OSP - Very PO'd !!! that I did not disclose my CHL

[bearingman]

I have a hard time understanding why it would even be a courtesy to tell the officer you have a permit, when he already knows you have one. If I am carrying, then if asked where it was, I would be glad to inform him, but if he doesn't ask I would assume that since he knows i have a permit, it doesn't matter to him. After all, it is a concealed handgun license.

 

[Asp]

Crowbar? Oxy-Acetylene Torch?

lol

I mean, what it one in lieu of carrying it on their immediate person, holds their pistol in the center console instead? What does one do when/if the police pull you over and they can see it? Outside of keeping my hands on the wheel and smirking, I can't think of much...

 

[probasco]

While i have the utmost support for the law, and 99.9% of the LEO's, how about a little respect in return. I dont ask them where they keep their back up pistol or if they have a license to fish or hunt. CHL holders are 99.9% good honest people and should not be treated as a threat period! The cops should know the laws, yet they consistently argue with, harrass and even arrest for legal actions of the CHL holder. An arrest at The Occupy crowd, because a libtard happened to see a CHL ' pistol butt and called the cops. Why was he arrested? Is it not legal to carry openly with a CHL in Portland, YES, it is legal... so why was he arrested? Because the cop did not know the laws.... They expect us to know all the laws when they dont, and they are charged with enforcing them...

 

[Asp]

CHL holders are 99.9% good honest people and should not be treated as a threat period!

Yes and no. If you are doing something questionable or dangerous (drunk driving, following me, etc) and I call the police, they should treat you like everyone else.
If they pull you over for a minor traffic infraction, then I suppose yes, you ought to be treated fairly and not some kind of Hutaree member.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

I have never, ever, met anyone in ANY profession that knew everything bout their job. Do you expect the clerk at Freddies to know every UPC? Have you never seen a lawyer look up a statute? Have you never seen an electrician reference a schematic? How can anyone expect an LEO to know every single law off the top of their head?

 

[Karma]

They can't know every law of the top of there head. If they don't know 100% then maybe they should reference the ors's. Wouldn't you be pissed off of your lawyer didn't look up a statute or case law? A cop should not portend that they know the law if they don't.

 

[Asp]

They can't know every law of the top of there head. If they don't know 100% then maybe they should reference the ors's. Wouldn't you be pissed off of your lawyer didn't look up a statute or case law? A cop should not portend that they know the law if they don't.

Yes, but they shouldn't flip out like ninjas when a civilian informs them of laws they are supposed to uphold and enforce.

 

[Karma]

Yes, but they shouldn't flip out like ninjas when a civilian informs them of laws they are supposed to uphold and enforce.

100% agree. They need to treat citizens with respect.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

100% agree. They need to treat citizens with respect.

And shouldn't citizens treat officers that face dangers every day with respect as well? How is it an affront to your delicate sensibilities or your perceived liberty to give them the courtesy of saying "I have a gun or CHL and I am letting you know about." Are we trying to pretend that officers are never shot by people carrying legally? Because that is pure crap. if I find you most likely have one on you and did not tell me I immediately have to start wondering why you did not want me to know.

 

[swoop]

Sounds like you ran into a scared, green, over emotional lady cop that may need a few more classes in law and behaver with citizens.

 

[Karma]

And shouldn't citizens treat officers that face dangers every day with respect as well? How is it an affront to your delicate sensibilities or your perceived liberty to give them the courtesy of saying "I have a gun or CHL and I am letting you know about." Are we trying to pretend that officers are never shot by people carrying legally? Because that is pure crap. if I find you most likely have one on you and did not tell me I immediately have to start wondering why you did not want me to know.

Did you read the op? He wasn't even carrying at the time of the stop! I myself do not notify the officer that I am carrying anymore. I had experiences where the officer did not handle it well. I no longer tell them until they ask. Things have went much smoother since.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Did you read the op? He wasn't even carrying at the time of the stop! I myself do not notify the officer that I am carrying anymore. I had experiences where the officer did not handle it well. I no longer tell them until they ask. Things have went much smoother since.

So? How does it harm him to say "I have a CHL but I am not carrying right now."? How does extending that courtesy to an officer harm him? How does it infringe on his personal liberty? I love when people say "I didn't do it because I don't gotta!" Well, I do not have to treat any person I see with respect, but I cannot whimper about it when they treat me the same way in return. People in the gun community are always talking about the huge responsibility that comes with carrying a firearm. If you can't handle this small responsibility how does that speak to your ability to handle larger ones?

If a person cannot see fit to extend this courtesy to an officer (either though oversight or because of other reasons) they have no right to complain when the officer sees no reason to extend them any undue courtesy either. It seems pretty whiny to me.

 

[deadeye]

So? How does it harm him to say "I have a CHL but I am not carrying right now."? How does extending that courtesy to an officer harm him? How does it infringe on his personal liberty? I love when people say "I didn't do it because I don't gotta!" Well, I do not have to treat any person I see with respect, but I cannot whimper about it when they treat me the same way in return. People in the gun community are always talking about the huge responsibility that comes with carrying a firearm. If you can't handle this small responsibility how does that speak to your ability to handle larger ones?

If a person cannot see fit to extend this courtesy to an officer (either though oversight or because of other reasons) they have no right to complain when the officer sees no reason to extend them any undue courtesy either. It seems pretty whiny to me.

What you are failing to grasp here is that he (the OP) did not express any negative attitude to the officer, he simply did not hand his permit over with his license. This is NOT a responsibility of a holder as you seem to suggest and this is why he did not do so. When the officer ran his license she found that he had a legal right to carry and should have accepted the fact that he was a law abiding citizen that chooses to defend himself. She could have stated that it would be nice if he had let her know at first contact but instead became very angry after finding out and went into the mode of judge/jury. So why is she angry that he has a permit and is legally allowed to carry? Did he come up as a felon, wanted fugitive, etc. I would also expect that any officer that does routine stops (especially a M/C cop) at least know all the state laws pertaining to permits and vehicle carry of firearms as that is part of their daily routine.

 

[Trlsmn]

I'm courteous with police, though I haven't been pulled over in 20 years. I will not disclose, it's up to them to ask. It's not the law so it's their problem not mine. If they wanted to be safe they should have chose another profession, stayed at home, not gotten out of bed the morning, not pulled anyone over.

I respect that they chose to do so but only up to the point where it then involves me personally. At that point only the constitutional limits of following the law matter, and acting outside of the law for their own safety needs to take a back seat to my rights, they did after all chose to pull me over, an act they consider unsafe.

The personal safety argument really is a very poor argument for this incident. I mean why not extend it to just shooting the OP as soon as learning of the CHL? He could potentially harm the officer regardless of disclosure, It's the only real way to assure the officers safety. Do words make the officer safer or more trigger happy?

 

[Trlsmn]

I have never, ever, met anyone in ANY profession that knew everything bout their job. Do you expect the clerk at Freddies to know every UPC? Have you never seen a lawyer look up a statute? Have you never seen an electrician reference a schematic? How can anyone expect an LEO to know every single law off the top of their head?

I'll just leave this here:

"Ignorance of the law is no excuse"

 

[wwkii]

I have never, ever, met anyone in ANY profession that knew everything bout their job. Do you expect the clerk at Freddies to know every UPC? Have you never seen a lawyer look up a statute? Have you never seen an electrician reference a schematic? How can anyone expect an LEO to know every single law off the top of their head?

well they expect us to know all the laws and if we dont well guess what you get some smart as$ comment made to you and a big ol ticket. listen my dad and brother are both cops and i really dont care i think that a huge majority of cops are cops because they like to be as$holes to people . its a power trip for them if they really liked to help people they would have become firemen

 

[Redcap]

I'll just leave this here:

"Ignorance of the law is no excuse"

 

[Intention]

And shouldn't citizens treat officers that face dangers every day with respect as well? How is it an affront to your delicate sensibilities or your perceived liberty to give them the courtesy of saying "I have a gun or CHL and I am letting you know about." Are we trying to pretend that officers are never shot by people carrying legally? Because that is pure crap. if I find you most likely have one on you and did not tell me I immediately have to start wondering why you did not want me to know.

Wow guess that says it all. My translation of this: I am in a state of fear while trying to do my job and I deamnd you make
me feel safe.
Also you feel everone you interact with has "dellicate sensibilities" if they stand up for their "percived liberty". That is where the whole thing starts and stops you feel my liberty is percived and expendable for your safety. My constituonal rights are not percived.

 

[Grunwald]

Wow...a whole lotta 'tude flying around in here...bet all that bs goes away when you REALLY need them...and just a news flash...they're not being paid as pr folks, shrinks or being your best buddy. They sign a blank check at the start of their shift, offering the potential of their life to protect us, and then, here you come, full of 'tude and waving statutes...the cherry on their cake, I'm sure.

Treat them as you would like to be treated, and see what happens. They are cops, who want to go home to their families at the end of their shift, not legal scholars, arm chair legal eagles or bloviating bloggers...

How do they enforce the law, if they are ignorant of the law?

 

[wwkii]

well all i can say is if you are going to be enforcing the laws you better damn well know them. this argument that . how are they supposed to know all the laws is pure bs .. you better study them and learn them or go get another job. and loose the im better than you attitude. cops look down on people all the time. they trully feel they are just a little better than you.