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Siglvr

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I don’t believe that guy.
But you believe the mainstream media who have lied lied and lied even some more? Perhaps they have some yellow cake and we need immediate action?

Curious: Why don't you believe that guy?
 
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Ukraine has enormous energy reserves and pipelines into Europe. That’s it. No conspiracy theories needed. Once the pro-Putin puppet Yanukovych was removed from Ukraine during their 2014 revolution, Putin saw himself losing control over his golden goose and invaded Crimea. He’s been on their doorstep since then waiting for the right moment to seize control of that revenue stream once again.

Power and money are addicting. Putin and his oligarchs in Russia and pro-Russian former Soviet states have siphoned hundreds of billions of dollars in wealth while their citizens live in poverty.
 
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Ukraine has enormous energy reserves and pipelines into Europe. That’s it. No conspiracy theories needed. Once the pro-Putin puppet Yanukovych was removed from Ukraine during their 2014 revolution, Putin saw himself losing control over his golden goose and invaded Crimea. He’s been on their doorstep since then waiting for the right moment to seize control of that revenue stream once again.

Power and money are addicting. Putin and his oligarchs in Russia and pro-Russian former Soviet states have siphoned hundreds of billions of dollars in wealth while their citizens live in poverty.
It has nothing to do with oil reserves or rebuilding the Soviet Union territory. . Russia has massive oil reserves and they are making billions off it . They have a budget surplus of about $700 Billion . They are not a broke failed state whos people live in poverty who are hungry for those Ukrainian hryvnia . Seriously? Ever been to Russia? Quite the eye opener about how much you get lied to.
The entire theatrics has to do with Russia wanting to keep NATO out of Ukraine. Thats it. Ukraine has been pining for NATO membership for years and the Russians are not going to let it happen.
 

monkeybutler

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But you believe the mainstream media who have lied lied and lied even some more? Perhaps they have some yellow cake and we need immediate action?

Curious: Why don't you believe that guy?
Don’t tell what I or who I believe. Seriously.

the guy is an obvious crank.
 

Horatius

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It has nothing to do with oil reserves or rebuilding the Soviet Union territory. . Russia has massive oil reserves and they are making billions off it . They have a budget surplus of about $700 Billion . They are not a broke failed state whos people live in poverty who are hungry for those Ukrainian hryvnia . Seriously? Ever been to Russia? Quite the eye opener about how much you get lied to.
The entire theatrics has to do with Russia wanting to keep NATO out of Ukraine. Thats it. Ukraine has been pining for NATO membership for years and the Russians are not going to let it happen.
IF NATO wanted Ukraine and they were able to meet the minimum requirements for stability to join, what could Russia really do about it? They were losing when they had the WHOLE USSR!
 
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IF NATO wanted Ukraine and they were able to meet the minimum requirements for stability to join, what could Russia really do about it? They were losing when they had the WHOLE USSR!
If Russia wanted Ukraine they would walk in. No one is going to stop them. If Ukraine decided they wanted to be a NATO member and NATO as a group was stupid enough to agree to it Russia would walk in and stop it. No one , NATO included, would stop them. They would protest and sanction whatever they havent done already , which isnt much. They'd block WOLF ammo sales into the US. Oh wait, they did that. Russia has built up a relatively self sufficient economy and is pretty much sanction proof. They'll still trade freely with China who isnt going to play along either. NATO isnt going to wage war on Russia. Its a paper tiger. Nukes have turned the whole anti aggression pact concept into a joke. Germany decided a few years ago to denuclearize their power grid. They and the rest of Western Europe NEED Russian natural gas. Its all fun and games and smack talk until it gets cold outside then that Russian pipeline opens up again.
 

Horatius

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If Russia wanted Ukraine they would walk in. No one is going to stop them. If Ukraine decided they wanted to be a NATO member and NATO as a group was stupid enough to agree to it Russia would walk in and stop it. No one , NATO included, would stop them. They would protest and sanction whatever they havent done already , which isnt much. They'd block WOLF ammo sales into the US. Oh wait, they did that. Russia has built up a relatively self sufficient economy and is pretty much sanction proof. They'll still trade freely with China who isnt going to play along either. NATO isnt going to wage war on Russia. Its a paper tiger. Nukes have turned the whole anti aggression pact concept into a joke. Germany decided a few years ago to denuclearize their power grid. They and the rest of Western Europe NEED Russian natural gas. Its all fun and games and smack talk until it gets cold outside then that Russian pipeline opens up aga[n.
I hope it stays Hypothetical. Russia has been the mouth that roared since the end of WW2. Boris Yeltsin shed tears when he realized the lie the USSR was, hence the fall of said communist country. I personally root for the home team!
 
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I hope it stays Hypothetical. Russia has been the mouth that roared since the end of WW2. Boris Yeltsin shed tears when he realized the lie the USSR was, hence the fall of said communist country. I personally root for the home team!
You can root for whatever you want. Doesnt make a bit of difference. In Russia and Ukraine, Russia is the home team. Its their backyard and the reality of the situation is that if Ukraine is allowed to join NATO by NATO Russia will stop the deal from going through one way or another and we will not be in the position to do anything to stop it. I personally dont think NATO is that stupid. Allowing Ukraine to join NATO will not help the security of the other member nations.

Boris Yeltsin shedding tears. Good one. If Yeltsin shed tears its because he was drunk. He was a weak patsy who was put in place to allow the Soviet Union to fall apart so a few "entrepreneurs" could cash in.
 
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It has nothing to do with oil reserves or rebuilding the Soviet Union territory. . Russia has massive oil reserves and they are making billions off it . They have a budget surplus of about $700 Billion . They are not a broke failed state whos people live in poverty who are hungry for those Ukrainian hryvnia . Seriously? Ever been to Russia? Quite the eye opener about how much you get lied to.
The entire theatrics has to do with Russia wanting to keep NATO out of Ukraine. Thats it. Ukraine has been pining for NATO membership for years and the Russians are not going to let it happen.
Not just oil. Natural gas, coal (top 7 in the world for coal reserves), iron ore (top 3 in the world for iron ore reserves), uranium, graphite (top 2 in the world for graphite reserves).

It's a country ripe for exploiting by oligarchs.
 
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Not just oil. Natural gas, coal (top 7 in the world for coal reserves), iron ore (top 3 in the world for iron ore reserves), uranium, graphite (top 2 in the world for graphite reserves).

It's a country ripe for exploiting by oligarchs.
All of which Russia has in excess. The Russian far east is as they call it in Russia "The resource appendage" . Its still all about NATO expansion.
 
If Putin wants to discourage Ukraine's entry into NATO, then why doesn't he de-escalate and pull back his troops and hardware ?
Seems like that would be the best way to keep Ukraine a buffer state.

The Russians that I work with think it is all just posturing.
One guy said that it would be like Oregon invading Washington.....not going to happen.
I haven't worked around Ukrainians for a long time, but when I did, they did not like (to put it mildly) the Russians.
 

Horatius

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If Putin wants to discourage Ukraine's entry into NATO, then why doesn't he de-escalate and pull back his troops and hardware ?
Seems like that would be the best way to keep Ukraine a buffer state.

The Russians that I work with think it is all just posturing.
One guy said that it would be like Oregon invading Washington.....not going to happen.
I haven't worked around Ukrainians for a long time, but when I did, they did not like (to put it mildly) the Russians.
Putin has Banty Rooster syndrome, and a large number of people employed trying to convince the west people flee Russia if they can because it's so good!
 
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If Putin wants to discourage Ukraine's entry into NATO, then why doesn't he de-escalate and pull back his troops and hardware ?
Seems like that would be the best way to keep Ukraine a buffer state.

The Russians that I work with think it is all just posturing.
One guy said that it would be like Oregon invading Washington.....not going to happen.
I haven't worked around Ukrainians for a long time, but when I did, they did not like (to put it mildly) the Russians.
The Ukrainians would forge ahead with NATO expansion if given the chance. The west is chomping at the bit for them to join NATO. Lots of money to be made there by Western companies in case you havent been paying attention to the news. Lots of companies and politicians sniffing dollars.
 
The Ukrainians would forge ahead with NATO expansion if given the chance. The west is chomping at the bit to join NATO. Lots of money to be made there by Western companies in case you havent been paying attention to the news. Lots of companies and politicians sniffing dollars.
They probably want security like everyone else. If the Russian threat was eased, maybe they wouldn't need NATO ?
Why not the Finland model for Ukraine ?
They had to punch Russia in the mouth a couple times, to achieve what they have, though.
 
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They probably want security like everyone else. If the Russian threat was eased, maybe they wouldn't need NATO ?
Why not the Finland model for Ukraine ?
They had to punch Russia in the mouth a couple times, to achieve what they have, though.
Its hard to equate Ukraine with Finland. The Soviet Union of the 1930's is not the Russia of the 2020's. Theyre still feeling as though they were taken advantage of after the Soviet Union collapsed and NATO expanded into their sphere of influence. Ukraine has always kind of been their bubblegum and they arent going to let NATO expand into Ukraine no matter what the Ukrainians want.
 
Its hard to equate Ukraine with Finland. The Soviet Union of the 1930's is not the Russia of the 2020's. Theyre still feeling as though they were taken advantage of after the Soviet Union collapsed and NATO expanded into their sphere of influence. Ukraine has always kind of been their bubblegum and they arent going to let NATO expand into Ukraine no matter what the Ukrainians want.
I agree, the West missed an opportunity after the collapse to become a friend to Russia.
That ship has sailed.
And look where we are now.
Poking each other with sharp sticks....again.
 
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Putin putting troops in Cuba and Venezuela.

Poor Putin. I'm starting to think he's stuck in a 1960s mentality. Of course, that's about where Biden is, too, so I guess we're screwed all the way around.
 

arakboss

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