Question on pain killers in emergency survival situations

[U201492]

I've seen it written that for many patients the combination of Tylenol (acetaminophen) and an NSAID (non-steroid, anti-inflammatory drugs -- like aspirin, ibuprofen and naproxen) can be as effective as a narcotic pain reliever. Those will all store for many years.

And if you're in Washington state, marijuana is legal, too, though I don't know how effective it would be with a kidney stone.

Good question on the MMJ- the big problem is, you can have MMJ or you can have firearms but you can't have both. You get an MMJ card and the BATFE will not approve your application to purchase a firearm.

Meanwhile, I got back from the VA hospital- no kidney stones (yay!) on the ultrasound. No infection (yay!) showed up in my urine or blood test. My back and kidneys are killing me,,,,and nobody knows why.

 

[Bazooka Joe]

Good question on the MMJ- the big problem is, you can have MMJ or you can have firearms but you can't have both. You get an MMJ card and the BATFE will not approve your application to purchase a firearm.

Well, I was assuming in a complete collapse scenario that the BATFE would not be around to accept or deny applications.

Congrats on not having another stone to deal with.

 

[AMProducts]

I've seen it written that for many patients the combination of Tylenol (acetaminophen) and an NSAID (non-steroid, anti-inflammatory drugs -- like aspirin, ibuprofen and naproxen) can be as effective as a narcotic pain reliever. Those will all store for many years.

And if you're in Washington state, marijuana is legal, too, though I don't know how effective it would be with a kidney stone.

I stay right away from tylenol... again it's one of those drugs that has a very narrow therapeutic index, and is really tough on the liver. In fact, even a narrow overdose is enough to destroy your liver to the point that a transplant is necessary. I won't use it, I won't stock it, and I wouldn't recommend it's use or storage to anyone.

As for post-collapse (something I'm not thinking is terribly likely in the way most seem to think it is) MJ might be viable due to it's availability, however I think laudenum would be better as in smaller doses it can control pain, yet doesn't have wide range effects that MJ does. The most important thing with opiates is to use them orally, and consume them with food, this prevents the heavy sedative punch, and greatly extends the effect for a single dose. Like all drugs, both MJ and opiates can have a wide range of effects that differ on an individual basis, some people cannot tolerate opiates and have a paradoxic reaction, some people take a few puffs of MJ and are fine, other people are barely able to stand. As with all things, it's important to take therapeutic drugs seriously, and gradually especially if you have no idea what the effects will be.

 

[U201492]

I stay right away from tylenol... again it's one of those drugs that has a very narrow therapeutic index, and is really tough on the liver. In fact, even a narrow overdose is enough to destroy your liver to the point that a transplant is necessary. I won't use it, I won't stock it, and I wouldn't recommend it's use or storage to anyone.

As for post-collapse (something I'm not thinking is terribly likely in the way most seem to think it is) MJ might be viable due to it's availability, however I think laudenum would be better as in smaller doses it can control pain, yet doesn't have wide range effects that MJ does. The most important thing with opiates is to use them orally, and consume them with food, this prevents the heavy sedative punch, and greatly extends the effect for a single dose. Like all drugs, both MJ and opiates can have a wide range of effects that differ on an individual basis, some people cannot tolerate opiates and have a paradoxic reaction, some people take a few puffs of MJ and are fine, other people are barely able to stand. As with all things, it's important to take therapeutic drugs seriously, and gradually especially if you have no idea what the effects will be.

I see you've been looking over my shoulder reading my medical notes. I don't like the idea of making Laudem cause it's illegal but....it is what it is. I'd also shave off all my body hair if I was to use it- they can trace for opiates as long as the hair is long. Lose that evidence ya know?

 

[Whitey375]

Two things I might suggest... I don't know if you've tried the cherry pie filling, but one guy I know swears by it and he's in his early 70's.

http://www.best-gout-remedies.com/cherries-for-gout.html

The other is a Mr Coffee iced tea maker, they sell for about $20, I drink almost exclusively iced tea and will vary the concentration of tea based on season. I typically for winter do 8 teabags, for summer I do 3-4. Daily consumption for me is about 1gal of tea when it's cool, and up to 3 gals if it's hot, and I'm working outside. I know it sounds like a lot, but a 32oz beverage 3x a day is common for most people, if it's hot out and you're working hard, it's easy to get to the 8-12 you need to keep hydrated.

An older guy I hunt with gets gout really badly occasionally and his best cure is black cherry juice. My thought was dehydration, or freeze drying as a long term storage solution.

 

[The B]

I only got through about the first 5 posts before I had to stop reading. I can't answer the OP, I've never had a kidney stone, and I don't believe in narcotic pain killers..

But I can tell you I'm going to find out what causes kidney stones and I'm going to start living every day of my life actively preventing them from happening to me.

!

 

[jluck]

The thread started as a what if "[quoBen Beckerich, post: 1091837complete economic collapse member: 3244"]I only got through about the first 5 posts before I had to stop reading. I can't answer the OP, I've never had a kidney stone, and I don't believe in narcotic pain killers..

But I can tell you I'm going to find out what causes kidney stones and I'm going to start living every day of my life actively preventing them from happening to me.

![/quote]

The thread started as a what if " total economic collapse" SHTF thread asking about medicine options then to stones then worried about breaking laws, like that would matter then a pitty party, it's hard to offer answers when you can't catch up to the question.

 

[jbett98]

Drink lots of cranberry juice, the ascorbic acid helps break down the calcification of the stones.

 

[AMProducts]

I only got through about the first 5 posts before I had to stop reading. I can't answer the OP, I've never had a kidney stone, and I don't believe in narcotic pain killers..

But I can tell you I'm going to find out what causes kidney stones and I'm going to start living every day of my life actively preventing them from happening to me.

!

I've had enough nasty injuries that when the time comes I really like narcotic painkillers... Ever pulled your psoas muscle? it kinda feels like someone drop kicking you in the balls constantly for weeks. While even a morphine drip didn't take all the pain away, it did take the edge off enough that I could do PT and get better.

Kidney stones typically happen as a result of not drinking enough water, or certain other medical conditions that screw with the body's salt levels. As a few others have said, acidic foods tend to create a pathway for removing calcium from the body preventing it from forming stones.

I see you've been looking over my shoulder reading my medical notes. I don't like the idea of making Laudem cause it's illegal but....it is what it is. I'd also shave off all my body hair if I was to use it- they can trace for opiates as long as the hair is long. Lose that evidence ya know?

Technically, it's not illegal to take opium, only illegal to possess. Since it's a common ornamental plant that produces it, it's not technically illegal to cultivate, however there are more than a few schools of thought that say if you know anything about how to produce latex from the poppy, thought goes to intent. Generally, any kind of drug cultivation is something I stay pretty far away from, but I think it's important to be aware of the medicinal value of plants, and to cultivate them at some level to assure they are present when you need them. Same thing applies to food. I've been planting all varieties of food trees pretty much everywhere someone will let me do it.

 

[U201492]

Well thats it AM- I take so many different kinds of pills (based on salts and metals) that I cannot get away from them.

 

[AMProducts]

nearly every drug out there is delivered as a salt. It's just an easy way to make sure the drug stays water soluble.

The medical establishment usually wants to stuff people full of drugs rather than addressing the issues of poor diet or lack of exercise. I've seen this with my dad... he's on something like 12 different medications for blood pressure, heart pills, etc he wouldn't need them if he lost 80lbs and started walking regularly (problem is, all the pills make his legs swell up so he can barely walk).

 

[U201492]

nearly every drug out there is delivered as a salt. It's just an easy way to make sure the drug stays water soluble.

The medical establishment usually wants to stuff people full of drugs rather than addressing the issues of poor diet or lack of exercise. I've seen this with my dad... he's on something like 12 different medications for blood pressure, heart pills, etc he wouldn't need them if he lost 80lbs and started walking regularly (problem is, all the pills make his legs swell up so he can barely walk).

And does your Dad live in an apartment with literally nothing to do?

 

[jluck]

And does your Dad live in an apartment with literally nothing to do?

Go outside? walk? Ride a bike?volunteer somewhere?

 

[AMProducts]

And does your Dad live in an apartment with literally nothing to do?

Worse, he lives with my mom and they spend their days making each other crazy. I've been down here trying to put some order to this mess after my dad took a nasty spill last year, won't lose weight, won't control his diet (I feed him healthy food at home, but still runs out to mcdonalds every chance he gets). I've said my piece, and it's time to leave him to his fate and get on with my life and family.

 

[U201492]

Worse, he lives with my mom and they spend their days making each other crazy. I've been down here trying to put some order to this mess after my dad took a nasty spill last year, won't lose weight, won't control his diet (I feed him healthy food at home, but still runs out to mcdonalds every chance he gets). I've said my piece, and it's time to leave him to his fate and get on with my life and family.

*nodding in agreement* There's helping someone, and then there's the point where they have to do it. I do relate

 

[tfbit]

I recommend having a couple of knee surgeries and saving your meds for truly painful situations.

 

[U201492]

I recommend having a couple of knee surgeries and saving your meds for truly painful situations.

Would you settle for an appendix removal and umbilical hernia repair at the same time from the Seattle VA Hospital?

 

[erudne]

I'm no expert, not even a novice, but I would think raw poppy seeds might have a mild affect on pain and they are a lovely addition to your garden space

 

[jbett98]

Years ago, I rented a house on 2 acres that once belong to an Oregon State agriculture professor.
He had traveled all over the world and had planted a large exotic wild flower garden behind the house.
One day I noticed the stoner hippy neighbor cutting shallow circles around the circumference of the tall red flowers with a razor blade.
I asked him what he was up too, and he said that he was harvesting poppy sap.
The fluid from the cuts came out whitish, then turned dark after a day or so.
He then came back and scraped off the dark resin.
That was the only time I ever saw him do any kind of work, as he was always on some kind of disability.

 

[U201492]

I dunno; all the organic chemistry I've ever studied usually has names like C4, Trinitrotoluline, Nitroglycerin,,,pain killing chemistry is really outside of my skill base.