Round for deer/elk/bear?

[nitestocker]

i hand load my 3006 i use a 180 gr nos part with 59.6 gr of h4831 very accurate in my marlin XL7 3006. it is cheaper to reload you can get real good factory load but they will cost you . my friend thought me to reload. but to be honest you can go down to bi-mart and buy a couple boxes or rem 180 gr. core locks and it will take anything in this continent. the 3006 is a good round for . moose, elk, bear any kind. deer, caribou, the 3006 has taken just about every game animal out there as long as you do your part and take out the power plant the 06 will do her part and you can get the ammo everywhere except country that dont allow rifles that use military calibers there are more better rounds for the big bear and moose like the 375 .hh mag which has the trajectory of the 06 by the way. but you only gave me 3 choices and the 270 is just a neck down 3006 and the 7-08 is a neck down 308 stick with the winner and go 06

 

[landcbeitner]

The fact that the 270 is just a necked 30-06 and the 7-08 is a necked 308 brings up an interesting point.... Most cartridges we use today were at one time "wild cats". Well if the larger bore size is always better why are wild catters often necking down and not just opening necks to accept larger and larger dia. bullets? A larger bullet diamater in a given weight can always be driven faster. For example a 30-06 can run a 140gr bullet at 3100fps while a 6.5-06 (just a 30-06 necked down to .264") can only push a 140gr bullet at 2850fps. So why in the heck would someone want to do that? The answer is ballistis at greater ranges.

At 100yds The 30-06 140gr load would have an extra 269 lbs of energy over the 6.5-06
At 500yds the 6.5-06 140gr load would have an extra 204 lbs of energy over the 30-06

A smaller diamater bullet of a given weight will have a higher sectional density and usually a higher form factor increasing the ballistic coefficient dramatically.

Well, of course you could simply use a heavier bullet in the 30-06 to make up for the energy and then some right? Kind of.... a 210 berger VLD (one of the better 30 cal bullets BC wise) would have a slightly higher BC than a 6.5mm 140gr VLD (.631 vs. .612) but a 30-06 could only push that bullet at 2550fps. There are two issues with this: the first is bullets fail to expand properly at lower velocities, the second is that bullet drop becomes more difficult to compensate for when there is so much drop.

At 500yds the 30-06/210VLD would hit at 1892fps and have 62" of bullet drop (from 100yd zero)

At 500yds the 6.5-06/140VLD would hit at 2133fps and have 48" of bullet drop (from 100yd zero)

Since most hunters use "hold over" for hitting game at ranges beyond 200yds the bullet drop issue is dramatic. Having a bullet fail to expand properly could cause an animal to not be collected. So I gues the wild catter's weren't just wasting time when necking cartridges down.

If you're sticking with factory loads you should compare them with an ballistic calculator... if you're not shooting game at ranges beyond 200yds cartridge comparison is infinately more simplified. As always bullet placement is king... "flat is fine, accuracy is final".

 

[OR_VARMINT_HUNTER]

This is all been good info I'm learning something which is also good lol so for the heck of it how does a reg 7mm compare to a 7mm-08? being that a 270 is a smaller 06 and a 7mm-08 is a smaller 308 how do the reg 7mm share the same 7mm part with a 7mm-08?

 

[tomcat]

7mm mag or 7mm? 7mm mag is what I shoot.. Hands down
Flater shooting thin the 30-06 and will take anything..
Down fall is if you hit a hard bone .. I likes to make a big hole
.. Iv taking deer and elk at 700-800 with my 7mm mag
I do have a 30-06,308,270,243,6mm,257, 280,
All in all I shoot the 7mm mag and the 308 most... My 1st gun was a 30-30 and a 30-06
I just like the flat shooting of the 7mm mag.. Is kick a big thing to you?

 

[OR_VARMINT_HUNTER]

No not really ant worried about kick

 

[tomcat]

Look at the mossburg ATR or the x7 both sweet guns

 

[landcbeitner]

The 7-08 and the 7mm rem mag can use the same bullets... the 7 mag can shoot all bullets at significantly higher muzzle velocities, so it will always have superior energy, ballistics, etc. It's much simpler to compare cartridges using the same caliber bullets. The negatives of the magnum are much shorter barrel life and much stiffer recoil (if you're not worried about kick, it's no big deal)

You mentioned that the 7-08 you're looking at has a 1:9.5 twist, this will work for the 168gr Berger VLD's (.617 BC) this allows good long range energy and ballistics.

7-08 can run these bullets around 2670fps the 7mm rem mag can push them to about 2900fps. It would break down as follows:

7-08/168vld: @ 500yd: velocity 1893fps, energy 1467 lbs., drop 56" (from 100yd zero)
7 mag/168vld: @ 500yd: velocity 2182fps, energy 1776 lbs., drop 46" (from 100yd zero)

 

[mjbskwim]

Ballistics are great aren't they?

I personally think taking a deer or elk over 3-400 yards is just ridiculous.Not really hunting at all.
Too many variables and too many chances of a bad hit.
How many animals are left to die with guys out shooting at them like this?
Yeah I'm just sure YOU are a "one shot,one kill" every time,kinda guy.But what about the next idiot that reads this and says "well the guy on the innerwebben did it ,so can I"

Learn to actually HUNT and then you don't have to worry about ballistics out to 500 yards.

Hey,flame on

 

[landcbeitner]

Yes indeed, bullets drop off fast out past 300 yds, but all of the above cartridges develop so much more than the 1200 lbs of energy required for Elk, that to compare anything other than bullet construction would be silly. I only put the technical info out. It's pure science... so many believe there's a magic combo.... the magic they often observe is when ideal velocity and bullet construction meet for fantastic results...

Here's my personal take on long range hunting ethics....

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