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self def. bird shot first 2?

Discussion in 'Handgun Discussion' started by slind, Mar 31, 2013.

  1. slind

    slind Seattle, WA Member

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    Hello everyone, I have been debating with my father in law and a friend about there thinking on bird shot for first couple of round in a pistol. they seem to think it will distract their opponent enough to get a good shot in. and something about with the lack of coordination in an event of an attack they will only be about 50 % as good than on there best day.... and well they rather hit with something like bird shot than miss at all.
    I think some of the other reasons are that it gives a chance to just shoot at the walls to scare someone or down the hall and make them look away to get the real round in them ie. hollow point.?

    thins makes no sense to me.. and either does not having one in the pipe at until you need it. that's like lets not put any gas in the car until we drive it?... is it just me or ?... give me some pointers to help them out.

    I did ask if its so good to pack this way why didn't they teach it at front sight
     
  2. JAFO

    JAFO OR, USA Silver Supporter Silver Supporter

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    I'm no expert but I certainly would never do such a thing. If it is time to pull the gun out it is time to stop the threat. I don't want to give some possibly drugged up bad guy a chance to shoot me while I'm hitting him with tiny BBs that do nothing. I'm not even a fan of "showing" some bad guy my gun to try and deter an advancement. Like I said, when it's time to pull the gun out it is time to defend myself against a threat to my life.

    Now for fishing or hiking one round of bird shot in the cylinder might be ok for defending against a snake... but I prefer to see them soon enough to avoid getting in a sticky situation with them. If you see one and it's too late it is probably too late for bird shot too.
     
  3. Trailboss

    Trailboss Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    At self defense distance, fine shot groups the same as buck shot. However, fineshot will not penetrate as deep and may not even go through clothing. First shot buck, every shot buck. Aim small, miss small.
     
  4. glockman99

    glockman99 Hoquiam, WA. Active Member

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    I much better like the plan of having the first shot out of my Glock 21 pistol to be a 230 grain Speer Gold Dot, rather some very small, underpowered birdshot. The first shot counts, so better make it a good one.
     
  5. Liberty

    Liberty ..\. Member

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    ...
     
  6. herr7292

    herr7292 West of Portland New Member

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    I'm no expert, but my thought is my gun is my last resort for kill, not to scare or deter. To me, that is what alarms are for, to make a bunch of noise to hopefully scare off people. If my gun is out and I am shooting, I am not going to be worrying about the first two shots being bird shot to then take a better shot. I am just going to shoot.
     
  7. asiparks

    asiparks PDX Active Member

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    wait, what ? The "opponent" will be confused and stand square on with a bemused look so you can leisurely send the next round center mass ? If you want to distract him, paper your walls with Hustler centerfolds.
    So bearing in mind this propensity to miss under stress, and that your sidearm likely doesn't have infinite bullets in the mag, wouldn't you want as many effective, stopping rounds as possible ?
    I can't even parse that into anything that makes an argument .

    Or give them an opportunity to return fire with their non birdshotty rounds, so that they may step over my corpse, go rape my wife and kill my children....
    If they are not serious about stopping a threat, if they're not mentally prepared to accept that might mean taking a life, then tell them to get a big loud dog because an intruder, pissed off, full of adrenaline at being peppered with birdshot, is going to take their gun off them and insert it, ungently, where the sun doesn't shine..
     
    soberups and (deleted member) like this.
  8. soberups

    soberups Newberg Well-Known Member

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    Have you ever fired a .357 birdshot round at anything?

    If not, give it a try. Shoot at a phone book at, say, 10 feet. You might wind up getting about an inch of penetration at best, with shot that is slightly bigger and heavier than pocket lint. Handgun shot rounds are marginally adequate for shooting snakes at arms length, but utterly worthless as a self-defense round.
     
  9. Trailboss

    Trailboss Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Wow, I sure misread the OP. The OP is speaking of snake shot for the first two rounds? Might as well use blanks and if the first two rounds are good with blanks, just shoot all blanks. Dumb idea.
     
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  10. drew

    drew OR Well-Known Member

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    I thought this was interesting showing some drywall penetration results including how little some .223 rounds penetrated vs handgun or shotgun rounds. It's not a complete or conclusive test. .223 Drywall Penetration: Results
     
    herr7292 and (deleted member) like this.
  11. pioneer461

    pioneer461 Columbia County, Oregon Active Member

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    Discharging a firearm (deadly force) to distract someone is both foolish and could land someone in serious legal trouble. If they are unable to shoot well, they should get some serious training. They are repeating old wife's tales that have been around for decades, if not longer, and have some serious misunderstanding about self defense. That kind of thinking is similar to Joe Biden's recent advice for women to get a double barreled shotgun, and discharge both barrels in the air to scare off the attacker.
     
  12. Nick Burkhardt

    Nick Burkhardt NE Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Not recommended. At self defense distances the shot pattern will not open up enough and at longer distances the rifling of the pistol barrel will cause a doughnut pattern with a void in the middle.
     
  13. slind

    slind Seattle, WA Member

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    Hey everyone, thanks for the input!!! I will have a god talk with him and my future brother in law and share with love.... whats crazy is front sight is training one of them and i have friends who train military and swatt... for some reasone this idea is out there.