Occufight, anyone going to watch?

[swoop]

So the government should violently and forcibly enforce class B misdemeanors to squelch protests?

Protests are good, camping in the park is not. I can't do it, you can't do it, the homeless can't do it, but these particular protesters can? Why is that?

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Protests are good, camping in the park is not. I can't do it, you can't do it, the homeless can't do it, but these particular protesters can? Why is that?

Because non-violent civil disobedience is essential for visible protest. Even the elected officials realize that. making armed raids against non-violent protesters before the message is received would have been met with public outrage. Even the media in PDX is admitting that the vast majority of people they are talking to that are not involved in the movement still are supportive of the ideas behind it.

 

[shibbershabber]

Protests are good, camping in the park is not. I can't do it, you can't do it, the homeless can't do it, but these particular protesters can? Why is that?

Because It is their first amendment right. They arent just random vagrants living in the park. It is a 'round the clock protest.

So to answer your question of why... Because the Bill of Rights supersedes local ordinances. Period. End of story.

No one is asking you to support their means or their message... As a freedom loving American, you have to support their right to do it.

 

[Trlsmn]

Just making a guess here but something tells me that Rufus is a Glen Beck fan... lol

I'm not a Beck fan but I would point out that your problem with him is his right wing propaganda? Well let me point out the fact that you just signed up here at NWFA today only hours ago and have done nothing but spread left wing propaganda so you are really not one of us but just here to spread left wing propaganda.

I should change you user name from Both Eyes Open to Two Left Eyes.

 

[swoop]

I'm not a Beck fan but I would point out that your problem with him is his right wing propaganda? Well let me point out the fact that you just signed up here at NWFA today only hours ago and have done nothing but spread left wing propaganda so you are really not one of us but just here to spread left wing propaganda.

I should change you user name from Both Eyes Open to Two Left Eyes.

 

[Trlsmn]

Oh oops... I forgot, I'm not allowed to post anything unless you agree with it.... Sounds like you have some work to do before you can live up to your username.

As do you.

 

[Benny503]

No one is asking you to support their means or their message... As a freedom loving American, you have to support their right to do it.

+1

 

[Buddhalux]

So where is camping in a park inside of a city protected here?

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The right to assemble is not the same is camping for 30+ days in the middle of a city. I'm not even goign to bother to bring up the theft, vandalism, and mayhem they've caused so far.

 

[rufus]

You think? He is either a fan of Beck or auto-erotic asphyxiation. Both will kill brain cells.

He speaks from experience.

Congrats Portland, you have your park back. You should wait until the steam-cleaning and disinfecting is completed before entering. I'd give it a few months. Income inequality? Give me a break.

 

[rufus]

I should change you user name from Both Eyes Open to Two Left Eyes.

How about "Head Firmly Lodged"?

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

So where is camping in a park inside of a city protected here?

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances."

The right to assemble is not the same is camping for 30+ days in the middle of a city. I'm not even goign to bother to bring up the theft, vandalism, and mayhem they've caused so far.

I would think preventing them from holding their rally for as long as they chose to make their point would be considered abridging (deprive b : to reduce in scope : diminish <attempts to abridge the right of free speech>. 2. : to shorten in duration or extent ) their assembly. Wouldn't you? It is a bit hard to argue for gun rights when you cannot honor this right.

 

[gunnoob75]

They have destroyed public property. That's not peacefully assembling.


"Congress shall make no law.." And didn't, anyway.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

They have destroyed public property. That's not peacefully assembling.


"Congress shall make no law.." And didn't, anyway.

You destroy public property whenever you walk across the grass at the park. Even city officials have stated that the damage to the park is minimal (less than from public concerts in most cases). Stop trying to use trivial topics to disguise your unwillingness to support the rights of those you disagree with. Nowhere does it state in the constitution that their rights shall not be abridged as long as they don't kill any grass.

And by your logic, as long as anti-gun regulations are passed by local communities they are fine (since the constitution regulates only the passing of laws against the infringement of the right to carry) or that the right to bear arms only applies as long as you do not offend anyone or cause any harm.

 

[gunnoob75]

What about the concrete that was broken up from the foundation, that the cops removed? That is direct damage to property. Not just walking on grass. Or the XX year old tree's that had signs and structures nailed to them, and I think branches removed from?

What about the diseases they brought about, and risked spreading to those nearby?

And don't try and tell me what rights I agree or disagree with. I won't make presumptions about you, and you don't need to about me.
Be an Adult.

 

[Both Eyes Open]

So I guess trlsmn needs to add to the rule book exactly how long one has to be a member here before they can voice an opinion. He should also make a point of telling everyone in a thread how long each person has been a member... Because that is so important to the issue!!! I think that you don't like what you are hearing, and like FOX news, you have to resort to name calling and insults to make yourself feel like a man. Get your head out of "your utero" and smell something that doesn't stink so bad. Its called the truth! Sure, I will admit to being liberal but I don't have much option with what your precious GOP has to offer....Anyway, back to the topic at hand. The Occupy Movement is a success! I will openly agree that (IF) they broke up a foundation, they shouldn't have. That doesn't mean that I am going to join the band wagon here and tell people they are wrong for exercising their 1st amendment rights! At least through all our disagreements over the first amendment... We can stand together one one other issue... Our 2nd amendment.

OUT!

 

[marty8587]

Membership dates and numbers of posts are prominatly displayed on the side of each post.

 

[22many]

So I guess trlsmn needs to add to the rule book exactly how long one has to be a member here before they can voice an opinion. He should also make a point of telling everyone in a thread how long each person has been a member... Because that is so important to the issue!!! I think that you don't like what you are hearing, and like FOX news, you have to resort to name calling and insults to make yourself feel like a man. Get your head out of "your utero" and smell something that doesn't stink so bad. Its called the truth! Sure, I will admit to being liberal but I don't have much option with what your precious GOP has to offer....Anyway, back to the topic at hand. The Occupy
Movement is a success! I will openly agree that (IF) they broke up a foundation, they shouldn't have. That doesn't mean that I am going to join the band wagon here and tell people they are wrong for exercising their 1st amendment rights! At least through all our

disagreements over the first amendment... We can stand together one one other issue... Our 2nd amendment.

OUT!

I think trlsmn was pointing out your agenda with your current join date and your postings. This site is for gun owners to share their hobby of guns with politics being a bi product. If your that set on arguing politics then Joey has another website for that.

And I can't or won't support anybody that agrees in destruction of public or private property.

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

What about the concrete that was broken up from the foundation, that the cops removed? That is direct damage to property. Not just walking on grass. Or the XX year old tree's that had signs and structures nailed to them, and I think branches removed from?

What about the diseases they brought about, and risked spreading to those nearby?

And don't try and tell me what rights I agree or disagree with. I won't make presumptions about you, and you don't need to about me.
Be an Adult.

What foundations were "broken up?" The tiny amount of concrete that was seized was reported to have been "brought in" by a small number of people in the park. In fact police spokesmen said the concrete were pieces from "forms" used for foundations. It also turns out that the truck they showed with huge chunks of concrete leaving the park was not the actual concrete seized. Most of it was already in the city vehicle from a project on the river walk.

 

[whiskeybill]

Both Eyes Open, sorry, not a drinking man. That is merely my handle here.

Playboypenguin, I am glad that these people are educated and thoughtful. It shows in just how they are able to get the message across through the media. Perhaps if I were just to take the time from my schedule and go engage them, I would be so enlightened.
Educated and thoughtful people would have obtained a permit from the city for camping in the parks.
Educated and thoughtful people would not have been so hostile to the local news crews in the early times of the protest.
Educated and thoughtful people would have taken a moment to consider the financial impact to the city (and ultimately to the taxpaying citizens of Portland) for the overtime they have incurred of public safety employees, and to the cost of the clean-up of the parks.
Educated and thoughtful people would have ensured there were no "unsavory" characters in their midst to tarnish their image (I refer back to the earlier rant about engaging the local press).
I did note with some satisfaction the reaction of the crowd when the police officer was hit and injured by a thrown object. The crowd singled out the individual who did it and shoved him out to the police. Bravo Zulu. Good on ya folks!
Listening to some of the points of these people, I can honestly say there are a very few points I can agree on, corporate welfare being just one. That being said, they did a dreadful job of getting those points out to the rest of us so-called "99%". At the end of the day, image is everything, no matter how you roll that joint and smoke it. It is obvious there was no clear agenda, and no well defined timeframe for the protest. Was it their intent to camp out forever and ever until corporate welfare ended, student loans and mortgages were modified, and sasparilla flowed from the hard rock candy mountain? Now that they have been forced out of the parks, they can't even agree on where to go next. Geeez, I really wish I weren't so biased and short-sighted. I really wish I could see through the fog and get a feel for what they REALLY stand for. As for me, I will continue to engage my elected officials in the time honored method of writing, e-mailing, calling their offices, attending townhall meetings and voting. Call me a traditionalist. Call them what you will. We all have First Amendment rights. The taxpayers of Portland also have a right to use and enjoy the parks that they paid for and continue to maintain. It is obvious that the "Occupy" protesters trampled on citizens rights while exercising thier "Right to Free Speech", and that is inexcuseable in a civil society. My wife and I are politically polar opposites. She was an anti-war protester against the Vietnam War, I was career military, and we don't crap on each other. Good Grief, SHE doesn't even understand what the goals of the "Occupy" movement are! These folks have a serious PR problem!

Keep in mind that if the somewhat hazy goals of any "Peaceful Protest" are not met, then it historically escelates into "The Tantrum" (read that as violence).

 

[Mark W.]

Not to join one side or the other. But I do know that any where Human waste entered the soil that soil will have to be removed taken to a Hazmat land fill and added to the pile. I work construction doing site developement and on many many jobs we have inspectors testing soils sometimes we have to dig it up place it on a tarp and wait until the tests are back before we can haul it off. Human wastes fresh like this would certainly fall into the Hazmat catagory. So if they end up having to do that. Then that is certainly more then is done to restore grass at a concert.