Self-defense shooting(?) in Seattle leads to murder charge

[JedB]

His only words should have been I want a lawyer...

slight correction.

 

[AshWilliams]

From the different articles I've read covering the story a good summary was, "Siciliano then walked up to Lundvall and punched him once... before backing away with his hands up, the charges say. As Lundvall drew his 9 mm handgun, Siciliano sidestepped away and his hands remained visible, never going to his waistband as Lundvall had described, say the charges. Siciliano continued to back away from Lundvall, who took a couple steps forward and fired, hitting Siciliano in the face"

Again, I can't really weigh in since I haven't seen the video as it hasn't been released. It'll be interesting to make my own call once it's been released by the SPD.

 

[homeuser6]

so this guy is dead. i'm happy about that. garret too. these people only ruin the gene pool when they are allowed to procreate.

 

[Rascal01]

If arrested you must identify yourself. The only thing you should say to police is that you have nothing to say until you have legal representation, no matter how right you are. You should be read your Miranda rights before questioning. Anything you say - volunteer - before being Mirandized is admissible as a spontaneous utterance.

It has been a long time since the police academy and laws change and vary by jurisdiction so I may be out of date. Just remember, talking to the cops regarding a criminal matter without a lawyer is a huge mistake.

You have nothing to say without council present.

 

[Flopsweat]

Are you taking requests? I could use a new TV and a surround-sound setup.
Also some jeans that don't make my butt look fat.
Thanks,
Power to the People.

Sometimes it's not the jeans or even the genes, just sayin'.

 

[ma96782]

Maybe???? The shooter talked too much and gave too many details etc....... Well?



Aloha, Mark

 

[Ironbar]

Stumbled across this story, and it leaves me a bit puzzled regarding what will happen in WA if you're involved in a self-defense shooting. The shooter waited for the police to arrive, claimed the person had attacked him and he'd shot in self-defense, and was he immediately arrested (first for assault, and when the person died, the charge was upgraded to murder(?)). Since the article asks for anyone with information to contact police, I'm assuming that there weren't any witnesses. Also no mention on whether or not the shooter had a CPL, prior record, etc.

Is it just that journalism is dead and there's a lot more to the story, or is this standard WA state procedure - at least in Seattle?

University District shooting victim dies; suspect faces murder rap

SEATTLE - A 35-year-old man who was critically injured in a Sunday night shooting in the University District has died of his wounds, police said, and the shooting suspect has been rebooked into the King County Jail for investigation of murder. The shooting unfolded at around 8:20 p. m. Sunday in...

komonews.com

another article with slightly more information. Sounds like he was arrested and then interviewed by detectives.

Detectives Investigating University District Shooting, Suspect Arrested - SPD Blotter

Update 7/15/20: The victim in this case died from the injury he sustained Sunday night. The suspect was re-booked into the King County Jail for investigation of murder. This remains an active and on-going investigation. Anyone with information on this incident is asked to contact the Violent...

spdblotter.seattle.gov

And now you know folks, why you DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!

Anything you say can and will be used AGAINST you in a court of law. Nothing you say will be used to HELP you in a court of law.

Let that last statement sink in.

 

[FourTeeFive]

Busy times in Seattle. Great description of the shooter:

Man fatally shot during argument at Wallingford bus stop

SEATTLE -- Police are searching for a gunman following a deadly shooting at a bus stop in Wallingford Monday night. It was just before 10 p. m. when two men got off a Metro bus at N. 46th Street and Aurora Avenue North and got into an argument, says Det. Mark Jamieson with Seattle Police. At one...

komonews.com

 

[American123]

Busy times in Seattle. Great description of the shooter:

Man fatally shot during argument at Wallingford bus stop

SEATTLE -- Police are searching for a gunman following a deadly shooting at a bus stop in Wallingford Monday night. It was just before 10 p. m. when two men got off a Metro bus at N. 46th Street and Aurora Avenue North and got into an argument, says Det. Mark Jamieson with Seattle Police. At one...

komonews.com

They do that because they don't want a consistent pattern to show up about a small percentage of the population committing the majority of crime.

UW Seattle sent out notifications about violent crime committed on campus or near campus, they probably still do. When I was a student there from 08-12 the consistent pattern emerged that skin color of suspects was left out unless it was someone with privilege.

 

[No_Regerts]

And now you know folks, why you DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!

Anything you say can and will be used AGAINST you in a court of law. Nothing you say will be used to HELP you in a court of law.

Let that last statement sink in.

That's actually not true-ish. What you say may keep you out if court. Anything that is exculpatory must be reported by the officer. Withholding exculpatory evidence gets you in big doo-doo.

 

[Bushman]

I could have sworn I saw a video clip of this shooting but can't find it now.

Anyway, there is more info here: Seattle man charged with manslaughter, accused of fatally shooting man in U-District parking lot

In my recollection of the video, Siciliano punched Lundvall, which seems to be something he likes to do (and of course, he has faced no legal consequences): Suspect charged in sucker-punch attack on Orthodox priest arrested 8 times since 2017

• Siciliano punched a priest in Burien in a random attack while the priest was pumping gas,
• The next day he threatened to kill a bus driver,
• Two days later, he's on video hitting a woman in Seattle -- randomly of course,
• Before these incidents he assualted someone at the Union Gospel Mission,
• And he also assaulted an employee of the Downtown Emergency Center

The above story about Siciliano is from 2019 so clearly, nothing really came of any of his assaults.

If anyone can point me to the video though, I'd appreciate it.

Typical...

 

[sobo]

Well, although Lundvall is gonna get sent up the river for years, he did us all a solid by putting Scumbag Siciliano down for the 10-count. So there's that...

 

[Rascal01]

Two things to avoid if you are the subject, or target, of an investigation are self-incrimination and making a statement against interest.. You have a constitutional right to an attorney. You have a constitutional right not to incriminate yourself. An attorney can council you and help you to avoid costly verbal blunders.

This is about keeping safe when you are in a tough spot, nothing more. I'm the guy that actually wears a life jacket when I'm on a boat. My life jacket has a strobe light, a whistle, and a signal mirror. I'm not sure what you call a person like that, but I'd like to think prudent would apply. Stacking the odds in your favor can't hurt. That's better than forgetting your jacket and treading water until you are rescued.

 

[WillametteWill]

And now you know folks, why you DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!

Anything you say can and will be used AGAINST you in a court of law. Nothing you say will be used to HELP you in a court of law.

Let that last statement sink in.

As @No_Regerts alluded to, it is much more complex than not saying anything. For example, George Zimmerman would absolutely been convicted had he not provided the initial officers enough information to turn the dynamic into a possible self defense case. That sinks in for me.

As I have said in about five other threads, if you are guilty or really messed up a "self-defense" shooting, then yes, shut up and talk with an attorney. But in a legitimate SD case, lawful gun carriers should have a much better plan that includes very limited and specific information you need to tell the police...and then request you lawyer.

 

[No_Regerts]

As @No_Regerts alluded to, it is much more complex than not saying anything. For example, George Zimmerman would absolutely been convicted had he not provided the initial officers enough information to turn the dynamic into a possible self defense case. That sinks in for me.

As I have said in about five other threads, if you are guilty or really messed up a "self-defense" shooting, then yes, shut up and talk with an attorney. But in a legitimate SD case, lawful gun carriers should have a much better plan that includes very limited and specific information you need to tell the police...and then request you lawyer.

This!

"I was afraid he was going to kill me" goes a long ways.

"I am willing to cooperate, I just need to speak to my attorney and take time to wind down, I'm very shook up" sounds a heck of a lot better than "Lawyer!"

Once you establish it was self defense, you'll cooperate, and you'd like to take a bit to compose yourself and get some legal council, you seem a lot more "reasonable" and less suspicious. Why? Because the officer is trained to do the exact same thing when they are involved in a shooting.

 

[WillametteWill]

 

[BrentN]

Busy times in Seattle. Great description of the shooter:

Man fatally shot during argument at Wallingford bus stop

SEATTLE -- Police are searching for a gunman following a deadly shooting at a bus stop in Wallingford Monday night. It was just before 10 p. m. when two men got off a Metro bus at N. 46th Street and Aurora Avenue North and got into an argument, says Det. Mark Jamieson with Seattle Police. At one...

komonews.com

Well, they said "man". Kinda presumptive if you ask me, lol. Anymore I just assume the lack of any description means it's a POC.

 

[bbbass]

And now you know folks, why you DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!

Anything you say can and will be used AGAINST you in a court of law. Nothing you say will be used to HELP you in a court of law.

Let that last statement sink in.

Well, yes, sorta.... but in this case the video screws Lundvall no matter what he said. It's good to remember that someone is probably watching.

That's better than forgetting your jacket and treading water until you are rescued.

I'm ok with that unless it's blue water.

 

[ma96782]

They do that because they don't want a consistent pattern to show up about a small percentage of the population committing the majority of crime.

UW Seattle sent out notifications about violent crime committed on campus or near campus, they probably still do. When I was a student there from 08-12 the consistent pattern emerged that skin color of suspects was left out unless it was someone with privilege.

I've noticed that practiced by many of the major news media folks too.

IMHO....it's clearly racist and disgusting.

Aloha, Mark

 

[Certaindeaf]

And now you know folks, why you DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!! DON'T TALK TO THE POLICE!!!!

Anything you say can and will be used AGAINST you in a court of law. Nothing you say will be used to HELP you in a court of law.

Let that last statement sink in.

I talked to the police once and turned into a pillar of salt.