much firepower as possible, as quickly as possible, into the enemy in order to survive.
It is fine with me if adults want to go and shoot a fully auto firearm. Have a ball. Pay the money and get after it. Here's a little hint. The way the world is going now, you may want to save that money. If the draft is started, you'll get all the firearms training you can handle for free. As for me, shooting a 22 is still a heckuvalot of fun.

 

[IronMonster]

https://gma.yahoo.com/children-uzi-...en-letter-110837823--abc-news-topstories.html

 

[teflon6string]

...When I was a kid they started us with go-karts, they didn't drop us into a ferarri show us how the controls worked and turn us loose. While that may have been fun, it likely wouldn't have ended well for someone. I'm not saying it can't or shouldn't be done, but you need to put the time in to make sure the outcome doesn't involve being killed by a schoolgirl.

Excellent point AMP. A superb analogy.

I can only hope that those regarded as "intructors" (experts or not, and certified or not), can use this as inspiration to err on the side of boring, old-fashioned sound judgement, even if it's not as exciting as a mag dump on day-one at the range (or day-ten), depending upon the carefully monitored capabilities of the student.

Even if full-auto were the sole objective, there is a hands-on way to do it safely from behind the shooter, especially with such a short barrel - and a tiny person who might actually find any weapon a bit heavy.

Tragic for sure and I'm sorry for everyone involved.

 

[IronMonster]

I guess being rich and successful does not necessarily mean you make good choices.

http://www.theage.com.au/national/g...e-lived-in-mosman-sydney-20140906-10db2b.html

 

[Brutus57]

It is a sad situation but clearly stupidity on the instructor's part for thinking a girl or boy for that matter that age could handle full auto. More people shooting means unfortunately more accidents like these just by the law of averages. Be safe people!

Brutus Out

 

[whiskeybill]

The policy at that facility obviously allowed this kind of thing to happen. People who are unfamiliar with firearms, save for their "Hollywood Movie Experience", come into facilities like that and are allowed to shoot firearms that they can truly barely handle. The last line of defense for shooter safety is the instructor and the range safety officer. It doesn't matter if the people are rich or poor, adult or child, male or female. If the facilities owner has a policy of "anyone can shoot anything if they can pay", the instructor / range safety officer has an obligation for the final say on who can shoot a firearm safely, or at least they should have that say.

There are more and more ranges, mostly private, for profit ranges, that are offering the "Full Auto Experience". I just returned from a visit to my hometown of Billings, Montana. I heard an ad on the radio for a new indoor shooting range that offers the opportunity to shoot full auto firearms. I would hope that the operators of this range take this tragedy to heart and not have the same "Cranial-Rectal Inversion Syndrome" that the Arizona facility operators had. Profit does not trump a human life.

 

[teflon6string]

Maybe nitpicking here, but the term "fired an Uzi at him" might read as somewhat intentional compared to "lost control of weapon, killing instructor."

 

[whiskeybill]

Maybe nitpicking here, but the term "fired an Uzi at him" might read as somewhat intentional compared to "lost control of weapon, killing instructor."

Not nit-picking at all!