Russian troop build up on the Ukrainian border ...

[Horatius]

It's not 1954. Don't need Air America tactics to take a peek. Actually one of the few times you can turn on the news and see it. Vlad isn't trying to hide.

more likely trying to lightup air defense radar sites...I would.

 

[nwslopoke]

more likely trying to lightup air defense radar sites...I would.

This leads into a rabbit hole of off topic issues from blowing up foreign relations, current leadership, ect. Creativity has left the building. Not every old idea is a bad idea, but it's still an old ideal.

 

[Cavedweller]

"On January 23, 2022, the Department of State authorized the voluntary departure of U.S. direct hire employees (USDH) and ordered the departure of eligible family members (EFM) from Embassy Kyiv due to the continued threat of Russian military action. U.S. citizens in Ukraine should consider departing now using commercial or other privately available transportation options."

Ukraine - Level 4: Do Not Travel

Ukraine Travel Advisory Do not travel to Ukraine due to the increased threats of Russian military action and COVID-19. Exercise increased caution in

ua.usembassy.gov

 

[Siglvr]

I have direct descendants who fought in these 3 wars noted below. They mostly started with this attitude which some of you so casually display on this thread. I'm not putting this up to demean anyone, I only ask you to consider these things and look at how great peace has been for our loved ones and our country:

Civil War (North Version): We'll kick those southern bubblegum's and be done within a week.
Civil War (South Version) We'll kick those northern bubblegum's and be done within a week.
RESULT: 620,000 dead, 1,500,000 injured, everyone -Civilian and military both, thought: "this is hell". And it was they all agreed, for 5 long years. Their world was shattered.

WW1 - This will be over and done soon. We'll finish those idiots off right quick and easy. It was neither quick nor easy.
RESULT: 37million estimated war dead (civi and military). The world was shattered.

WW2 - This will be over and done quick. We'll finish those idiots off right quick and easy. It was neither quick nor easy.
RESULT: According to Russian government figures, USSR losses within postwar borders now stand at 26.6 million, including 8 to 9 million due to famine and disease. They were the "winners" as far as territory advances and control. The United States got in late and still, our world was shattered. Everyone involved, civi and military, were ready for it to end and never occur again.

We have a tendency to overinflate and ignore how things really were. Things sucked during those conflicts, for the homefront as well as the warriors involved.

May we have peace, and resist the urge to denigrate the Russians who are fearful of us talking over their next door neighbor. Munitions have evolved since WW2 such that the casualties in the next conflict would be horrific. Your sons, your daughters, your dogs and goldfish all slaughtered in the worst manner imaginable. The US administration is causing this one, not Russia. We are doing it to them. I don't know why, but this is on us 100 percent. Should we continue along this reckless path, it's going to be needless and horrific. Not just for them, but for us.

 

[wired]

I have direct descendants who fought in these 3 wars noted below. They mostly started with this attitude which some of you so casually display on this thread. I'm not putting this up to demean anyone, I only ask you to consider these things and look at how great peace has been for our loved ones and our country:

Civil War (North Version): We'll kick those southern bubblegum's and be done within a week.
Civil War (South Version) We'll kick those northern bubblegum's and be done within a week.
RESULT: 620,000 dead, 1,500,000 injured, everyone -Civilian and military both, thought: "this is hell". And it was they all agreed, for 5 long years. Their world was shattered.

WW1 - This will be over and done soon. We'll finish those idiots off right quick and easy. It was neither quick nor easy.
RESULT: 37million estimated war dead (civi and military). The world was shattered.

WW2 - This will be over and done quick. We'll finish those idiots off right quick and easy. It was neither quick nor easy.
RESULT: According to Russian government figures, USSR losses within postwar borders now stand at 26.6 million, including 8 to 9 million due to famine and disease. They were the "winners" as far as territory advances and control. The United States got in late and still, our world was shattered. Everyone involved, civi and military, were ready for it to end and never occur again.

We have a tendency to overinflate and ignore how things really were. Things sucked during those conflicts, for the homefront as well as the warriors involved.

May we have peace, and resist the urge to denigrate the Russians who are fearful of us talking over their next door neighbor. Munitions have evolved since WW2 such that the casualties in the next conflict would be horrific. Your sons, your daughters, your dogs and goldfish all slaughtered in the worst manner imaginable. The US administration is causing this one, not Russia. We are doing it to them. I don't know why, but this is on us 100 percent. Should we continue along this reckless path, it's going to be needless and horrific. Not just for them, but for us.

I'll say your'e right about war sucking but this isnt 100% on us. Not even close. Its Russia being Russia. They could give a damn what we want. They arent swayed by our sanctions and we have no recourse short of going to total war with them to stop whatever it is they want to do in their backyard. They know that and know we arent going to go to total war with them over the fate of a country we have no protection treaty with.

 

[JuglansRegia]

I'll say your'e right about war sucking but this isnt 100% on us. Not even close. Its Russia being Russia. They could give a damn what we want. They arent swayed by our sanctions and we have no recourse short of going to total war with them to stop whatever it is they want to do in their backyard. They know that and know we arent going to go to total war with them over the fate of a country we have no protection treaty with.

So that is why we are flying in some last minute supplies with the hope that Ukraine can save itself. But its Russia's fault that most of its neighbors don't like them and want protection from their aggression.

 

[Camelfilter]

So that is why we are flying in some last minute supplies with the hope that Ukraine can save itself....

Nope. Simply Biden's handlers hoping doing so will up his poll #'s.

They have also announced that they expect a false flag from Russia.

Russia doesn't need a false flag, Putin could care less.

Biden's handlers do though...they need one to escalate Americas involvement. Poll #'s....

 

[Member 52301]

The D donkeys and R elephants who are SALIVATING FOR WAR in the District of Criminals are spreading the same old dung about Russia doing a FALSE FLAG deal.

If anyone is going to do a FALSE FLAG deal - it will be the USA, Ukraine with OUR HELP and Ukraine continues to want their free s!!! crapola (Gifts or buying items from us.) or Israel.

NEVER FORGET LBJ and his own words about the USS LIBERTY being attacked by Israel and HE wanted to blame it on Egypt. EVERY country knew that the USS LIBERTY was a US ship in that area and in that time frame. The ATTACK WAS DELIBERATE and old LBJ wanted it to SINK - his own words not me making this up.

IT was RECORDED on TAPE and let out years down the road and on Cspan and in other places. Plus you have USN sailors who were ON the LIBERTY SHIP who came out way down the road where they were told before to KEEP THEIR MOUTHS SHUT.

My late husband was on another MED cruise and remembered that time frame too. He was NOT on the USS LIBERTY and on another ship.

Some of you always want to blame Russia and even though Putin has a history as we all know with his background... I would and do TRUST him more in many ways than I would the LAST X AMOUNT OF U.S. PRESIDENTS with their CRAZY LAND and/or SENILE LAND crapola while their puppet masters CONTROLLED THEM and continue to control them NOW!

Smoke and mirrors! Neo conservative CON JOB artists or just plain LIARS and con artists - men/women in BOTH PARTIES.

There is NOTHING, absolutely ZERO - NOTHING, conservative about a NEO CONSERVATIVE no matter how much lipstick that they put on that elephant, donkey or PIG while they wave the red, white and blue flag, clutch a Bible upside down, chant songs and worship some former or present FALSE IDOL who has them conned aka brainwashed!

That goes for BIDEN, TRUMP, OBAMA, BUSH 2, the CLINTONS - BILLY BOY and the WITCH HC, BUSH 1, LBJ, etc. and their stinking NWO salami and their support for PNAC (PROJECT FOR THE NEW AMERICAN CENTURY) ILK in the R and D parties. Throw in the sons of guns including the bankers who want to control it all when it comes to any country that wants to stay independent!

LOOK at how many countries that have been destroyed in order for the PNAC Rs and Ds who had a LIST OF THEM and a plan to EFF THEM ALL UP.

Gee, why do we have all of the WAR refugees (Including illegal aliens.) coming from all over the world to the USA and other western countries?!

They are from MANY war torn and just plain EFFED UP countries that have been totally or almost all the way DESTROYED DUE TO PNAC and other dumb @@@ foreign policies from the USA and other western countries.

LET THEM SOLVE THEIR OWN PROBLEMS, tribal or none tribal, and stop causing problems - it is NONE OF OUR BUSINESS!

WE absolutely should NOT keep on supporting Ukraine with gifts or loans and that goes for a LONG list of OTHER countries out there.

WE should NOT go to war for Ukraine.

If SOME of the Ds and the Rs in D.C. and the rest of their filthy ILK across this country want war, send their sorry @@@es to our OWN US of A BORDERS on the south, north, east and west and PUT THEM ON THE FRONT LINE to prevent illegal aliens and other CRIMINALS including the cartels from all over the world from ENTERING THIS SOVEREIGN NATION.

Gee, we (USA) have MONEY, goods and PAY OFFS - BRIBES to domestic and foreign politicians to send to the Ukraine which is a VERY CORRUPT COUNTRY and to other corrupt countries and we can't even have BIG PHARMA, the MILITARY INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX that IKE WARNED US ABOUT in one of his final speeches and to the MEDICAL INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX problems FIXED and solved. PLUS it is far worse now with Fauci and his ILK. Crikey!

The USA can be one VERY STUPID COUNTRY to continue on with dumb @@@ ideas made by CON ARTIST MEN and WOMEN. We have a bunch of idiots who keep on electing these sons of guns too. The ones in power are not even smart enough, sane enough or honest enough to PICK UP OUR GARBAGE off of a freaking truck too. It is an insult to GOOD TRASH PICK UP MEN to compare them to these past and present idiots in power too! They are as worthless as teats on a boar!

Cate

 

[wired]

So that is why we are flying in some last minute supplies with the hope that Ukraine can save itself. But its Russia's fault that most of its neighbors don't like them and want protection from their aggression.

What does that have to do with anything? Sending them a few container loads of ammo to plug their bullet holes at the last minute isnt going to do squat. They can WANT protection all they want but they arent a NATO member and they dont have mutual protection treaties with anyone. If Putin wants to go in he can at any time. He has mutliple armored divisions ready to roll and some of the best ADA there is. Russia can roll right over that country essentially unopposed any time it feels like it.

 

[Angie]

Anything we send over to the Ukraine should be considered merely a gift for Russia. There is nothing we can give them that will stop the inevitable. It will all fall into the hands of Russian troops.

 

[Horatius]

when was the last time Germany allied themselves with Russia/USSR?

 

[wired]

when was the last time Germany allied themselves with Russia/USSR?

There was 1917. Then there was 1939. Its not unheard of. They need material from Russia . Theyre pragmatic. .

 

[Horatius]

There was 1917. Then there was 1939. Its not unheard of. They need material from Russia . Theyre pragmatic. .

Once great countries that killed or drove off all the independent, free-thinking people, valuing compliance, disagreeing at the expense of your family does that!

 

[Horatius]

OR I watched the arsonist burn the town next to mine and did nothing!

 

[wired]

Once great countries that killed or drove off all the independent, free-thinking people, valuing compliance, disagreeing at the expense of your family does that!

It could also be said that Germany has been highly involved with Russia for the last 30 years or so. Stores all over Russia are full of German goods, especially processed foods. German built factories stretch from St Petersburg to Eastern Siberia and employ millions of Russians. Some of the largest parts suppliers for German industries are in Russia. Russia is the largest wheat exporter in the world by far and most of that supplies Germany. Russian gas heats German homes, Their oil fills German cars.

 

[Horatius]

It could also be said that Germany has been highly involved with Russia for the last 30 years or so. Stores all over Russia are full of German goods, especially processed foods. German built factories stretch from St Petersburg to Eastern Siberia and employ millions of Russians. Some of the largest parts suppliers for German industries are in Russia. Russia is the largest wheat exporter in the world by far and most of that supplies Germany. Russian gas heats German homes, Their oil fills German cars.

All True also

 

[Longwalkhome]

If you listen, the elite won't let war stand in the way of making money. The Olympics have to play out first.

 

[ATCclears]

NATO to Send Ships, Jet Fighters to Eastern Europe Amid Standoff With Russia

Allies are bolstering NATO’s eastern flank in response to Russia’s military buildup around Ukraine, the EU set out plans for loans and grants for Kyiv worth more than $1.3 billion and the U.S. ordered thousands of troops to prepare for possible deployment.

www.wsj.com

 

[pdxjimbo]

What if...?

What if Russia invaded and seized an area of the Ukraine such as the Donbas region? Or some other region along their border with Ukraine. Not a full scale invasion intent on occupying the entire country, call it a "minor incursion".

What if they tipped their hand to the West in advance to let them know that it was going to be a "limited" incursion?

Would the West react differently than a full on invasion of Ukraine?

And what if, at the same time, China moved against Taiwan?

Interesting times we live in.

 

[ATCclears]

What if...?

What if Russia invaded and seized an area of the Ukraine such as the Donbas region? Or some other region along their border with Ukraine. Not a full scale invasion intent on occupying the entire country, call it a "minor incursion".

What if they tipped their hand to the West in advance to let them know that it was going to be a "limited" incursion?

Would the West react differently than a full on invasion of Ukraine?

And what if, at the same time, China moved against Taiwan?

Interesting times we live in.

When attacking the enemy, don't give them problems - give them dilemmas.