People with Gold/Silver

[Riot]

+1.

Jim Sinclair's Commentary today:
"The USDX is going to take out .7200 and lock below. Gold will leave $1650 in the dust. History will be written this year."

I'm still at a loss here guys...do any of you plan on cashing out your Gold/Silver or do you stock up in preperation of the dollar collapsing?

 

[Dell_dude]

I'm not cashing out.

I just want some form of backup funds on hand in case the SHTF.

What if the person who has something you need won't trade for food or ammo or something else you have on hand?

What if the person who has something you need seems somewhat shady and you're not comfortable trading them guns or ammo?

 

[Grunwald]

So you actually think that once you trade silver for cash in a stock market crash the money in your hand will be worth something? For SHTF purpose the only way Gold/Silver would benifit you is if (or when) a new currency is created once the grid comes back up. THEN you will be sitting large on your investment.

Thoughout history people have used some form of medium as an exchange. For thousands of years there were only coins. These coins were.....
Ah forget it. You're not really looking for information so why bother.

 

[EZLivin]

I'm still at a loss here guys...do any of you plan on cashing out your Gold/Silver or do you stock up in preperation of the dollar collapsing?

My answer might be a bit different than some here because my holdings are in CEF and Sprott physical metal funds. I hold those funds instead of holding $US money-market funds or savings accounts. If I need $US cash for something I sell a few shares and pay the taxes on the gains. I will continue to hold those metals funds until a point where I see the long-term trend ending, and the start of a long-term decline in value in relation to other currencies. Honestly though, I'm not sure we will see a decline this time like we did in the 70s. The modern era of purely fiat currencies may be quickly coming to an end, and possibly replaced by a new currency(s) that has a gold component (but not convertibility).

 

[Scott]

I would not buy gold now as it has reached it's limit or almost topped out and when it drops again your going to be screwed. To be honest I don't think gold will ever go this high again. Ask the guys who are buying Saiga's for a grand or more and when the ban does not go through they will drop back to a few hundred and it will be a bad investment unless you already had 4 at a few hundred each and sell them to some sucker for a grand then you make out.

 

[caden08]

I see gold prices going higher! I don't know why you wouldn't! With the way the dollar is falling in value and talk about the USA defaulting on credit, countries moving away from the US currency into a more world currency. Not only will it rise more but would suspect if we have hyper inflation within the next few mon-yrs then not having gold or silver could be the worst decision you ever should have made.

I see gold hitting 2k/oz by the end of the year. And if you follow silver threw the decades it's approx traded 1/16th. Putting it around 80-85. Making that initial 10-15 an oz for silver we were getting called crazy over even sweeter.

But I'm more doom and gloom about our economy each day. I hope for the best but uhhhhh we won't recover for Many years....

 

[Grunwald]

I would not buy gold now as it has reached it's limit or almost topped out and when it drops again your going to be screwed. To be honest I don't think gold will ever go this high again. Ask the guys who are buying Saiga's for a grand or more and when the ban does not go through they will drop back to a few hundred and it will be a bad investment unless you already had 4 at a few hundred each and sell them to some sucker for a grand then you make out.

I think you are wrong. The comparison to Saiga is not valid. The price of the Saiga is mostly due to the threat of government stopping their importation. The reason that gold is going up is due to the government's debt load and the inflation that it is causing and will cause.
The government might not ban Saigas. Does anyone even entertain the idea that the government will not continue deficit spending?

I actually do not know what the true fair value of gold is. I do not ascribe to those that point out that it peaked at $800 in the 1980s, so today in inflation adjusted terms that peak would be $2500 (or whatever).
I would much rather use my own price index and use that to determine how much gold should be worth. One would need to find something to price back in some point in time (1910 sounds good) and then today. The item(s) should not be affected too much by outsourcing to cheap labor countries or the production going from manual to fully automated. So, how much did it cost to buy a congressman back in 1910? How much does it take today?

 

[nubus]

So, how much did it cost to buy a congressman back in 1910? How much does it take today?

This quote is priceless! Thank you Grunwald!

I agree with your point as well, what is happening stateside and globally right now is only pushing PMs higher. THERE IS NO PRECEDENT FOR WHAT WE ARE SEEING. So many people want to point to previous run-ups and declines in the value of PMs. Never has there been a bull run of this magnitude across such a steady trend in PM value history. The silver "bubble" of 1980 was just that, what we have now is a continually steepening slope across 18 months of run-up, not a bubble at all. Some people are saying there will surely be a large correction, I believe the increasing value IS the correction. Silver especially has been undervalued for many years. Even with gold at record new highs the silver to gold ratio is dropping by the day. A weakening dollar and a world full of unrest and disaster only spells double digit increases for PMs in the near future.

 

[Grunwald]

Nubus, all joking aside, I do not trust the inflation figures from the government or really any other entity at the moment. Does not mean that there is not one out there that I would trust, it just means I have not looked at one and analyzed their methodology. I actually thought of a pretty simple one today - the cost of full page advertisement in the NY Times. It would be interesting to see what that cost has been during the last 100 years.
People do point to the historical ratio of somewhere between 15 to 1 and 20 to 1 of silver vs gold, and extrapolate the price of silver from that based on the price of gold. Again, too simplistic because it assumes that the current price of gold is correct. What if gold should be at $700? Just the same what if it really should be at $3,500??
All I know is that the Federal Reserve is printing money so that the economy does not go down the tubes, and the government is borrowing by selling bonds, but there is not enough interest in these bonds so that the Federal Reserve is buying some of these bonds. In a nutshell - the federal reserve is printing money to loan it to the federal government. This cannot end well.

To quote someone I respect - People believe that the Fed and the government know how to get us out of this recession. Really, then why didn't the use this knowledge to keep us out of the recession to begin with??

 

[Siglvr]

Trying to get an understanding here, guys...not meaning to insult or bash anyone's plans, just have a few questions about why you are stocking up on Gold/Silver.

1) Are you stocking up on Gold/Silver at your residence?

To me, I think this tactic is foolhardy. ......................... It's just my 2 cents.......

You immediately insult right after saying you won't. Why even bother answering your question as you have made up your mind (and issued a summary judgement of YOUR opinion). As have I (made up my mind). You make your play - stay 100% in dollars, I'll make mine.

do any of you plan on cashing out your Gold/Silver or do you stock up in preparation of the dollar collapsing?

The dollar is crashing now. This very day, slowly declining in value and it will continue this trend. It's a process. You don't wake up one day with a worthless currency, it happens much slower, like boiling frogs. Look at almost every price in this country except house prices. That's what a decline in $ is. Go to any other country that has a strong currency and everything is outrageously expensive. Their currency are holding up. Look at Australia dollar for instance, my brother just got back a week ago. We're all mushrooms and will only know after the fact. How can one time an exit for that? It's difficult, but you can certainly see what is happening right this very moment.

As far as your co-worker who invested everything into gold goes, too fool hardy. Most of us have everything you mention already covered. (food guns etc etc). So then what?

My 2 cents. Good luck.

 

[Sasquatchvnv]

Nubus, all joking aside, I do not trust the inflation figures from the government or really any other entity at the moment. Does not mean that there is not one out there that I would trust, it just means I have not looked at one and analyzed their methodology. I actually thought of a pretty simple one today - the cost of full page advertisement in the NY Times. It would be interesting to see what that cost has been during the last 100 years.
People do point to the historical ratio of somewhere between 15 to 1 and 20 to 1 of silver vs gold, and extrapolate the price of silver from that based on the price of gold. Again, too simplistic because it assumes that the current price of gold is correct. What if gold should be at $700? Just the same what if it really should be at $3,500??
All I know is that the Federal Reserve is printing money so that the economy does not go down the tubes, and the government is borrowing by selling bonds, but there is not enough interest in these bonds so that the Federal Reserve is buying some of these bonds. In a nutshell - the federal reserve is printing money to loan it to the federal government. This cannot end well.

To quote someone I respect - People believe that the Fed and the government know how to get us out of this recession. Really, then why didn't the use this knowledge to keep us out of the recession to begin with??

The short answer is that they actually DO know how to put things right. The bad news is, that is not their objective. The system will crash, and they will be there to pose as saviours while robbing us blind - they know EXACTLY what they are doing, it is the same script they've used hundreds of times already - it's just our turn now.

 

[Riot]

You immediately insult right after saying you won't. Why even bother answering your question as you have made up your mind (and issued a summary judgement of YOUR opinion). As have I (made up my mind). You make your play - stay 100% in dollars, I'll make mine.


The dollar is crashing now. This very day, slowly declining in value and it will continue this trend. It's a process. You don't wake up one day with a worthless currency, it happens much slower, like boiling frogs. Look at almost every price in this country except house prices. That's what a decline in $ is. Go to any other country that has a strong currency and everything is outrageously expensive. Their currency are holding up. Look at Australia dollar for instance, my brother just got back a week ago. We're all mushrooms and will only know after the fact. How can one time an exit for that? It's difficult, but you can certainly see what is happening right this very moment.

As far as your co-worker who invested everything into gold goes, too fool hardy. Most of us have everything you mention already covered. (food guns etc etc). So then what?

My 2 cents. Good luck.

Invest in all the gold you want, I'm starting to get into the phase where I wish I kept the silver I had and had something tangible. But now looking back, would you rather be the guy in the woods wishing you bought more Gold/Silver with all the gear or the guy with all the Gold/Silver wishing you had more gear?

I realize that some of you don't ever plan on leaving your residence, but you do see the trend our economy is going towards. If you live in town and you know the trucks have stopped brining in supplies, how much longer do you think it will be until starving people go door-to-door?

Thoughout history people have used some form of medium as an exchange. For thousands of years there were only coins. These coins were.....
Ah forget it. You're not really looking for information so why bother.

You guys think I'm being closed minded for wondering why you are buying coins before food to trade before SHTF and I'm wondering why you guys just won't plan out a more long-term solution.

 

[Siglvr]

You guys think I'm being closed minded for wondering why you are buying coins before food to trade before SHTF and I'm wondering why you guys just won't plan out a more long-term solution.

You seem to think you know everyone on this thread and exactly what they are doing. Furthermore, you then tell us that they/we are doing it wrong. Can you point to someone here who has bought coins before food? What long term solution are you proposing to those that you KNOW are not doing the right thing? Whom do you say is doing this? I guess I'm a little confused on your posting as if you know every one here. Do I know you ? Are you suggesting that I do not have enough food stockpiled? I'd bet dimes to donuts that Sasquatch up there has a crapload of stuff squirreled away, and I've never met him. Do you know how much I have stocked? How much more would you advise me to stock? Are you talking about Grunwald up there? I'd bet he has more bases covered than you do, and I don't recall ever meeting you. Never met him either.

As far as "SHTF", I don't buy the traditional description wherein we all seem to wake up one day and folks are running through the streets going crazy killing and robbing each other for scraps and morsels. The only thing I see which could cause that kind of immediate action would be an attack on our homeland. In those instances, we tend to pull together.

BTW, todays news: Warren Buffet basically repeats what I said up thread. It's a pretty good read. The dollar, less almighty: Big investors see possible long-term currency weakness - The Washington Post

""I would recommend against buying long-term fixed-dollar investments," Buffett said at a public appearance in New Delhi. "If you ask me if the U.S. dollar is going to hold its purchasing power fully at the level of 2011 five years, 10 years or 20 years from now, I would tell you it will not." "

take care all!

 

[EZLivin]

As far as "SHTF", I don't buy the traditional description wherein we all seem to wake up one day and folks are running through the streets going crazy killing and robbing each other for scraps and morsels.

Only in Hollywood (movies that is).

From what I understand about hyperinflation, when it occurs it can happen quickly. The result is probable supply chain disruptions (possibly for months). That doesn't mean the shelves are bare and stay bare for months. It means re-supply is sporadic. Will there be riots? Sure, in certain parts of cities that traditionally riot whenever they are pissed off at something, and on college campuses (as usual).

What we can count on in a situation like the above: Population centers re-supplied first. Commerce continues. Crime increases. Emphasis on the protection of infrastructure and population in more affluent areas of cities. The usual trouble areas of cities will go crazy, and the news whor-es will be there to film it and blow it out of perspective. Politicians will constantly be on TV and radio blaming the situation on others. Taxes will increase, and increase, and increase. The US will escalate whatever conflict it is involved in, or will start another war (to take people's minds off the situation at home).

Longer term: Agricultural production and manufacturing will become local again. Cost of living escalates due to significant increases in energy costs . Living standards in US will decrease (McMansions disappear, 6yr olds won't have their own cell phones, and people might even learn to garden and cook again). Alternative energy and new fuels will be developed eventually. The world does not end (unless WWIII ends it), Americans will be poorer, and everyone who panicked and ran to the hills will return when they get hungry, run out of decent booze, or need dental care.

 

[Grunwald]

........ Buffett said at a public appearance in New Delhi. "If you ask me if the U.S. dollar is going to hold its purchasing power fully at the level of 2011 five years, 10 years or 20 years from now, I would tell you it will not." "
......

The sad truth is that that comment by Buffett is almost always true. It was true in 20 years ago, 30 years ago and so on and so forth.
With a fiat currency it is an anomaly when the currency is not worth less every year. Central banks actually do this on purpose, but they try to keep it to a steady low level of 2 to 3 percent per year.
However because economic and fiscal policy are not a science, they can never factor in all the variables, so thus the results are not always what they expected.

 

[Kevatc]

Only in Hollywood (movies that is).

From what I understand about hyperinflation, when it occurs it can happen quickly. The result is probable supply chain disruptions (possibly for months). That doesn't mean the shelves are bare and stay bare for months. It means re-supply is sporadic. Will there be riots? Sure, in certain parts of cities that traditionally riot whenever they are pissed off at something, and on college campuses (as usual).

What we can count on in a situation like the above: Population centers re-supplied first. Commerce continues. Crime increases. Emphasis on the protection of infrastructure and population in more affluent areas of cities. The usual trouble areas of cities will go crazy, and the news whor-es will be there to film it and blow it out of perspective. Politicians will constantly be on TV and radio blaming the situation on others. Taxes will increase, and increase, and increase. The US will escalate whatever conflict it is involved in, or will start another war (to take people's minds off the situation at home).

Longer term: Agricultural production and manufacturing will become local again. Cost of living escalates due to significant increases in energy costs . Living standards in US will decrease (McMansions disappear, 6yr olds won't have their own cell phones, and people might even learn to garden and cook again). Alternative energy and new fuels will be developed eventually. The world does not end (unless WWIII ends it), Americans will be poorer, and everyone who panicked and ran to the hills will return when they get hungry, run out of decent booze, or need dental care.

This sounds like a more plausible scenario than some would have you believe. A question I have had for the past 2-3 years in regards to PM's ... gold especially is that even though it probably was a great investment had you got into it several years ago what in the heck good does it do me to have a brick of gold when what I need is bread, meat, veggies, ammo, etc????

 

[Grunwald]

This sounds like a more plausible scenario than some would have you believe. A question I have had for the past 2-3 years in regards to PM's ... gold especially is that even though it probably was a great investment had you got into it several years ago what in the heck good does it do me to have a brick of gold when what I need is bread, meat, veggies, ammo, etc????

Brick of gold? Nothing. That's like walking into a store today with a $50,000 bill (if there was such a thing) and trying to buy groceries. The seller cannot make change. However, 1oz silver coins would be good, Even small gold coins should be good for bigger purchases. There are common coins that are worth right now $290 to $370 dollars. These are the size of a nickel and include the British Sovereign and German 20 Marks and Swiss 20 Franc coins as well as all the common bullion coins that come in format as small as 1/10th of an oz (and worth about $150 in gold).

 

[Decker]

Here's a link with a beginners price guide. You'll find some of the gold coins on the left...

What's My Coin Worth? Rare coin values. Rare coin prices.

-d

 

[Burt Gummer]

I've enjoyed the piece of mind of owning silver from $12 +$40+. I will continue to enjoy the ride to $60, $80, $100+ in the next couple years. It is simple math. We have a corrupt Gov controlled by foreign bankers at the private Fed. Those that trust in the same with be rewarded with the theft of their life savings and the shock of a new paradym. The dollar is doomed as is anything associated with it. YouTube - $400 Silver, James Turk Price Target!

If it were not for fake silver certificates floating around - paper that will be as worthless as dollars - the price of silver would be well over $500, possible a $1000/ounce already. This silver manipulation by the banks cannot last forever (especially JP Morgan).

As for the argument that you cannot buy food, things with silver or gold that is ignorant. No further comment necessary. What you won't be able to buy with fiat dollars is the real issue. It will become worthless as toilet paper in the next decade. If PMs are not your thing, transfer your monopoly money into 'things' now while you still can. The dollar is a sad joke, nothing but a debt certificate, back by nothing.

When you go to a bank to get a loan the digits are created out of thin air, out of nothing. The Fed is 'printing' these digits in the TRILLIONS and tossing it around to their foreign banking families like candy. The Fed controls everything. Whether your job exists, whether your retirement check is worth squat, all depends on the foreign-owned Fed bank.

Will Americans ever pry themselves away from what Lindsay Lohen or American Idol long enough to see the coming collapse of our living standard .... nope ... not going to happen. As Jordan Maxwell said "We are given all sorts of entertainments and distractions to keep our minds busy so we won't pay attention to what the important people are doing. Here Junior, go play outside, the adults are talking here." George Carlin even said it better - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4jQT7_rVxAE

 

[cyborg]

I always chuckle a bit whenever someone presents the argument that "When things go bad and I am hungry and need food and supplies a PM will not feed me"
Of course you cannot eat silver or gold. Of course it is wise to stock up on food to eat, weapons to protect your food and person and primitive and barterable skills to continue to live in whatever conditions the future holds for us. Clearly having all of the supplies you will ever need in life is the ideal but is not entirely practical. When times get extremely rough due to a collpase people will barter for what they need. Of course there will be times when people , for example, harvest their crop of perishable fruit or such. Once they have traded for everything they can find that they need they will find themselves with excess perishable items. This is when silver (the replacement currency) comes into play. Would you prefer to have a box full of silver or a pile of rotting material that was half of your harvest? Clearly taking the silver is preferable. This scenario is exactly how the idea of money begins. It is a portable store of wealth and when a large enough group of people agree it has value, it becomes the currency of the society and allows smoother transactions and more flexibility.

I believe that people with the means to add some smaller sized silver bullion coins or rounds to their preps should strongly consider doing so. You know the old adage about keeping all of ones eggs in one basket etc.