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OK, admit it range finders

Discussion in 'Northwest Hunting' started by wawaverider, Sep 21, 2010.

  1. wawaverider

    wawaverider PDX, OR Member

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    Ok, there are two arguments out there for zeroeing your hunting rifle.

    1-Zero your rifle in the woods, doing a pace count ?(no laser range finders unless you plan on using it in the woods. . .but have a contigency plan if it breaks)
    2-Zero you rifle at a KDR, Known Distance Range and bring the range finder with you to the woods?

    It could be argued at the range, you're more likely to end up more accurate and less likely to injure an animal. Or if you zero in the woods, you'll be more accurate because you are better at judging distance in relation to your zero, because of what you may perceive as 50 or 100 yds.

    I've often used a spot in the woods (50-100 yds off of my pace count) to zero. This year my supposed bore sight was so off, I went to a range to figure out what was going on. It finally works, but within 2 MOA not the best. Ended up going to mech zero on the scope and taking the bolt out put the rifle on a rest. Did a field expedient boresight.
    In the spirit of Switzerland (being neutral on the subject) I have respect for those who are successful in either manner.
     
  2. spengo

    spengo GLORIOUS CASCADIA Active Member

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    This seems weird to me. Maybe because I am not a hunter.

    Why would you zero your rifle in the field? I go shooting once a week so I would notice long before I went out if the zero had gotten off somehow. Also, what kind of cheapo scope/mount does not hold zero, especially on a gun that is not shot often enough to notice the zero is wrong?
     
  3. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    Dude your over thinking it .next time at a range, when you go get your target see how accurate your pacer is .

    if your pace is average you only talking less than a inch off accuracy for any thing up to 200 yds

    just know that your gun is on and don't get crazy like my dad who hit most of his deer between the eyes

    If aiming for heart or lungs your going to kill it regardless if you zeroed in the woods or range , unless your one of those commando wannabes hunting with a .223 reliving the days back in nam which happened before they were even born

    Here is what i do . I zero at a 100 range either at a real range or gravel pit using a range finder i don't guess or leave anything to chance i know where my bullet is gonna land at 25yds 100 yards and 200 yards PERIOD

    I used to use the ole pace method but that left a little to chance ( never the same pace but i was still growing at the time between 14-18 ) and i would second guess my self like you it caused me to over think it.

    you need to find the method you are most comfortable and accurate with and go with that. dispite what anyone else says. unless you think they have a better way of doing it.
     
  4. wawaverider

    wawaverider PDX, OR Member

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    spengo, it wasn't the mount that was bad it was the person who supposedly boresighted the rifle. I did a field expedient boresighting. Like I said I thought it was boresighted but I ended up going more than 20 clicks down and 20 left with a scope at 1/4" MOA. I've never had a boresight off that much.

    eldbillbo, I appreciate you insight. I'm pretty confident with my pace count in uneven terrain, that's what I'll stick to. . . until I can afford a range finder!
     
  5. cwegga

    cwegga Helena, MT Active Member

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    I think you'd be fine either way. I'd think you'd only run into real problems if you did half and half. Sighted in to paces and then used a laser sight or sighted in at the range and then guessed range. Even then it would only cause problems if your paces or range estimation was considerably off from reality.
     
  6. raisersedge

    raisersedge backwoods Member

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    I sight in 3 inches high at 100 yards so it would make little difference.
     
  7. gallogiro

    gallogiro Willamette Valley Active Member

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    Wow, what caliber/ rifle??
     
  8. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    or carry a 100 yard roll of twine and get a consistent measurement tie it to your target . being consistent is the main issue

    being off by a few inches is not too big of a deal when deer hunting (depending on what your aiming at) but being more than that could mean missing the vital organ your aiming at and sending a wounded animal into the woods

    as a experiment you should try using the twine in different areas you would sight it and pace and see how consistent your pace is
     
  9. raisersedge

    raisersedge backwoods Member

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    With my 06 I shoot 3 high at a hundred, With my 300 wm I go 2 hugh at 100. I have hunted with a lot of people who sight dead on at a hundred. This semms to me not really effective. I lose just over twenty inches at 500
     
  10. Dan360

    Dan360 Olympia, WA Member

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    Are you hunting in country open enough where you don't get any close shots? If you are only 20 inches low at 500, you are WAY high at mid-range with a 30-06.

    I usually sight in at 200 yards at the farthest. This way I don't have to worry about shooting over mid-range animals. It seems harder to aim low than aim high.
     
  11. ehunter

    ehunter Hilllsboro Oregon Member

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    I agree I want to be able to point and shoot out to 300 yards. Unless your hunting some really open country a range finder seems redundant with a rifle in your hands. Most people should not be shooting more than 300 yards unless they practice a lot and yea then a range finder would be very helpful. Of course know its 300 yards is nice too. Ok a ranger finder had benefits;)

    What did we do before electronics.


     
  12. Jamie6.5

    Jamie6.5 Western OR Well-Known Member

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    What is your cartridge/rifle combo's Maximum Point Blank Range?
    Using the MPBR method, find the inches high @100 yds and adjust to that. Then check it at at least 200 yds to verify, or better yet, measure off the MPBR zero and fine tune your POI to the bull.
    That will put you within a 6" circle, 3" up or 3" down, from the muzzle to MPBR.
    Head to your nearest external ballistics calculator and find out.
    I have used this one online:
    External Ballistics Calculator

    I use one I downloaded now.
    It sounds like ehunter is doing close to that, based on the trajectories of the rounds he mentions.
    The deer load I use in my .270 consists of a 130gr sierra SPBT or Hornady SST. (B.C.435-.460) @3120fps on the chrono. Using the MPBR calculator it zeros at 260 yds and results in an MPBR of 307 yds. My initial zero at 100yds is around 2-1/4". Then I step it out to 250yds, double check the distance with a laser rangefinder, and double check the POI.
    In most hunting situations, the laser rangefinder never has to come out, because I'll know if they're within 300yds.
    But if in doubt, whip it out!
     
  13. raisersedge

    raisersedge backwoods Member

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    My 300 and 220 are 20 inches low at 500 yards
     
  14. ehunter

    ehunter Hilllsboro Oregon Member

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    I have chronographed my loads so I know I am shooting close to 3100, in my 270 130 partions and 60 grians H4831sc, but I have been shooting from 50 out to 300 so I am in good shape. Although I did not go out hunting last weekend instead went to the range and shooting from the bench my 308 shooting a 165 partion and Ballstic tip is dead on at 200 but about 8 inches low at 300 my 270 is about 6 inches. I will say this for these old eyes even 300 yards with a bench is a long ways.:D


     
  15. Jamie6.5

    Jamie6.5 Western OR Well-Known Member

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    :laugh: 300 yds IS 300 yds,...
    But 25 years ago it seemed a helluva lot closer than it does now!
     
  16. ehunter

    ehunter Hilllsboro Oregon Member

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    So true I am thinking 50 power scope might be in order grin!! Except they are so dang heavy and I hate to carry so much weight so I will just have to get closer. grin!!