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Portland Handgun transport on foot

Discussion in 'Firearm Laws & Legal' started by Pdx2seatac, Mar 23, 2016.

  1. Pdx2seatac

    Pdx2seatac 97205 New Member

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    Hey everybody.

    I'm new to Oregon and was wondering if you could help out with a question.

    I'm picking up a new handgun from a license FFL dealer within Portland city limits. I do not have access to a vehicle and will be walking or taking public transportation back to my place.

    The firearm will be unloaded within the new case it comes with. I will not have any ammo on me either. If I throw the case in my backpack with the unloaded new handgun, will I be fine? Also if yes, could you cite part of the ors or code which addresses on foot transport. Everything talks about a locked container in a vehicle.

    For the future I would like to know if I walk or take public transportation to a local range and I do have ammo a separate in my backpack would that be okay.

    Some background, I am currently a resident with an Oregon ID. I am waiting on the county to get back to me about the Chl interview.

    Any advice would be appreciated
    Thanks.
     
  2. Larrytpdx

    Larrytpdx Portland, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Dont have the code(s) but you'll be fine if its in a case in a backpack with no ammo anywhere. Just like if you were riding a bicycle transporting it. It just cant be readily accessible. Probably wouldn't hurt to put a small lock on the case.
     
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  3. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Multnomah County passed a new (anti) gun law back in April 2013. Part of the law states it is illegal to possess a loaded gun in public places, as well as to discharge a gun in public places. There are exceptions to the law, thanks to the state preemption rule that allows CHL holders to be exempt from this law in Multnomah county - so long as you have a CHL and you have it on you. Part of their law states that if you have a CHL, but don't have it on you, you are still guilty of violating the law. Note there are also provisions, if you live in Multnomah County, that require you take steps to keep the gun out of the hands of children and you are required by law to report it stolen, if it's stolen - you can be punished if you fail to do so.

    So yes, you should be safe getting it home - I would be certain you don't have any ammo on you while you transport it. I don't see that the law requires it to be in a locked case, but if you can lock it, you may as well, just to give yourself an extra measure of protection.

    Unfortunately, you really need a CHL in Oregon to be free of the massive over-reach of the gun-hating legislators around the state. Get that in hand as soon as you can and your life will be much easier.

    Here is a link to an FAQ on the Multnomah County law: https://multco.us/file/9312/download
     
  4. Pdx2seatac

    Pdx2seatac 97205 New Member

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    Thanks a lot for your replies.

    I guessed after reading over the ORS that as long as I don't have any ammo I should be fine. Especially considering it cannot be considered a loaded gun.

    I also have one of those masterlocks for the slide that I'll put on the case. So it won't be readily accessible I guess. But I'm concerned about moving forward.

    Multnomah County is taking their time getting back to me on the CHL. And I want to take either bus, max, ctran, bike or walk to a range. But would like to bring ammo as well. I do drive here and there but don't want to play around in grey areas. Weird how there's not more clarification on the law for law abiding pedestrians. Any more thoughts?
     
  5. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    By the letter of the law, it says you can't have a loaded gun in a public place. But it does not say you can't have ammo on you. Honestly, just keep them separate from each other. If you have them in a backpack, unless you're stopped for some reason, no one is going to know. Just go about your business like normal and don't do anything that would cause the police to stop you in the first place. Just know even if the did, you're not doing anything wrong. Maybe print a copy of the actual law and keep it with you - so you can show them you know what you're doing.

    I carry loaded in Portland every work day and don't ever give it a second thought. No one is going to stop and search you for that unloaded gun unless you give them a reason.
     
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  6. bolus

    bolus Portland Gold Supporter Gold Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    not weird at all. Politicians with lack of useful knowledge making laws about stuff they dont know well and then implemented by bureaucracy and enforced by police where knowledge of the laws does not seem to be a requirement. after having several conversations with the ATF and the firearm division of the Oregon state police, I bet if you called and asked them directly they would not know or not give you the correct answer. Its like you have to have an attorney who specializes in firearm laws on retainer just to walk about town with an unloaded firearm.

    why not hire a Uber car? I would personally rather avoid public transportation in Portland and not be carrying a loaded firearm. Especially when carrying something valuable.
     
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  7. Velzey

    Velzey Estacada, Oregon Gunsmith Gunsmith Bronze Vendor Bronze Supporter

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    Put it in its case, unloaded of course. Put case in backpack. Put ammo in backpack, or in your coat and go on your way! The pistol is not going to load itself while its alone in the backpack, with the ammo...
    No laws will be broken!
     
  8. Pdx2seatac

    Pdx2seatac 97205 New Member

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    Ye
    I will probably just call an Uber. Sad that I NEED to do that.

    Two locks on case, unloaded with no ammo and we're still not clear on this. Ha. I'll have my receipt, 4473 and ORS on me. I'll carry my pocket constitution too.

    Thanks for the help!
     
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  9. Ben Beckerich

    Ben Beckerich NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Concealed means concealed.
     
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  10. Larrytpdx

    Larrytpdx Portland, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    You can always buy the ammo at the range.
     
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  11. Velzey

    Velzey Estacada, Oregon Gunsmith Gunsmith Bronze Vendor Bronze Supporter

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    No it's pretty clear. Nothing illegal about carrying an unloaded handgun in a case in a backpack!
     
  12. bolus

    bolus Portland Gold Supporter Gold Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    I was quite nervous driving to my first firearm class with my first handgun. It was the class I needed for the CHL (it included range time) so I spent forever trying to understand what the firearm laws said to get my gun to the range without breaking a law. I had a car at the time that did not have a trunk (mini cooper) which is where I was supposed to transport it, unloaded or open carry. So I left it visible on the back seat with the factory lock on it that goes through the action all because I was afraid I would go to jail for exercising a constitutional right.

    now I have my CHL, concealed is concealed, the only words to the police will be "I am enacting my right to remain silent and will follow any lawful orders" and if necessary "I was in fear for my life" and have 2 firearm attorney numbers in my wallet.

    freakin annoying.
     
  13. Nick Burkhardt

    Nick Burkhardt NE Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Multnomah is pretty stupid. If you don't have a CHL, you cannot have ammo loaded in a magazine or speedloader while in public.
     
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  14. Dreams of Steel

    Dreams of Steel Sherwood Gold Supporter Gold Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    I commend @Pdx2seatac for being a responsible gun purchaser / owner! It's good to see these kinds of questions come up...I had never thought about how to move a gun on the public transit without carrying concealed.
     
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  15. v0lcom13sn0w

    v0lcom13sn0w Keizer, or Well-Known Member

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    from what everyone is trying to say...what it boils down to is just do what you want and dont worry about it and/or get your CHL and dont worry about it.

    you'll be fine.
     
  16. Dyjital

    Dyjital Albany, Ore Flavorite Member Bronze Supporter

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    While I live somewhere not as nazi as you, I happily carried a firearm- box and all- down the road the mile to my house in broad daylight.

    Just keep it in whatever case it comes with and unloaded.
     
  17. Koda

    Koda Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    note the federal "Gun Free" school zone act prohibits being within any school zone unless the gun is in a locked container. Same applies to the ammo, which must be locked in a separate container.

    The GFSZ act does not apply to persons with a state issued CHL on their person.
     
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  18. Koda

    Koda Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    Personally, to avoid any hassle I would not carry it "on your person" but in a case in your backpack or other off body method until you get your CHL. I don’t see any law prohibiting transporting a firearm on foot or public transportation so they cant charge you for a law that doesn’t exist. If any issue comes up you could invoke that walking to a gun range for target practice is a lawful purpose (see ORS 166.250(2)(b)) . I wouldn’t stop at the store on the way though...



    Another note, Nick Burkhardt already mentioned above is correct. Do no pre-load any speed loaders or magazines or cylinders, in Mult. Co. that is illegal without a CHL. here is the law for that: http://multnomah.granicus.com/MetaViewer.php?meta_id=38224&view=&showpdf=1
    scroll down to 15.064
     
  19. nwwoodsman

    nwwoodsman Vernonia Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter 2015 Volunteer

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    I live 2 blocks away from a gun range. I walk through a city park and by a playground with a rifle over my shoulder to access the range and noone bats an eye. My recommendation is to move.
     
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  20. ocarolan

    ocarolan Portland, Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Have you read the law? First, the "readily accessible" language in 166.250 1(b) and 4(a) only applies to carry in a motor vehicle. Not personal carry.

    Next, ORS 166.250(a) prohibits "carrying any firearm concealed upon the person". No exemption for unloaded firearms or backpacks.

    In fact, twice the court has affirmed that "upon the person" includes a bag and its contents. See State v. Anfield 1992, State v. Finlay 2002.

    Furthermore, in the last case, the court found that "Accessibility of firearm carried in bag, briefcase or suitcase is irrelevant to determination that firearm was carried concealed upon the person."

    To legally carry a firearm in a backpack, you must have a CHL, or meet the other exceptions.

    You may ask, what about a locked or disassembled handgun? I would recommend reading Goltz and Gortmaker first.

    Those rulings concluded a rifle lacking a bolt was "readily capable of use as a weapon," despite the fact that the defendant did not have the bolt. The second established a disassembled 9mm handgun also qualified.

    At first blush, those cases suggest concealing a disassembled gun would be illegal.

    However, in 2008 the Briney decision tempered those. That judge indicates the concealed firearm needs to be essentially operational using materials at hand.

    Given what we believe to be the legislative policy underlying the enactment of the concealed weapons statutes in Oregon, we think that, in order for a firearm to be "readily capable of use as a weapon" for the purposes of ORS 166.250(1)(a), the legislature intended that the firearm either be operational or promptly able to be made so at the time that an individual is alleged to be unlawfully carrying it concealed.(7)

    Please interpret this carefully in the extreme context of State v Briney 2008 however. Transporting the incomplete firearm parts in multiple trips (like Briney) would not qualify. Merely separating the slide or locking the trigger may still qualify as "can be promptly made operational" however.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2016
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