Revolver Issue: S&W Model 28 - cylinder advance starts getting tight at round 5 and 6...

[Certaindeaf]

Whatever you do, don't horse the trigger or hammer trying to rotate it.
Stop.

 

[po18guy]

But if there's a problem with the breech face/shield around the firing pin hole the primer can flow creating binding.

Yes, with over-pressure loads. But that would be immediately apparent, via cratered or flattened primers. Occasionally, when someone was attempting a velocity record, the primer cup would extrud into the firing pin hole. Problem.

The OP can even decap the cases and do the same sharpie test. It might be a bad lot of brass. There are other threads on that problem - which seems to occur during times of unprecedented demand.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Yes, with over-pressure loads. But that would be immediately apparent, via cratered or flattened primers. Occasionally, when someone was attempting a velocity record, the primer cup would extrud into the firing pin hole. Problem.

Not if the firing pin hole is messed up from flame cutting or enlargement. You can get puckered primers that will hang up.

 

[EHJ]

Whatever you do, don't horse the trigger or hammer trying to rotate it.
Stop.

Left the range early 20 minutes before posting all this.
When DA got stiff on all the 5th/6th shots I shut down and came here to ask all my friends.

 

[po18guy]

Will wait to see what is eventually reported.

EDIT: The progressive nature of the problem leans toward bullet jump as a potential cause, as solv3nt mentioned. Next time out, measure overall length, fire 3-4 then extract and measure the unfired rounds. If they are any longer, then they have insufficient bullet pull, or crimp.

Right now, you can look for shaved lead build up on the right side of the barrel at the gap.

 

[EHJ]

Will wait to see what is eventually reported.

EDIT: The progressive nature of the problem leans toward bullet jump as a potential cause, as solv3nt mentioned. Next time out, measure overall length, fire 3-4 then extract and measure the unfired rounds. If they are any longer, then they have insufficient bullet pull, or crimp.

Right now, you can look for shaved lead build up on the right side of the barrel at the gap.

I like the sharpie idea.
It seems like it's the fired cases at the breech end that are hanging things up somehow.

 

[po18guy]

I like the sharpie idea.
It seems like it's the fired cases at the breech end that are hanging things up somehow.

Easy enough to test. We have other complaints of bad brass. Have these been reloaded? If so, there's a chance that the shell holder was not centered on the die and might have left the rim slightly canted.

 

[EHJ]

Easy enough to test. We have other complaints of bad brass. Have these been reloaded? If so, there's a chance that the shell holder was not centered on the die and might have left the rim slightly canted.

Bingo.
Remington white box stuff of unknown age...

I have some other random boxes I'll test tomorrow.

Really appreciate all the help.

 

[K-22]

... to the point that DA trigger pulls won't even advance past the 5th round. Even pulling the hammer back for an SA shot gets tight.

Snap caps and unloaded all is smooth as silk.


What am I missing? Any and all help appreciated.

Edit: This is the first session this thing has been fired in 30 years. All lubed and operating well. It was used very little when "new".

When the gun locks up, with the gun between you and a good light source, closely inspect the gap between the cylinder and barrel, and between the cylinder and the recoil shield.
Best,
Gary

 

[jbett98]

Try using a feeler gauge to check the gaps.

 

[EHJ]

When the gun locks up, with the gun between you and a good light source, closely inspect the gap between the cylinder and barrel, and between the cylinder and the recoil shield.
Best,
Gary
View attachment 1057882View attachment 1057881View attachment 1057881

Gaps are good. (.004 - .006")

I'm pretty sure it's the slightly raised case rim (of a fired round) that rides a tad proud that is hanging things up at the recoil plate as the cylinder rotates.

 

[drstrangelove]

Gaps are good. (.004 - .006")

I'm pretty sure it's the slightly raised case rim (of a fired round) that rides a tad proud that is hanging things up at the recoil plate as the cylinder rotates.


View attachment 1057903

That pic does suggest that the brass at 9:00 is dragging across the angle of the frame face as it's moving to 6:00 in SW cc rotation. I have a SW66 and a Ruger Blackhawk that occasionally bind like this, but it has usually been due to overused brass, loose primer pockets, and insufficient powder charge. Polishing the frame face and flattening this rub over edge might help but will require rebluing.

 

[JuglansRegia]

It could be a lot of things, bent or loose ejector rod, excessive end shake, crud under the ejector star and or counter bored chambers or if you are lucky, it could just be crappy ammo

 

[EHJ]

Epilogue:

Went back to the range with different ammo. 38, 357 - 2 different mfg's. Winchester and Hornaday.

Smooth as silk. No issues whatsoever.

The ammo I first used was [In A Box Labeled As] .38 spl. Remington UMC... I knew it must have been old - but I have no assurances of anything.

All spent cases in the cylinder left no lifted rims like before.

Thank you to all with your help and suggestions.

 

[ma96782]

Everything works... Until the last 2 shots of live ammo... 38 or 357. No matter the order of cylinder alignment - after the first 4 rounds fired - the last 2 get stiff. Especially the last, 6th. My guess is the spent casings are binding the cylinder's rotation as it advances to the last 2 shots.

If it were reloaded ammo or underpowered loads........I'd suspect that the primers might be backing out a bit. Enough to cause a drag against the recoil shield.

Aloha, Mark

 

[EHJ]

Epilogue 2.0

So I borrowed a set of gauge blocks from a friend and got some tips...
We checked the spent brass and sure enough - all rims seemed canted.
After a good inspection he and I concluded these rounds (regardless of the box they came in) were definitely reloads. Trimmed cases, thinning brass at the heads. So... thanks @po18guy. Spot on.

Easy enough to test. We have other complaints of bad brass. Have these been reloaded? If so, there's a chance that the shell holder was not centered on the die and might have left the rim slightly canted.

And now after burning through a months worth of cheap rent in ammo.... I now understand this to be a concern as well...

Have you properly scoured the 38 rings that form in the 357 chamber? That can cause seating issues. Try using new brass... sometimes that works when nothing else will.

After a few hundred rounds I could see this happening... in general.
Although the dirty cylinder didn't bind like the canted rims from earlier - it did start dragging - due to the 2 stages of brass edge crud built up between the 2, .38's and the. 357's.

Again, thanks to all.

 

[po18guy]

I'm like a stopped calendar.