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Open Carry - by Massad Ayoob

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by RicInOR, Mar 11, 2015.

  1. RicInOR

    RicInOR Washington County Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    OPEN CARRY: WHAT’S YOUR TAKE?
    Tuesday, March 10th, 2015 by Mas
    Open carry is the practice of wearing a presumably loaded firearm, visibly. It normally takes the form of a holstered handgun. It occasionally takes the form of someone carrying a rifle or shotgun into a restaurant, which has a history of causing restaurant chains to ban or at least decry the practice. There is also what gun writer and blogger Tam Keel calls “Open carrying at people,” which I think is the province of those colloquially known as “attention whores.”


    Read the whole thing, not that long.
     
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  2. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    Call it like it is... I think he is on the money
     
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  3. CWOUSCG

    CWOUSCG Member

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    I have no problem with OC of a handgun. The folks who OC AR/AKs do not help the cause. If you want to OC a rifle carry a Win 94.
     
  4. revjen45

    revjen45 Snohomish County Well-Known Member

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    If I were going to OC a rifle it would be a Krag carbine. For pistols I prefer CC.
     
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  5. DSAPT9

    DSAPT9 North Idaho Gold Supporter Gold Supporter

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    I look at it this way either we have a right or we don’t!

    I mean what part of shell not be infringed do you not understand.

    If we as gun owners put limitations on our self then what is the difference between that and the anti's putting limitation on us.

    No Open Carry of ARs or AKs but a Win 94 is acceptable then if that is the case how about no semi auto hand guns just 5 shot revolvers single action only.

    AR15s and AKs are in common use the same as a semi auto hand guns. There is a lot of things in this world I do not like but I will not deny you the right to do it just because I do not like it.

    I agree I do not like the so called “attention whores” but if you want to carry a rifle go for it. Just do it in a safe and professional manner and represent the Second Amendment with pride.
     
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  6. CWOUSCG

    CWOUSCG Member

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    While I agree in principle with you AR/AK rifles have a bad rep with the general public right now. Carrying an "Evil Black Rifle" turns people away from our cause, carrying a Win 94 may start a conversation - "Look Daddy, a cowboy gun!"
    That's my point, start a conversation about it and win a convert.
     
  7. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    I OC my Walther P99 when ever I carry. I have not once had someone come up to me and after talking not understand why I do what I do. But that is what I do on a regular base for the sake of carrying.

    For political statement, I carry my AR. I can't say that I have ever carried in a store to that effect and I would hate to see the state get to a point where I would feel the need to carry a rifle in a store. But that isn't the point of OCing a rifle...

    "The only thing a pistol is good for is to get me to my rifle."- Scott Turner, NWSDE

    The point is that some people want to restrict where you can go with a rifle. That is a fact. There is unforeseeable events (like the giant earthquake OR/CA is grossly overdue for) that could happen where if I have a need to carry I would not want the local municipalities to over react when they see me carrying. We have seen what happens when local law does over react. Let's look at Katrina for example. Police going house to house removing you and your guns. Military staying in abandoned houses and leaving "notes" asking for permission assuming you would be okay to house troops. Checkpoints were established where you needed not be under suspicion of crime to be detained and stripped of your guns without even a note to say they took them, mind you.

    I want law enforcement to be used to dealing with people that are lawfully carrying "scary black rifles" because when the time comes for me to carry, I will not be giving it up, and I will not be in the mood to deal with being molested merely because I was more prepared then the next guy.

    Exposure will eventually lead to relaxation. The only thing that I ask that you do when carrying in a location that it might be disruptive to some people that are not used to black rifles, be respectful. Let it be known that it's a political statement if it is. For god sakes smile.




    Eagle


    Edit: typo
     
  8. WasrNwarpaint

    WasrNwarpaint Portland Well-Known Member

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    keep screaming its your right & stuff those guns in people faces and we will lose that right....
    carry an ak around me in public & my hand is on my handgun because you I think maybe a nut job....

    I am shocked at the number of Neanderthals that dont poses the intellect to realize that they are going to change the laws because of this "it my right" tough guy bravado

    thanks for helping the other side
     
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  9. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    And for that reason, you shouldn't own any weapon.

    If you assume the worst of every person, you are more paranoid than any person that carries a rifle in public.

    But then again that is opinion, just like your premise.
     
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  10. DSAPT9

    DSAPT9 North Idaho Gold Supporter Gold Supporter

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    WasrNwarpaint

    keep screaming its your right & stuff those guns in people faces and we will lose that right....
    carry an ak around me in public & my hand is on my handgun because you I think maybe a nut job....

    I am shocked at the number of Neanderthals that don’t poses the intellect to realize that they are going to change the laws because of this "it my right" tough guy bravado

    thanks for helping the other side



    If this is your opinion then you are welcome.

    So then tell me if you are not allowed to use a right because it might offend others then isn’t it true by all rights you have all ready lost it. They won we lost, even without a law!

    What good is having a right if you not allowed to use it? That doesn’t make since to me.

    If people in our past did not stand up for their rights you would not have those rights today.

    You know like the “Bill of Rights”!

    The First Amendment right so you can even post on this forum without the government shutting it down and the Second Amendment that lets the government know you have the “God given or Natural right” to bear arms to protect yourself.

    Maybe it is time we stand up and tell the government we have had enough. The laws they pass to take away are rights only work if the people are willing to fallow them.

    This is no different than states like Colorado and Washington telling the feds we do not care about federal law we will make pot legal. They stood up and are winning so far whether you agree with them or not and yes they could be punished in some way down the road but they are willing to take the risk.

    So in my opinion if you are not willing to fight to keep you rights then you are as much a part of the problem as the anti’s.

    So I will just say we will have to agree to disagree.

    Have a great day.
     
  11. John H

    John H Whatcom County Well-Known Member

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    So if you seen this guy you wouldn't have your hand on your gun??

    PROTEST12.jpg
     
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  12. BlindedByScience

    BlindedByScience Vancouver WA Well-Known Member

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    I still very much support open carry for the reasons stated in the well written article. I do think some 'common sense' is absolutely required. That guy in the picture above my post is the perfect example. We keep our rights and with this fight with common sense, by showing folks the face of responsible gun ownership, by setting good examples.....not scaring the crap out of the uninformed. Guys like that don't help.....they give guys like Bloomberg fuel for his fire.
     
  13. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    No, I would not. Especially when it's obvious that a political pro-gun event is going on. Don't make a fool of yourself.


    This been said. I equate the low ready stance as having your hand on a holstered pistol, something I do not advocate unless a judicious need arises.


    Eagle

    Edit: added "pro gun" to be more specific.
     
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  14. Vanillagerrilla

    Vanillagerrilla Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Yeah , if I see a guy dressed like he's ready for a gun fight, Im going to be ready too. I have no idea of his intent, be it demonstrative or criminal. I may start reaching for mine, then its just a bad day for every one...
    No offense to those that feel the need to "Mall Ninja Up" and sling that AK at low ready when they trot down to the Coffee shop just to shove their rights in someone else's face. I feel its the same as when the Liberals want shove the gay pride parades in peoples faces. Or the the Militant Bicyclists take over the Highways - yeah we get the point, but quit being a dooshbag. You ruin it for the rest of us.
    That being said, I would never advocate the right to do so be removed or diminished. On either side.
     
  15. 156256Hunter

    156256Hunter Fairview-ish Active Member

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    I doubt it's paranoia to assume something bad might be up, if he sees someone walking around in public (a populated area) with an AK or AR, especially in light of some of the gravely unfortunate events that have occurred here in Oregon.

    If you were to see a random person walking around in a public parking lot or down main street with an AK, for example, and you turn your back on that person and don't think twice about it, then okay. But for a lot of people who have a different approach to situational awareness, that person's behavior would raise a potential red flag.
     
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  16. Vanillagerrilla

    Vanillagerrilla Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Indeed. Crazy people look alot like the rest of the people...
     
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  17. DSAPT9

    DSAPT9 North Idaho Gold Supporter Gold Supporter

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    John K

    So if you seen this guy you wouldn't have your hand on your gun??


    DSAPT9

    I agree I do not like the so called “attention whores” but if you want to carry a rifle go for it. Just do it in a safe and professional manner and represent the Second Amendment with pride.

    I admitted to not liking the “attention whore” and yes I do believe in situational awareness but if I did not know it was a rally I would be at the ready. No difference than if you come into the store I work at open carrying and keep handling the grip on their handgun or keep touching the side where their concealed firearm is located.

    But if you are walking around with your rifle slung over your shoulder or across your back or even on a single point sling at your side I am good to go.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2015
  18. DeanfromOregon

    DeanfromOregon Wilsonville Amateur Ascended Master Platinum Supporter

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    Oh god what a tool. Love the raincoat. Is it movie star dressup day?
     
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  19. 1337BaldEagle

    1337BaldEagle Earth Active Member

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    I beg to differ.

    The presence of a gun should not be an indicator used to determine if bubblegum is about to go down. Read the persons actions. Is the rifle shouldered? Is he trying to conceal it as he is entering a building? Is he finger in the trigger guard? Does he have more than a single mag? Does he look like he means business? Is he with others? Is he at a pro gun rally?

    Simply, the presence of a firearm, any firearm, is not a reasonable indicator to determine if someone has intent to cause harm. Period.

    If we start to go down that road, you open us up to reasonable restrictions on type, manor of transportation, and registration legislation. Because "black rifles" are the choice of criminals? No, you are far more likely to get shot by a pistol in the country than a rifle. Far more likely.



    Eagle

    Edit: Grammer
     
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  20. WasrNwarpaint

    WasrNwarpaint Portland Well-Known Member

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    OH PLEASE your acting the fool here....Im not paranoid, ...you pick a photo at a gun rally that obvious its a rally.....thats just foolish.......point not well made....jeesh...

    what about your buddy walking alone in the city of Portland to a restaurant with a loaded AK making their point its their right to open carry where they want.(see youtube)...........just scaring citizens isnt in our best interest......can you still open carry loaded weapons in Portland? so hows this stance your taking working out for the rest of us responsible gun owners......NOT WELL EVERYTIME YOU PULL THIS CRAP THEY WRITE MORE LAWS TO STOP YOU
    WAKE UP!

    ITS RESPONSIBLE GUN OWNERSHIP NOT FOOLISH GUN OWNERSHIP

    what if I parade up & down the streets in your neighbourhood front of your house, kids out playing...and you notconcerned?.........
    maybe you dont know how to protect your loved ones?
    ..Im worried about your attitude what do you need to walk down my street with a loaded AK for?.....
    give me good & logical reason you need THE RIGHT to walk down my street with a loaded AK....Ill give you a better reason I may need to pop you

    YOU WALK DOWN MY STREET WITH A LOADED AK YOU ARE INFRINGING ON ME SO I DONT GIVE A RATS A$$ WHAT YOU WANT.......stop trying to loose my rights to bear arms
     
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