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Pine Eagle Charter School Shooting Drill Terrifies Teachers

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by BDA.45, May 1, 2013.

  1. BDA.45

    BDA.45 oregon Well-Known Member 2016 Volunteer

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  2. dmancornell

    dmancornell Portland, OR New Member

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    The idiocy of government "employees" knows no bounds.
     
    Alfonse and (deleted member) like this.
  3. 206thsense

    206thsense Seattle, WA, USA Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I have staff meeting this Friday. We're supposed to have a "special" guest speaker. I'll be the first to duck if he/she starts spraying the room with (rubber) bullets. HA!
     
  4. salmonriverjohn

    salmonriverjohn N.W Oregon coast, Gods country Well-Known Member

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    And if as a CC teacher I pulled and returned fire, killing one of the "actor/instructors" would I then be charged? This was an asinine attempt at best and the results could have been fatal.
     
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  5. 206thsense

    206thsense Seattle, WA, USA Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I had the same thought.

    Real security does not equal "surprise drills" where employees get hosed down with rubber bullets / airsoft pellets. They're lucky nobody got seriously hurt.
     
  6. robertg

    robertg Sandy Oregon Silver Supporter Silver Supporter 2016 Volunteer

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    Unbelievably stupid. So, they wanted to find out what the teachers reaction would be, well wtf did they expect?
     
  7. chrisk86

    chrisk86 Spokane Member

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    Running a drill is one thing but forcing the teachers into a room to be shot like fish in a barrel is another... I would be surprised bubblegumless if any of the teachers or faculty staff learned a thing from this "drill"
     
  8. rumblebee1967

    rumblebee1967 Bellingham Active Member

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    Why do we expect emergency personal and police to train under real life drills and not our teachers. Fire fighters should practice with fake fires I guess. Sounds like sour grapes to me the teachers performed subpar so blame the drill.
     
  9. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    It's not really a question of real life drills, when police and fire practice drills, they know that they are participating in a drill. The faculty were not told that they were going to be taking part in a "drill". Federal and State law allow for CHL holders to carry on school grounds, however, most teaching unions forbid this. It then comes down to the question of safety, will you voluntarily disarm as a term of your employment?

    This being said, the drill was a terrible idea...
    What if some old teacher were to have a heart attack?
    What if a teacher was carrying despite their union contract?
    What if the teachers fought back?

    They are very lucky that nobody was hurt, this was poorly planned on virtually every level.
     
  10. rumblebee1967

    rumblebee1967 Bellingham Active Member

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    what if life were real? Everything has its what ifs. Read the part about 2 teachers would have survived. Bet if they ran the exact same drill more would survive.


     
  11. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    There's one positive thing that came from this, they are considering allowing armed carry by the teachers. When you make "gun free zones" you make everyone a potential target, as the criminal that is going to ignore the law will know that the best fight that the targets will be able to put up will be mediocre at best. I'm glad that they are now open to other ideas, as the drill opened their eyes to the sitting target that they have made of themselves.

    In life there are an infinite number of "what if's" However, this drill has a very high percentage of injuring someone that wasn't privy to the fact that it was a drill, and not an active shooter situation. If a gunman walks into a room full of unarmed individuals, the likelihood of survival is very small. I highly doubt that the survival rate would increase at all if the same drill were to be run on the same individuals.
     
  12. rumblebee1967

    rumblebee1967 Bellingham Active Member

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    Does not sound like a high percentage of injuries happened. From experience a planned emergency drill has many many benefits and some exposure but not tremendous risk of injury as is demonstrated by this incident. Unless of course you count hurt feelings as injuries. And if teachers were not able to learn from this experience than its not the fault of the drill. Ok I am done. not going to change you mind so no sense in more conversation.
     
  13. ak56

    ak56 Carnation, Wa Active Member

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    If these were indeed real firearms, even though loaded with blanks, the 'shooters' could be charged with a gross misdemeaner if they tried this in Washington state.

     
  14. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    One last point, when you run a drill, there's a reasonable expectation that life will not be at risk. Putting the possibility of a heart attack aside, the possibility of a faculty member carrying a gun is a real possibility. Also, if I believed that my life were at risk, and I wasn't carrying (doesn't happen), then chairs would definitely have been flying. The purpose of a drill, is to incite a reaction, in an active shooter situation, the possible reactions can turn deadly, even in a drill. The faculty didn't know that their life was not actually in danger, but had they reacted with deadly force, be it scissors, flying objects, knives that they might happen to have on their person, the situation could have turned deadly, and the odds of this outweigh the benefits.

    In this case, do the ends justify the means? Because nobody was injured, does this make it right? If you were one of those teachers, would you have chucked a chair?
     
  15. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    We're in Oregon, but...
    166.190 Pointing firearm at another; courts having jurisdiction over offense. Any person over the age of 12 years who, with or without malice, purposely points or aims any loaded or empty pistol, gun, revolver or other firearm, at or toward any other person within range of the firearm, except in self-defense, shall be fined upon conviction in any sum not less than $10 nor more than $500, or be imprisoned in the county jail not less than 10 days nor more than six months, or both. Justice courts have jurisdiction concurrent with the circuit court of the trial of violations of this section. When any person is charged before a justice court with violation of this section, the court shall, upon motion of the district attorney, at any time before trial, act as a committing magistrate, and if probable cause be established, hold such person to the grand jury. [Formerly 163.320]
     
  16. Ralgha

    Ralgha Portland Well-Known Member 2016 Volunteer

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    The teachers didn't know it was a drill and it was only luck that none of them reacted with force. If one of them had a gun, we'd probably have dead "shooters." I'm a bit surprised that none of them at least stuck a pocket knife in one of the "shooters."

    Sent from LV-426.
     
  17. jcw

    jcw Washington Member

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    The lawyers are going to love this one.
     
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  18. 1BigGuy

    1BigGuy Eastern Washington New Member

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    I too, had a faculty meeting today (teacher in service = no classes) and I considered what I would do if such a stoopid "drill" were to happen. I expect that there would be severe consequences. . .
     
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  19. Darknight

    Darknight Salem Active Member

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    It's the same here in Oregon.

    § 166.190¹

    Pointing firearm at another
    • courts having jurisdiction over offense

    Any person over the age of 12 years who, with or without malice, purposely points or aims any loaded or empty pistol, gun, revolver or other firearm, at or toward any other person within range of the firearm, except in self-defense, shall be fined upon conviction in any sum not less than $10 nor more than $500, or be imprisoned in the county jail not less than 10 days nor more than six months, or both. Justice courts have jurisdiction concurrent with the circuit court of the trial of violations of this section. When any person is charged before a justice court with violation of this section, the court shall, upon motion of the district attorney, at any time before trial, act as a committing magistrate, and if probable cause be established, hold such person to the grand jury.
     
  20. Rotty

    Rotty Skagit County Active Member

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    The key phrase is "Planned Drill". Like a Fire Drill, staff and students know it's going to happen so they can objectively think about what they are going to do and where they are going to go. Afterwords they can/will critique their performance. That's called training.

    When you pull off a "Drill" like a "Pop Quiz" you are setting the stage for panic and people responding in a confused mix mash of ways. That's called Stupid.

    This "Pop Quiz" drill was the dumbest stunt I have heard of being done in a school by the adults. It's one thing when the kids do something stupid but totally different when their role models do something stupid.

    What's that teaching the kids? That Stupid is ok?