prices to skyrocket

[Silver Fox]

Someone said today's PT lumber doesn't contain CCA, but rather some copper compound w/o the arsenic. Anyone confirm that? That it's okay to use for raised beds?

That is a very good question. My little brother is about drop some coins on PT lumber, can someone chime in?

SF-

 

[Blitzkrieg]

We grow all of our own potatoes, garlic, beans, carrots and squash, and 50% of the rest of our fresh produce, right in our residential zoned back yard

Stuff to stockpile in dry sealed containers is sugar, white rice, dry beans, popcorn, wheat, barley, hulled oat groats, as well as yeast bricks (Costco) baking powder, dried milk, dried or canned cheese, honey and molasses. Buy a sturdy US made cast iron grain grinder. Don't go cheap on it or you'll regret it

My local supermarket gives us free used, cleaned out plastic buckets with lids

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Great Western Supply in South Tumwater will truck in garden soil and organic compost pretty cheap, or you can haul it yourself

As far as raised beds, just be safe and use Douglas fir for the beds, it lasts almost as long as pressure treated

 

[MuddyWatters]

I use 2x6 and 2x12 cedar for my raised beds. A little more to spend up front but worth it if you are planning on planting the same area more than a couple of years. Stay away from anything treated.

 

[spectra]

I use 2x6 and 2x12 cedar for my raised beds. A little more to spend up front but worth it if you are planning on planting the same area more than a couple of years. Stay away from anything treated.

I have used Cedar 2x6s also and have had a bed made for about 5 years now with no issues. Wood still looks great as the day it was put up. It started life as a sandbox then was turned into a garden about 3 years ago.

 

[MrB+]

Someone said today's PT lumber doesn't contain CCA, but rather some copper compound w/o the arsenic. Anyone confirm that? That it's okay to use for raised beds?

That is a very good question. My little brother is about drop some coins on PT lumber, can someone chime in?

As far as raised beds, just be safe and use Douglas fir for the beds, it lasts almost as long as pressure treated

<Snort> The reason I had the excess TREX lumber was from a deck rebuild project last season. Deck was 15-ish years old, and cedar decking was rotting out so I stripped that off. Joists underneath were inspected. The PT ones were uniformly ready to soldier on, the plain DFir was rotted also and replaced with fresh PT. And those original (CCA) PT boards were left over, yet, from some earlier project. In my experience, in a non-ground contact situation, neither plain DFir nor cedar last anywhere near as long as PT.

Stay away from anything treated.

Following up on my own question, I googled (I think it was) "pressure-treated lumber food-safe" and got great hits. The first two:

Does Pressure-Treated Wood Belong in Your Garden? - Fine Gardening Article
aka Does Pressure-Treated Wood Belong in Your Garden? - Fine Gardening Article

<broken link removed>
aka <broken link removed>

(Funny what vBulletin does with links. The first rep is the original, full link; the second a tiny-url of same.)

The old style PT, CCA, was apparently phased out a while back, replaced by a new chemical ACQ --

"Public concern over potential hazards of CCA has led the industry to look for safer, less controversial preservatives. A few years ago, one of the producers of CCA came out with a preservative touted as environmentally sound. ACQ®, which stands for alkaline copper quat, is a mix of copper and a quaternary ammonium compound, nicknamed quat. Small amounts of copper and quat do leach, but nothing in ACQ is considered hazardous by the EPA, and no ingredient is a known or suspected carcinogen."

The first link is moderate-long and has a ton of useful tidbits, but mostly related to CCA, I think. Using CCA lumber:
- CCA concentrates in tap roots. Leafy vegetables, etc, are okay.
- Most of the arsenic is in the dirt attached to the roots, peel your carrots rather than brushing 'em.
- Beets: the arsenic concentrates in the tail root not the bulb.
- The arsenic mobility in soil is low. Plant flowers around the margins of the raised beds, not edibles. Avoid tilling the bed margins back into the growing areas.
- Most of the leaching occurs in the first season. Weather-age or pressure-wash your PT lumber to get the first big wash of chemicals off it.
- Leaching is a function of pH. Avoid PT lumber in compost bins. The active compost has elevated acid levels (while actively deteriorating) that might draw excess leaching.

MrB+
--
Working my way up to A--

 

[Will_Power]

We grow all of our own potatoes, garlic, beans, carrots and squash, and 50% of the rest of our fresh produce, right in our residential zoned back yard

Stuff to stockpile in dry sealed containers is sugar, white rice, dry beans, popcorn, wheat, barley, hulled oat groats, as well as yeast bricks (Costco) baking powder, dried milk, dried or canned cheese, honey and molasses. Buy a sturdy US made cast iron grain grinder. Don't go cheap on it or you'll regret it

You have any particular grinder suggestions? How much do the acceptable ones run?

 

[OPAWY]

Not sure of what kind of space you have, but I have a small back yard and am considering using old railroad ties and putting in some raised veggy beds.

If those railroad ties have creosote on them, don't use em' for vegetable growing. The creosote will leach into the soil. Its toxic. There are creosote super fund sites all over the western US, from rail road tie companies. Those sites can never be used for anything again, and the water tables have to be monitored for contamination.

 

[OPAWY]

better to use rocks for borders.

 

[Thebastidge]

I put in 4 reasonably large raised beds at my mother's house in 2009-2010. I used concrete gravity blocks. (These are a rough-textured "natural" outer surface, flat top and bottom with a lip on the lower back to hook over the stone below. They are tapered inward on each side to make curves work easily.)

It was a LOT of work, but not too expensive, under $1000 total. They are actually pretty attractive, in a way that I don't think raised beds of lumber (any kinda, treated, untreated, or railroad tie) ever will be, and they will outlast all of that. They were a positive addition to the resale value of the house as well. It took essentially zero skill to do it, and if you searched around instead of getting them from Home Depot, you could probably get a btter deal than I did. I put in sod for the front yard around them. This small yard had never been very attractive before she moved in, it had nasty boxwoods and bark dust, was uneven, and now people regularly stop to chat with her about how nice the yard looks. It is easily the best looking yard on her block now, with the new picket fence along one side, the grass, the raised beds, and the cedar fence along the other side. We need to finish the walkway and re-doing the porch, and it will be really nice.

She grows mostly flowers, but also some rhubarb and tomatoes in there. The same basic concept would work very well for any veggies or small bushes. As she is not as limber as we can all remember being at one point, being able to sit on the edge of the gravity blocks to work the bed is a major bonus, even though technically she's losing a 6-8 space where the gravity blocks are stacked all the way around the bed. The gravity blocks also comprise a thermal mass that seems to be keeping her plants alive earlier in the spring and later into the fall. You do have to watch the edges for drying out during the height of summer.

My total cash investment into the yard at her house was under $1500 and I think it added at least $5k to the value. Once we get the house painted, it will be easily $10k more than we paid, even in a down market.

 

[KalamaMark]

Hey...
I've got some raised bed frames that are in my way that I'd like to get rid of. They are made from cedar fence boards, measure approx 3'x6'x8", and have a wire mesh bottom to keep the moles out. $5 each, u pick up.

 

[chemist]

The arsenic treatment is green in color. If your treated lumber isn't green, it doesn't contain arsenic.

 

[billdeserthills]

I was watching the news this morning and they were talking about this. They said some produce may triple in price. I've been wondering what will happen here in Oregon. I have some dwarf willow trees on my back deck that are already starting to bud. One hard freeze and it sets them back for quite some time.

I guess that Whole Global Warming thing was BS, Quick, somebody call Al Gore

 

[billdeserthills]

I'm sure precious metals & steel will follow suit,
Maybe the $2,000 an ounce nuts weren't so
nutty?

 

[C&H]

Oh but wait...Obama says it's not safe enough to grow your own food.

lol. I call bull. Please provide the quote.

 

[Mattiosmaximos]

We have been stocking up on food/ammo/supplies every payday for 3 months . I even got extra gas and all my camping equipment handled.

 

[mjbskwim]

If those railroad ties have creosote on them, don't use em' for vegetable growing. The creosote will leach into the soil. Its toxic. There are creosote super fund sites all over the western US, from rail road tie companies. Those sites can never be used for anything again, and the water tables have to be monitored for contamination.

So naive you are.

Wycoff's (telephone pole treating) site at the far north end of Terminal 5 (Seattle water front) container port,is now a PARK,yes a park.
He was letting the ground run off run into Elliot Bay.

But as far as using RR ties,if you wrap them or at least put plastic between them and the soil,they are fine.Just keep the kids off of them.

 

[Trlsmn]

Mexico loses 80-100% of crops to freeze, US prices to skyrocket

25# case of tomatoes is now up to $58.00 at the distributor lvl.

Are you ready for this?

jj

I was in the produce business for ten years, these kind of thing are nothing new, every year there is something sky high from some country. You'll see restaurants and drive thru's not giving any tomato and that's about it.

 

[Siglvr]

I was in the produce business for ten years, these kind of thing are nothing new, every year there is something sky high from some country. You'll see restaurants and drive thru's not giving any tomato and that's about it.

Darn it, I'd run out and bought a case of Salsa.

 

[elsullo]

Oh but wait...Obama says it's not safe enough to grow your own food.

What an ignorant comment! I guess you missed all of the news features about the expanded new White House gardens and how the First Lady has been teaching gardening to local school kids and promoting gardening and fresh food nutrition to all American schools. I suppose you are confusedly reacting to the government's proposed increased regulations for safety monitoring of INTERSTATE shipments from large CORPORATE farms. You know, to stop the interstate epidemics of salmonella, listeria, and e-coli that kill hundreds of citizens like we have had often the last couple of years? My guess is that you prefer to read right-wing blogs instead of mainstream news........................elsullo