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I started loading 9mm in earnest recently. Mostly because I inherited a Ruger pc9 from my dad. Before when I loaded 9 mm I just kind of threw it together because I find loading automatic pistol cartridges a bit boring. I don't have anything against them they work just fine but I love my revolvers and bolt or lever gun cartridges. Also, 9 mm has always been an irritating cartridge for me. The slightly tapered case feels a little different in the press and I always seem to be fighting to get a good load for my pistol. I still haven't found a lead round that will shoot well in any of my 9 mm until recently. The Ruger PC carbine really likes lead and I am working on a load that uses a Lee 358-125 that is very promising. I'm working on a safe oal for that particular projectile.

For the purposes of today's discussion let's talk about the PC carbine, BE-86 powder, and X-treme bullets.

After initial testing (4.8 to 5.8 gr in .2 increments) and settling on a charge I decided to go with 5.5 to 5.6 grains of BE-86 under a 124 grain X-treme plated rn bullet. I think the results are outstanding. After getting that rifle sighted in with my new holosun reflex sight (no magnification) at 80 yards I was getting very consistent groups. I wish it shot as well in my Walther CCP but alas no joy. The Walther doesn't seem to like that bullet at any charge. I wonder if it's that polygonal rifling. I have a heck of a time finding a load that the Walther likes. The Walther seems to like S&B jacketed 9mm 124 grain. I hate buying jacketed Factory ammo.

There is a five shot and then a 10 shot group in the photos. The two flyers in the 10-shot group are totally me. As Paul Harrell says, "Yes that's irritating and yes that's just me."

I need to run these across the chronograph. They hit that plate with a pretty good wallop. Everything fit and functioned no failures. I'm shooting these off the back of my pickup, not the best platform, but it's what I got. It seems to be a little dirty shooting but it doesn't seem to affect the function of the gun. The primers and cases look fine no cratering or ejector/extractor marks. I put over 100 rounds down the barrel and never had a failure. The brass just looks a little dirty/sooty. Amazing how much the group's tightened up at 5.5 and 5.6 grains. Good enough to be quick and dirty at 150 yards for sure.OAL I'm using is 1.148. The plate is 8 in and it's 9/16 hard Steel.

I recently purchased some x-def 135 grain hollow points from X-treme. After I get done with this batch of plated round nose I'm looking forward to working up a load with the hollow points. They aren't ridiculously expensive if they work they might be a nice option. I'd be glad to hear anybody's experience with X-tremes x-def hollow points.


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I have tried a lot of different 9 mm lead loads and found them not as accurate as jacketed. I found one older 9 mm
that did well with lead. But they all shot jacketed bullets good? Now all the 45 ACP guns I have owned all did
the best groups with 200 SWC lead bullets? I have been told that 9 mm rifling is not as deep as a 45 so the
9mm does not shoot well with lead bullets? I don't know what to think I'm skeptical. If you can get 9 mm lead
to shoot good for you. I have found a good shooting bullets are the cheap Berry's plated bullets almost as
cheap as lead.
 
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Yes I'm having a similar experience. In my .38, .357, .351wsl, and my 40 caliber Shield cast lead seems to work really well. Not so in the 9 mm for me so far. It's quite irritating...
 
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FWIW
Back when I was casting a lot I found my 9mm's did better with .357 or .358 sized and lubed hard cast slugs. Lee molds I had threw a .355 so not so good for me. My favorites were 146 gr round nose. Slug and measure your barrels you may be in for a surprise.
 
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I loaded for my PC9 & P89 using 5.0 grain Unique pushing 122 grain lead...

same batch comparing rifle vs pistol

PC9 flew at 1165 fps
P89 flew at 959 fps

just thought that was interesting, it shows the longer barrel had better powder burn
 
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I loaded for my PC9 & P89 using 5.0 grain Unique pushing 122 grain lead...

same batch comparing rifle vs pistol

PC9 flew at 1165 fps
P89 flew at 959 fps

just thought that was interesting, it shows the longer barrel had better powder burn
Yes for sure. I think you will find that with a slower powder you'll get better results velocity-wise out of a carbine. Even without the chronograph I can tell there's quite a difference in the way the projectile strikes my steel plate out of the carbine vs a 3 inch pistol barrel
 
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I tried some of the xdef 135 hp at 4.6 grains per the x-treme loading manual. I had similar groupings to the 124 grain round nose but when I tested them on gallons of water I got zero expansion even out of the carbine. They obviously aren't moving fast enough to expand. I didn't have any signs of high pressure at 4.6 grains of be 86 so I reckon I will start working up from there until I see some signs of expansion or pressure. The carbine itself is very forgiving on what ammo is fired in it; the only thing I noticed is that the chamber is considerably tighter than my Walther CCP, which is kind of surprising to me.

If anybody has any experience with these 9mm xdef projectiles I'd be very welcome to hear what you have to say.
 
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I tried some of the xdef 135 hp at 4.6 grains per the x-treme loading manual. I had similar groupings to the 124 grain round nose but when I tested them on gallons of water I got zero expansion even out of the carbine. They obviously aren't moving fast enough to expand. I didn't have any signs of high pressure at 4.6 grains of be 86 so I reckon I will start working up from there until I see some signs of expansion or pressure. The carbine itself is very forgiving on what ammo is fired in it; the only thing I noticed is that the chamber is considerably tighter than my Walther CCP, which is kind of surprising to me.

If anybody has any experience with these 9mm xdef projectiles I'd be very welcome to hear what you have to say.
I just reread your post and saw that it was the 135g DEF. I was thinking of someone who was talking about the 124g DEF bullets.

On the other hand, I would think that they would load like HP’s in any loading book. :s0092:
 
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Yes I'm having a similar experience. In my .38, .357, .351wsl, and my 40 caliber Shield cast lead seems to work really well. Not so in the 9 mm for me so far. It's quite irritating...
For some odd reason (mainly miitary ball), John Browning designed the 9mm with a very quick (IIRC) 1:10 twist rate. This tends to strip the rifling engraved into lead bullets and accuracy can be poor. For this reason, back when when Bar-Sto introduced 9mm stainless barrels for the 1911, they slowed the twist rate to 1:16 and voilá, instant accuracy improvement.
 
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Have you tried a prism sight if they make them for that?
I have not, I have a plea out if someone close to let me take a gander of theirs.

 

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