Poll: Sheets and self-defense

[Scott]

There seems to be a little argument about who did the right thing. This is a poll as I want to see what all of you would have done.

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[smithmax]

Call the police, give detailed descriptions of the guys and the car, and then file an insurance claim.

 

[darkminstrel]

My vote for comes with a caveat, but still stands.

 

[Joe Link]

If it were me, I'd order him to stop while on the phone with the police. However, if he didn't, I wouldn't shoot unless I felt my life was in danger. Not because I have a problem with people using lethal defense to protect property, but because I live in Oregon and don't want/can't afford all the problems associated with shooting.

 

[dario541]

If it were me, I'd order him to stop while on the phone with the police. However, if he didn't, I wouldn't shoot unless I felt my life was in danger. Not because I have a problem with people using lethal defense to protect property, but because I live in Oregon and don't want/can't afford all the problems associated with shooting.

Yes, here in Oregon burglars, thieves, home invaders and rapists have "On-the-job-protection", courtesy of our government.

 

[SavageGerbil]

Actually rape is a definite shooting-ok'd situation, even if you completely forget the "grievous bodily harm" the potential for lethal viruses makes it a preservation of life situation, as far as home invaders, again, if you're threatened, do what you have to. In most situations where we, as reasonable people, would shoot the letter of the law only really determines if you're going to wind up in court, if you present 12 people a clear-cut self defensive action I'd like to believe there's little chance all 12 would say you should have laid down and died.

We're not talking about a guy who kicked in someones door here, guy broke into a car on the street, deserving of some jail time, and couple more years peeing in a cup and supervised probation? Definitely, 21 years old, plenty of time to change. How many of you in your 30s, 40's and beyond can say you're still the same man you were at 21? I don't see this as a reason to shoot a man in the back of the head from a second floor balcony. I don't want to sound like a criminal rights zealot or anything, but it seems a bit on the brutal side for a speaker.

 

[zeezee]

What property of yours is worth someone's life? A TV or stereo or your RV or . . . So now you have put a monitary value on a life, would you allow someone to pay that same price for your parents, wife or children? Think before you react and think especially long and hard before you go taking someones life.

 

[Trlsmn]

What property of yours is worth someone's life? A TV or stereo or your RV or . . . So now you have put a monitary value on a life,

Actually the criminal put his life in danger lets not forgive or forget that point! This isn't about a killing to protect property it's about killing in self defense regardless of how many times it gets steered back to property.

would you allow someone to pay that same price for your parents, wife or children?

It's unclear what you are saying here please clarify as it could mean many things.

Think before you react and think especially long and hard before you go taking someones life.

Unfortunately you may not have that long to think about it!

Lets change this up a little bit, what if you caught an intruder inside your home? Does this change your threshold on shooting the scumbag?

 

[zeezee]

Inside my home? Heck yes, my life is in danger but would I have shot him if he left peaceably? God I hope & pray not. Remember that is why we have laws with courts.
It's unclear what you are saying here please clarify as it could mean many things.
Was what ever the scumbag stole worth his life? And if the answer is yes, than you have placed a monitary value on life, if the answer is no than why was he killed? Rage over someone stealing something? And if you decide to pull the trigger you had better have had thought about taking someone's life a long time before even picking up a firearm and don't give me no bull crap about there would not be enough time! And if he was reaching for a firearm, wouldn't it be more prudent to just duck back in the house? Next time you pick up your firearm, make the choice as to value you place on another human beings life and think about it!
I pray I am never placed in that position, let him take my car, my RV and anything of monitary value but if threatened with the life of my friends, loved ones or . . . Let me have the courage to kill them all.
Just my .02

 

[Trlsmn]

Inside my home? Heck yes, my life is in danger but would I have shot him if he left peaceably? God I hope & pray not. Remember that is why we have laws with courts.
It's unclear what you are saying here please clarify as it could mean many things.
Was what ever the scumbag stole worth his life? And if the answer is yes, than you have placed a monitary value on life,

Sorry to be unclear myself:

would you allow someone to pay that same price for your parents, wife or children?

I am unclear what your point referencing your parents, wife or children meant or what the point is. No trying to be difficult.

if the answer is no than why was he killed? Rage over someone stealing something?

You must consider that it could have been fear not rage. A trembling hand and poor trigger control could have also been the cause.

And if you decide to pull the trigger you had better have had thought about taking someone's life a long time before even picking up a firearm

I agree that a person should consider this before the actual situation was even a reality because once it is a real situation humans or more instinctual and less likely to ponder in deep thought.

and don't give me no bull crap about there would not be enough time!

Sorry be as the events were happening there would not have been enough time to do anything more than what our natural fight or flight reaction tells us to. This is why you must consider what to do in a situation like this.

And if he was reaching for a firearm, wouldn't it be more prudent to just duck back in the house?

Absolutely unequivocally not! My reaction would be to shoot as I am going for cover but I would like to think that I would have drawn on the guy and confronted him from cover!

Next time you pick up your firearm, make the choice as to value you place on another human beings life and think about it!

I do value the lives of others. I have had a CHL since the first day (literaly) that Multnomah county offered them and I have carried a pistol regularly ever since. In that time I have been confronted at least 5 times and never felt the need to yank my pistol and end something I knew could be settled with other means. That said if my property is being stolen I will be proactive in defending it, if a scumbag puts me in danger while I exercise my right to secure my property the fault for losing his life over material good lies solely on him.

I pray I am never placed in that position, let him take my car, my RV and anything of monitary value but if threatened with the life of my friends, loved ones or . . . Let me have the courage to kill them all.
Just my .02

I also hope to make it through this life having never draw a firearm on anyone for any reason!

 

[zeezee]

You must consider that it could have been fear not rage. A trembling hand and poor trigger control could have also been the cause. Oh well, than I guess you are going to spend the rest of your days with some career hood slipping it to you. What is one of the first laws of firearms, do not point a firearm at anything you are not willing to destroy! Didn't you learn that when you took your concealed carry course and how about the other, never place your finger on the trigger until you have a target and this fool had no target, the guy had his back to him. Or maybe the bullet had the JFK spin on it? LOL! They are going to condem and then sentance this man to life in prision and all his excuses are going to be thrown out the window as LAME!
Again just my 2 cents

 

[Trlsmn]

You must consider that it could have been fear not rage. A trembling hand and poor trigger control could have also been the cause. Oh well, than I guess you are going to spend the rest of your days with some career hood slipping it to you. What is one of the first laws of firearms, do not point a firearm at anything you are not willing to destroy! Didn't you learn that when you took your concealed carry course and how about the other, never place your finger on the trigger until you have a target and this fool had no target,

Didn't I learn this? Are you accusing me of poor trigger control? I wasn't even there!

And for the record I have done hundreds of hours of training over the last 20 years not just a 2 hour rubber stamp lecture class.

the guy had his back to him.

You can state that with 100% certainly?

Or maybe the bullet had the JFK spin on it? LOL! They are going to condem and then sentance this man to life in prision and all his excuses are going to be thrown out the window as LAME!
Again just my 2 cents

Well to start with Second degree manslaughter carries a 15 year max. If this guy is convicted and spends more than 5 years in prison I would be very surprised!

 

[PhysicsGuy]

Ors 161.219;

161.219 limitations on use of deadly physical force in defense of a person. Notwithstanding the provisions of ors 161.209, a person is not justified in using deadly physical force upon another person unless the person reasonably believes that the other person is:

(1) committing or attempting to commit a felony involving the use or threatened imminent use of physical force against a person; or

(2) committing or attempting to commit a burglary in a dwelling; or

(3) using or about to use unlawful deadly physical force against a person. [1971 c.743 §23]

 

[zeezee]

the guy had his back to him.
You can state that with 100% certainly?
Wasn't the dead guy shot in the back of the head?

15 years for murder? LOL! we must be in Oregon. Sheeeeeshhh! What a joke.

 

[Benny503]

If the theft in my property then I wouldn't confront them, I will have my defense weapon in hand loaded ready and watch what they do while calling the cops. If they just want my property then I will let them have it while writing down their description and their lisence plate. To me I feel no property worth more then a human life. I rather the theif get punish by the laws then I have to live in regret for the rest of my life. If they encount any of my family members (not my saltwater fishes, dog, cat ect) in anyway that harm them. I will shoot to stop the thread, douple tap if I have to. I am praying to GOD that I dont have to come to that. I am train, practice and prepare..... but no intent to apply

 

[zeezee]

Benny, I am with you 100%