Planning for societal collapse. Guns or gold?

[unionguy]

It depends. If we're talking "near total SHTF", I agree...gold will be a complete waste. However, if we end up in a long spiralling downward but the economy is still functioning (somewhat) normally...then gold will have value. I'd check out FerFAL who writes from Argentina's experience in the collapse (but not total) of their economy. Lots of useful information there. His basic experience is things just get a lot worse--but not total Mad Max. (He convinced me of the need to get a bulletproof vest that's concealable, for example.)

That all said, I have firearms and a few goods...but no gold. Gold is simply too expensive to try and buy now anyway...IMHO.

 

[Blackfeather7]

It depends. If we're talking "near total SHTF", I agree...gold will be a complete waste. However, if we end up in a long spiralling downward but the economy is still functioning (somewhat) normally...then gold will have value. I'd check out FerFAL who writes from Argentina's experience in the collapse (but not total) of their economy. Lots of useful information there. His basic experience is things just get a lot worse--but not total Mad Max. (He convinced me of the need to get a bulletproof vest that's concealable, for example.)

That all said, I have firearms and a few goods...but no gold. Gold is simply too expensive to try and buy now anyway...IMHO.

I agree about gold, but silver is the bargain of a lifetime. You can buy as little as $50 worth a time at www.apmex.com The shipping is $12.95 for orders up to $249.99 so you save on shipping if you buy that much. And no, I don't have stock in APMEX. I wish I did. I keep mentioning them because they are by far the best place to buy from and sell to if you need to. Silver went up another .35 in the last two hours. Of course it is a roller coaster and will have dips, but the peaks have been getting higher for the past nine years or so. Hang on, it's going to be quite a ride. Check out this chart:
http://www.kitco.com/scripts/hist_charts/yearly_graphs.plx

I'd sew some Silver Eagles into that bullet proof vest. They aren't bullet proof but they are inflation proof.

 

[unionguy]

Silver is a "bargain of a lifetime"? It was under $5 an ounce in 2002...now its going above $18 an ounce?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_as_an_investment

 

[Randini]

Hmm maybe buy some dirt cheap cheapest of the cheap bulletproof vests and barter them when the SHTF, after all there will be a lot of unprepped people out there.
+1 on the Ibuprofen, Alcohol (it's not just for drinking)

 

[Blackfeather7]

Silver is a "bargain of a lifetime"? It was under $5 an ounce in 2002...now its going above $18 an ounce?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silver_as_an_investment

You're right, I knew that. That's when I started buying. I should have said, "Silver is probably the best investment you could make today for the rest of your lifetime."

However this makes my point. Do you know anything else that has gone up by nearly 400% in seven years?

 

[Gunner3456]

You just made me think of something - Medicine. Penicillin, aspirin, any medications you normally cruise on down to pharmacy to pick up...

(I think it was your pepto bismal )

For any of you who didn't grow up on a farm, you can buy penicillin and other antibiotics at your local farm supply without a prescription. Our Grange Co-Op has a refrigerator full of it. You can also buy syringes. It's perfectly legal to doctor your farm animals yourself.

My wife is an RN/MSN and knows how to use that stuff. I suggest that everyone take a look at what they have. Medical help would be great for barter (who will care about the laws of practicing medicine?) and could save your life. If you have the supplies, there will always be someone around who knows how to use it, and how much to use based on animal weight, even if he learned it on a farm.

You can learn and print the information right now from the net.

You can also buy almost any prescription drug you want from India. It's cheap too. More than 1/2 of all of our drugs are made in India now. There are people making a big living selling on the net and without prescription. They don't have the same prescription rules in India. They don't in Mexico either. You can walk into a pharmacy in Mexico and buy anything you want except "mood altering" drugs in any pharmacy in Mexico or India.

A quick google search and a look at what's offered will shock you what you can order from India and how cheap it is. You can pay with your Visa and they'll mail to you.

It's the real stuff too - same as you'd get at your pharmacy.

$.02

 

[Gunner3456]

Oh, I forgot the OP, sorry.

I can't see gold being real useful in a complete meltdown except as something to bury for later. Maybe I'm wrong. Silver yes because of the smaller denomination.

I'd rather have ammo and reloading consumables. Just look at how quickly we have been able to sell or trade that stuff off just in this past year. Personally, I think .22lr is king, with some others also very good. I'm picking up a few cheap .22 rifles and ammo as I go.

$.02

 

[Just Jim]

While your thinking Historicly in the last depression the government called in all the gold and gave $25 an ounce for it then sold it for $35. Nobody was allowed to own gold.

Now that we have out of control government that spends to no end and throws you into prison for not buying their healthcare, what makes you think they will allow you to keep your gold? All they got to do is call it in and give you dollars for it. Make it hard prison time to own it.

Takes your financial power right out of your hands

jj

 

[dave]

Gunner, I just googled prescription online oredering. Wow, I had no idea.
Great info.
Thanks

 

[Blackfeather7]

While your thinking Historicly in the last depression the government called in all the gold and gave $25 an ounce for it then sold it for $35. Nobody was allowed to own gold.

Now that we have out of control government that spends to no end and throws you into prison for not buying their healthcare, what makes you think they will allow you to keep your gold? All they got to do is call it in and give you dollars for it. Make it hard prison time to own it.

Takes your financial power right out of your hands

jj

People didn't exactly line up to turn in their gold and I don't think many went to jail. They can make it hard prison time to own guns too. What'cha gonna do? Let 'em? I don't think so.

 

[dr*pop]

For me - Ammo hands down. What can you buy with a $2000 gold coin vs a box of bullets?

 

[Gunner3456]

Gunner, I just googled prescription online oredering. Wow, I had no idea.
Great info.
Thanks

Welcome. So, how much Viagra did you order for $1 per pill?

 

[el gringo loco]

You can also buy almost any prescription drug you want from India. It's cheap too. More than 1/2 of all of our drugs are made in India now. There are people making a big living selling on the net and without prescription. They don't have the same prescription rules in India. They don't in Mexico either. You can walk into a pharmacy in Mexico and buy anything you want except "mood altering" drugs in any pharmacy in Mexico or India.

A quick google search and a look at what's offered will shock you what you can order from India and how cheap it is. You can pay with your Visa and they'll mail to you.

It's the real stuff too - same as you'd get at your pharmacy.

Be careful. Regardless of where you order it from, it is still illegal to possess a lot of drugs without a prescription. Animal grade pharmaceuticals are different and I don't profess to know those rules. But, just because someone in India will ship you Viagra doesn't make it legal. You can buy ecstasy and psilocybin online too.

 

[Gunner3456]

Be careful. Regardless of where you order it from, it is still illegal to possess a lot of drugs without a prescription. Animal grade pharmaceuticals are different and I don't profess to know those rules. But, just because someone in India will ship you Viagra doesn't make it legal. You can buy ecstasy and psilocybin online too.

Oh. Otay.

 

[Blackfeather7]

But don't just take my word for it: http://www.marketwatch.com/story/poor-mans-gold-may-be-an-investors-treasure-2009-11-13

 

[wawaverider]

Don't put all of your eggs in one basket. Reading Ferfal's blog. I think he makes this point.

 

[bugeye]

I'm collecting pornography with the internet down there is going to be a huge demand!

What we can't say ****ography, on the net how ironic!

 

[markw76]

Water, food , guns, ammo, "junk" silver.

Or means of securing same. Developing a clean reliable water source, putting back food reserves, a few firearms and ammunition are all good. IMO the value of silver and gold depend too much on the recipient's knowledge of what they are worth. Bartering with ammo? Maybe a few .22 but little more and only if you trust your trading partner. I don't intend on giving a potential opponent the means to keep my head down. Better might be some lead and tin, maybe some pre-alloyed bullet metal. Lyman #2 or Linotype metal, with some lead to mix for pistol bullets or for muzzle stuffers, even if I'm not currently casting my own. Powder and ball/bullets (and primers/caps) in any case. Clothing repair tools. Kerosene lamp parts. Hand operated tools. The list goes on, but gold? Nah. Way too much other stuff needs getting.

 

[BlvdKing]

I can think of at least 100 things I would rather have than gold in a SHTF scenario

 

[PeakResources]

I see some good posts above about balancing the stockpiling efforts. At least people are debating what to stockpile rather than whether to do it at all.

When asked whether guns or gold/silver (money metals), I reply "both".

The first place to start is with how you envision you & your family will ride out any downturn, and if/how things will recover. I don't know if a SHTF scenario will happen fast (like suddenly no banks/money), or slower (like a continued increasing in unemployment and inflation that turns to hyperinflation). I suspect either are possible. Plus, there are a bunch of natural disasters that could happen. I expect that for natural disaster, we only need to ride out a couple months. For an economic disaster, we need to ride out a much longer term. However, in both cases, I fully expect life will resume a balance and commerce will happen again. Eventually.

Where does that leave me? I believe personal protection, water, food, and shelter are very important. But I also believe that commerce will resume at some point. Further, I believe that having money that's value is based upon faith that the Fed won't print unlimited supplies of it leaves me open to risk. As a result, I do like the idea of having some money metals. Also, I realize that I only need so much ammo before the marginal value of getting some is less than the value of diversifying into money metals.

As a result, I would recommend having both. Get the amount of ammo and other supplies (I have a "Big Berkey" and a bunch of smaller & similar filters for water filtration) for immediate needs. But also think about accumulating some silver. If you start getting a fair stockpile of both of the above, then perhaps you should start thinking about gold.