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Oh bother ...

You'll have to explain your comment ... as I'm pretty sure Mas Ayoob has neither the legal standing or personal desire to "require you to get permission to exercise a right [that] is yours"....

You may of course disagree with Ayoob's POV that "in your face open carrying" of a rifle is foolish and harmful to the 2A cause, but suggesting that he or any of us who agree with him are bowing down to the anti-gunners is just plain ole silly and without merit.

Ignoring the reality of what happened in California and businesses like Starbucks that previously allowed open carry, and no longer do because of zealots who behaved like angry children, is plain stupid. Keep up the good work.

Sadly no, its right on target. You are bowing down to them. At this point anything but turning in your guns will be "harmful to the 2A cause" with the anti-gunners. You're giving them an argument, a point that lets them wiggle in and push for more laws. For "common sense". For "the children". For "feelings of safety". You are letting yourselves be stereotyped as "just not as bad". Often while these same safety crusaders decry anyone who stereotypes their cherished groups or beliefs. "How dare you judge person or group x! You're a bigot! That incident was just an outlier, a freak crazy person! Not a trend!" Yet with each shooting incident... its a trend. However, don't mention the cases where a gun saved lives or that many shooters were on certain mental drugs widely prescribed today.

You're dancing to their tune. Once you've finished the circular firing squad on the open carry zealots for them, you'll be the only gun zealots left they'll see. Divide and conquer.

I happen to think in many circumstances that open carry is unwise and down right un-neighborly. But what has letting various gun laws be passed over the last 100 years shown us? Each law has ultimately been about making more laws and giving government more control, leading to banning them. It never seems to be enough to placate those who's feelings are hurt or who want more safety.

These anti-gun people and those who bankroll them are zealots themselves. You can not give them an inch. Lest you end up with more debates over the "shoulder things that go up" and whether or not a muzzle break is legal but a flash hider is not. Holding a "brace" to the cheek is ok but on your shoulder is illegal. Ten rounds today, seven rounds tomorrow.
 
Walking with a gun open carried or concealed in a school zone is illegal and asking for trouble.

Guns are legal in school zones IF you have a concealed carry permit. This applies to Oregon and Federal law.


Here's the quote from OFF (Oregon Firearms Federation):
Let's start with schools. CHL holders are allowed in all public schools from K through college.
 
As far as seeing people as threats if they are open carrying, i open carry a handgun when i go for walks with my wife and dog. Does that make me a threat to you? Id hate to have to shoot someone trying to shoot me just because i have a gun on my hip while im walking with my wife and dog.

I would not see you under those circumstances as a threat. Actually I would be able to say that after moving to Oregon 13 years ago, I finally actually saw someone open carry. Take away the wife, dog and replace the handgun with an AR, I would be very concerned for my own safety, especially if I was out walking my dog with my wife and/or child. I just don't see the need to walk down the street with an AR.
 
I would not see you under those circumstances as a threat. Actually I would be able to say that after moving to Oregon 13 years ago, I finally actually saw someone open carry. Take away the wife, dog and replace the handgun with an AR, I would be very concerned for my own safety, especially if I was out walking my dog with my wife and/or child. I just don't see the need to walk down the street with an AR.
Agreed, an AR carried around city streets is unnessary.
 
Today it's unnessasary, it might be prudent at some point. If we where having riots or civil unrest a AR is a completely reasonable choice to open carry.

For walking your dog around town on a sunny afternoon, not so much.

We have the legal right to, and quite possibly events could someday justify doing so. But "just because" or "making a statement" are not really a reason.

"Making a statement". Really is nothing more than going out of your way to be a douchwaffle.
 
Today it's unnessasary, it might be prudent at some point. If we where having riots or civil unrest a AR is a completely reasonable choice to open carry.

For walking your dog around town on a sunny afternoon, not so much.

We have the legal right to, and quite possibly events could someday justify doing so. But "just because" or "making a statement" are not really a reason.

"Making a statement". Really is nothing more than going out of your way to be a douchwaffle.
Yeah rioting and lawlessness is a god reason to break out the ar. Id love to see a day when no one freaked out over the soght pf a rifle but sadly those days died long ago. Id love to sport my ar around town but its understandable with all the crazies put there that people get scared.
 
Open carrying during a time of civil unrest is one of the things the second amendment is about, but the problem with open carrying during peaceful times is its going to get the practice outlawed. What needs to be considered greatly is that during civil unrest, the law is still the law and can be enforced except now you've lost your right during the time you needed it most... all because you wanted to show off your AR while shopping at the store. Brilliant.
 
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Nothing wins over people to our side like seeing a guy walk in at the low ready with a rifle as you are sitting in a restaurant.
 
I would not see you under those circumstances as a threat. Actually I would be able to say that after moving to Oregon 13 years ago, I finally actually saw someone open carry. Take away the wife, dog and replace the handgun with an AR, I would be very concerned for my own safety, especially if I was out walking my dog with my wife and/or child. I just don't see the need to walk down the street with an AR.
I don't either but I'll be damned if I'll let the nanny's tell anyone they can't!
 
Here is the logic of the In Your Face Open Carry Crowd --

They believe that carrying rifles into public places and private property, where open carry is already legal, advances the cause. Fact - we have seen just the opposite. Why get in people's faces and cause alarm when you already have the legal right to carry openly? Oh...they say ... a right not exercised is not a right!
So rather then let that sleeping dog lie and wait for carrying openly when the need is actually needed (e.g. Korea Town - LA Riots) .... they carry their rifles amongst women and children, causing concern and in many cases, legal action removing that legal right. And their strategy:.... keep on doing it until them scardy cat sheeple learn that we don't mean them no harm! (spelling and grammar purposefully shredded).

I might compare this knuckleheaded logic to ...

A smoker, who has the legal right to smoke in an outside park, who walks up to a non-smoker and blows smoke in their face, because they want to maintain the right to smoke in the park.... and dammit, them non-smokers need to become more comfortable with smokers!

or...

In Oregon it is legal to carry your concealed firearm into a bar and to drink alcohol. So as a person with a CHL, I go into a bar while carrying my concealed handgun and get rip-roaring drunk ... and brag to everyone that I'm carrying a gun...all the while falling over drunk. I mean ... what good is it to have a legal 'right' to do something ... if I don't exercise that right?
 
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I'm very thankful to count myself among the members of NWFA. This thread is a great example why I feel that way. It has done a very good job of not degrading into the typical name-calling and extreme views that most open-carry threads seem to quickly spin into on other forums.

I completely agree that these folks (currently) have the right to walk the streets, parks, businesses with their AR/AK/Pistol/Shotgun/etc. at the low ready. I also have the right to disagree with them doing it as an example of exercising poor judgment.

As I've said earlier, gun in hand (or low ready) gives the impression they are "ready" for something. That's not exactly a good visual when we are going about your day (in a non-violent uprising state of society). I was in LA, armed to the teeth, working as field service technician for a wireless carrier trying to keep cell sites on the air during the Loot, Shoot and Scoot days so I know firsthand what is required in that situation. Two man teams, both wearing vests, one man works while the other stands guard with an open display of superior firepower. BTW, that was an offense that would have immediately terminated my employment but I adopted a better safe than dead strategy. The "Korean Grocer" scenario is not the debate at this point.

While we have the right to free speech it's clearly unwise to sit in the lobby of the airport and mutter HIGH-JACK repeatedly without somebody thinking you need to be examined further. There are several things we frown on people saying in public that you are absolutely guaranteed the right to say and also deal with the subsequent consequences of exercising that right.

The debate boils down to one of exercising a "reasonableness standard". Would reasonable people under the same circumstances see your actions the same way you want them too, absent any additional background information? If the answer is anything other than a loud YES then you need to reconsider how you are being perceived. Perception is reality (as unfortunate as that happens to be).

Lots of laws are passed and legal cases are settled on the impact of deeds and actions and not the intent of the actor (see your HR department for a host of examples).
 

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