Self Taught

[DuneHopper]

That is one DUMB very lucky SOB.
I want him to buy me a lottery ticket............. if he survives long enough to get to a machine....

I had seen this a few dozen times before but thought honorable mentions was due

 

[SmawGunner]

Watching this video is all you need to do for your PT and hand to hand skills.

 

[mkwerx]

Is that one of SouthNarc's classes?

 

[Certaindeaf]

Watching this video is all you need to do for your PT and hand to hand skills.

Lol. Pikers, one and all..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=sg1toGIYBwk

 

[Deebow]

I have seen a lot of "self taught" people doing things. If it was a case that it actually worked, then no one would have needed a drill Sergeant in the Army or a Field Training Officer to work in LE.

People don't become world class anything all by themselves; they provide the building materials and people like coaches, teachers, and mentors help the person shape that clay, and hopefully, at the end, the person becomes what they want to be. You can only get out of people what has already put been put in; as an instructor/teacher/mentor, you have to sharpen the skills they have, not the ones that they don't.

Skills that SF operators and combat veterans (real ones), and guys like Jeff Cooper and Clint Smith have developed come from basic instruction and repetition, adapting their skills to their environment and then testing them in the crucible of experience. That crucible distills what works and what doesn't through the lens of actual gun combat.

Which can then be passed on to others as viable tactics and strategy that they can then use, if confronted with a similar situation.

 

[DuneHopper]

I have seen a lot of "self taught" people doing things. If it was a case that it actually worked, then no one would have needed a drill Sergeant in the Army or a Field Training Officer to work in LE.

People don't become world class anything all by themselves; they provide the building materials and people like coaches, teachers, and mentors help the person shape that clay, and hopefully, at the end, the person becomes what they want to be. You can only get out of people what has already put been put in; as an instructor/teacher/mentor, you have to sharpen the skills they have, not the ones that they don't.
.

I owe everything I have ever learned about Firearms and Defense as well as Survival from those who taught and gave the knowledege. Without this I know I would be a very different person without those people in my life . It used to be that every person was raised to have some degree of survival and readiness. Now days readiness means how long your IPad will run on a charge,
( which I do not own no smart phones for this big dummy )

 

[Certaindeaf]

There's no denying that the US military can bring on the pain. And there's no denying that the military teaches "things". However, I've been exposed to, in different capacities, many high-speed-low-drag types (active and retired military, HRT boys, SWAT, cops, regular folk, yada yada) and it was pretty much never that I was impressed with their shooting.. lest they had actually trained themselves and not just putzed on by with what was "required" or taking a class or twelve.
I remain unconvinced that the military or heaven forbid, a class, is the holy grail of turning out world class shooters. If they are good or great shots, they very generally were excellent shots before joining or receiving that instruction.

 

[DuneHopper]

There's no denying that the US military can bring on the pain. And there's no denying that the military teaches "things". However, I've been exposed to, in different capacities, many high-speed-low-drag types (active and retired military, HRT boys, SWAT, cops, regular folk, yada yada) and it was pretty much never that I was impressed with their shooting.. lest they had actually trained themselves and not just putzed on by with what was "required" or taking a class or twelve.
I remain unconvinced that the military or heaven forbid, a class, is the holy grail of turning out world class shooters. If they are good or great shots, they very generally were excellent shots before joining or receiving that instruction.

I agree instinctively people have it or not, I was a descent shooter long before training but training added and edge of experience and avoiding mistakes that could be costly.
My youngest son is one of these natural shooters, why I am no slob he has been as if he was born with a rifle on one side and bottle on the other at birth he he hits what he shoots at and if he misses once he wont the next shot fun to watch his just take on good mental discipline and safety like he always knew it .

 

[Certaindeaf]

And I'm not saying formal training is worthless.. far from it. It can be, and often is, a valuable foundation from which to build.

 

[Deebow]

There's no denying that the US military can bring on the pain. And there's no denying that the military teaches "things". However, I've been exposed to, in different capacities, many high-speed-low-drag types (active and retired military, HRT boys, SWAT, cops, regular folk, yada yada) and it was pretty much never that I was impressed with their shooting.. lest they had actually trained themselves and not just putzed on by with what was "required" or taking a class or twelve.
I remain unconvinced that the military or heaven forbid, a class, is the holy grail of turning out world class shooters. If they are good or great shots, they very generally were excellent shots before joining or receiving that instruction.

I have found in my experience that there are two sides to this coin.

The untrained with potential access their ability to be good through mentoring and instruction. They may not have known they could be good, but giving them to tools to operate the gun leads to operating it well and accurately if they apply themselves to applying the principles

The trained can become better, the good can become great and the great can become excellent by applying the techniques they learn in a consistent manner, and through repetition, achieving mastery.

But the person has to want it, and want to use it and want to practice it as well.

 

[Certaindeaf]

I have found in my experience that there are two sides to this coin.

The untrained with potential access their ability to be good through mentoring and instruction. They may not have known they could be good, but giving them to tools to operate the gun leads to operating it well and accurately if they apply themselves to applying the principles

The trained can become better, the good can become great and the great can become excellent by applying the techniques they learn in a consistent manner, and through repetition, achieving mastery.

But the person has to want it, and want to use it and want to practice it as well.

Amen. I think you guys know what I'm trying to say. I'm not necessarily trying to prove a universal (which is impossible), just kinda a pep/motivational talk/personal observation.

 

[Lange22250]

The fundamentals SOUND simple on a when you write them down and in some ways are flexible depending on the situation.

The reality is that most people don't really understand them and it shows when they are compared to higher level shooters.

Classes with a decent instructor, which can be hard to find, usually go in depth on the fundamentals so that people do actually understand them then layer on techniques that are efferent and proven, or tailored to the individual because humans are not all the same.

You can try to be a self taught shooter and blow a lot of ammo, but in my experience that just means that you will have a lot of bad habits that need to be fixed before you can achieve any higher level performance.

Unless you compete or put yourself on the timer with some standard drills you will probably not realize how far down the curve you are.

 

[Certaindeaf]

The fundamentals SOUND simple on a when you write them down and in some ways are flexible depending on the situation.

The reality is that most people don't really understand them and it shows when they are compared to higher level shooters.

Classes with a decent instructor, which can be hard to find, usually go in depth on the fundamentals so that people do actually understand them then layer on techniques that are efferent and proven, or tailored to the individual because humans are not all the same.

You can try to be a self taught shooter and blow a lot of ammo, but in my experience that just means that you will have a lot of bad habits that need to be fixed before you can achieve any higher level performance.

Unless you compete or put yourself on the timer with some standard drills you will probably not realize how far down the curve you are.

"Try to be a self taught shooter"? What else kind is there? come on

 

[Lange22250]

The ability to make noise with a gun and launch a projectile in a general intended direction does not make someone a "shooter" it makes them a hazard and potential publicity problem for the rest of us.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Try to not be a pacifist and realize that you are responsible for your own self/abilities. lol

 

[Certaindeaf]

The ability to make noise with a gun and launch a projectile in a general intended direction does not make someone a "shooter" it makes them a hazard and potential publicity problem for the rest of us.

The price of tea in China is strong in you. What?

 

[Velzey]

Is James Yeager self taught?

 

[Certaindeaf]

Is James Yeager self taught?

I really don't know. After my little add to an odd recent thread, I found that he's supposedly the most intelligent human on the planet. And was teaching arms after same was stripped from him for threats.. I know. can't be true. I still wouldn't drop my precious Hi-Point! lol

 

[Lange22250]

Try to not be a pacifist and realize that you are responsible for your own self/abilities. lol

What's more responsible that researching instructors, paying for the best class you can afford/access, letting your ego go so that you can understand and evaluate the information presented and the feedback from the instructor on your performance Then practicing to improve after the class using a defined metric to measure any improvements.

For some reason people fail to consider the use of a firearm a martial art in it's own right. By any reasonable definition it is. In what other martial art would trying to be self taught considered a good idea.

Saying your going to be a self taught shooter is usually the same as being a self taught Karate expert. You can watch the Step Brothers move scene where they are in the garage to see the typical results.

I've had to teach classes that I consider basic to low level intermediate classes to about a 1000 people so far, and don't remember anyone who was self taught having any real level of proficiency. At the end of the classes just about all the self taught's appreciated a formal class and what it did to increase their level of proficiency. Fact is that you don't know what you don't know until someone points it out to you.

 

[Certaindeaf]

What's more responsible that researching instructors, paying for the best class you can afford/access, letting your ego go so that you can understand and evaluate the information presented and the feedback from the instructor on your performance Then practicing to improve after the class using a defined metric to measure any improvements.

For some reason people fail to consider the use of a firearm a martial art in it's own right. By any reasonable definition it is. In what other martial art would trying to be self taught considered a good idea.

Saying your going to be a self taught shooter is usually the same as being a self taught Karate expert. You can watch the Step Brothers move scene where they are in the garage to see the typical results.

I've had to teach classes that I consider basic to low level intermediate classes to about a 1000 people so far, and don't remember anyone who was self taught having any real level of proficiency. At the end of the classes just about all the self taught's appreciated a formal class and what it did to increase their level of proficiency. Fact is that you don't know what you don't know until someone points it out to you.

So when you're done laying hands upon your students they are then magically transformed into super-ninja? I don't think you are understanding what I'm saying.