Obama plans speech to kids during school.

[Chee-to]

I usually stay away from these pig-wrestling threads, but his one offers an opportunity for a little meta-critique.

What I see here are a majority of posters saying, "Oh, get over it, the POTUS is giving a speech to schoolkids, so what?"

A vocal minority invokes dark conspiracies of brainwashing, media propaganda and the obligatory H-namecalling that invariably pops up in lieu of logical argument.

I am reasonably certain that no poster is prepared to change his/her mind on the subject, so these observations are intended only to point out who you've chosen as your kin to each of you.

Are you proud to be associated with the group that you've chosen? Do you feel that the dialectic approach of your group is reasonable, civil, appropriate, or even honest? Does it matter to you one way or t'other? Or does the end justify the means in this or any other contest? Don't answer me - just turn off the TV, look in the mirror, and think about it.





"Don't ever wrestle with a pig: You'll only get all dirty, and besides - the pig LIKES it!"

"Don't believe everything you think."

Maybe one should take one's own advice about wrestling and such,

And "Don't believe everything you think." .....

 

[CEF1959]

Well, you can bet your bippy you won't find anything on any of the liberal networks, you're right about that....If you want a link;........

http://blog.heritage.org/2009/09/03/politicizing-the-department-of-education/

Funny you should quote a right wing blog, because it turns out this whole brouhaha was cooked up by the Florida Republican Party and has been thoroughly debunked by the non-partisan and Pulitizer Prize winning St. Petersberg Times fact checker website. I hope this puts the whole silly nonsense to rest. Of course, if you don't live in a fact-based world, it won't mean a thing to you.

http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter...ican-party-florida-says-obama-will-indoctrin/

More generally, it would be helpful if people would try thinking critically and not just believing what they read on right-wing internet sites, see on Glenn Beck or Bill O'Reilly or hear on right-wing talk radio. This may shock you, but sometimes those sources are badly mistaken. Indeed, they have an incentive to be badly mistaken, because it keeps people like you lathered up enough to keep listening.

 

[buyamonkey]

http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter...ican-party-florida-says-obama-will-indoctrin/

Nice link! Also to think that any kid between kindergarten and 8th grade gives a rats bottom about health care, automotive industry or other "socialist" agenda is kind of ridiculous, and any kid in High school is only watching it because their US history or Contemporary World problems teacher is going to make them write a paper about it so they don't have to do a lesson plan that day.

If this was another time period in history the nay sayers and anti-"current" government people would be rounded up and put on the political black list.

I hate the way I get sucked into these but I guess without differing points of view NWfirearms becomes FOX news northwest firearms.

It's students all over the country, and it's the president of the United States of America whether you voted for him or not. Please put your tin-foil hats away, and head on over to Hawaii and get a peek at the Certificate of Live birth that everyone in the State of Hawaii gets when they need to sign up for Little League or become the President and vote again in 3 years.

It's a minor relief for the 8 years of sour grapes I had for a president that I didn't vote for, didn't win by a "Majority of the people" and had all sorts of potential vote tampering legal issues in a state governed by a relative.

Eddie

 

[chemist]

Maybe one should take one's own advice about wrestling and such,

And "Don't believe everything you think." .....

Thank you, it's with some trepidation that I've waded into this non-debate. I do take my own counsel, as well as that of others, and my opinions and beliefs have reversed dramatically several times during my five plus decades. I don't think that "staying the course" is noble in and of itself, especially in the face of new and contradictory information.

The hardest part for me personally is overruling my "gut feeling" with fact and logic, even if the conclusions I reach end up bringing down my carefully constructed and ardently protected world-view. It's so easy to be ruled by fear and divisiveness, but one thing I've learned is that you and I are so similar that we're almost indistinguishable, whether or not we find ourselves on opposite sides of a sociopolitical chasm. You and I are krill for the whales.

I ask myself daily, "What do I KNOW, and what do I BELIEVE because it's what I've been TOLD?" So much superstition masquerades as knowledge in our culture that some people are openly hostile to the gathering of facts and and to their rational interpretation. Take a quick look at "logical fallacies" in Wiki and decide for yourself if any of them look familiar:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_fallacies

 

[Dan-Dee Sales Inc]

I need another bag of popcorn.

 

[PosterGuy]

I need another bag of popcorn.

Be careful, reading this thread may significantly lower your IQ.

 

[gunnoob75]

Be careful, reading this thread may significantly lower your IQ.

I've missed you, baby! You don't come barking up my tree anymore. One, two posts a month. It's not enough for me anymore.

Also, who cares? Has Obama never made a speech before? Won't change anything.

Or is he doing this teleprompter-free?

 

[treemanx]

I didnt vote for Obama because I dont like him. I dont like what he stands for. I dont like his questionable past and present associates. I dont like him or most of his beliefs. I have to accept the fact that he is President, but I also have to continue to protect my kids from things I believe to be negative influences.

I dont want Obama speaking unscripted and live to my kids(I know they are going to release the transcripts). I dont want him speaking to them at all. When my kids turn 18, they can choose to expose themselves to negative influences, but until then, I will raise them under the umbrella of my beliefs.

 

[gunnoob75]

What are the odds of Obama putting out these "Transcripts", then saying something different in his speech? Getting people to agree to let him speak, based on these scripts. But then say something different?

 

[treemanx]

What are the odds of Obama putting out these "Transcripts", then saying something different in his speech? Getting people to agree to let him speak, based on these scripts. But then say something different?

Nothing would surprise me at this point. IF, and thats a big IF, they do release the transcripts beforehand, whether or not Obama follows the script is another story altogether.

 

[Dan-Dee Sales Inc]

Be careful, reading this thread may significantly lower your IQ.

Do they have a minus IQ?

 

[4Freedom]

It's students all over the country, and it's the president of the United States of America whether you voted for him or not. Please put your tin-foil hats away, and head on over to Hawaii and get a peek at the Certificate of Live birth that everyone in the State of Hawaii gets when they need to sign up for Little League or become the President and vote again in 3 years.

Too bad this document is sealed and not accessible to the public. THe certificate's authenticity has been questioned many times. It does not match any official birth certificate documents of the period. A man as connected and supported in the state of Hawaii as Obama, will have not much of a problem working with insider's to fabricate a document either. I know people will say that Obama would never incite corruption in any way, shape or form.



I know there are some liberals on NW Firearms and I don't mean to deprecate the grand Messiah Obama. Perhaps there is a lot more liberals here than I can imagine, its the PAc NW after all. However, Obama's mannerism and rhetoric is what has impeded our trust of him. If Bush said half the crap that Obama said, he would have been dangling from a rope on Capital Hill.

Most liberals turn a blind eye to all of the political heresies that Obama has attached to him. Liberals decry any criticism or mistrust of a man who has no trust for law-abiding, loyal American citiznes. This same man always is eager to criticize, "The TYpical White" working class American citizen.

Is this the same man who's party deemed police officers, military veterans and now the CIA as a threat to American security? Yes, sure lets have this same traitorous man come to our schools and infuse his malicious idelogies on the little children. Obama's is a narcissist and a megalomanic and it shows, with the kind of wording he composed for the speech, "How The CHIldren Can Help The President." This would have been a very similar topic that Stalin, Zedung, or even Adolf Hitler woudl have chosen for a speech to the youth. Obama does come from the school of communism and spent a great deal of his life reveling at the glory of these leaders. Yes, today its all brushed under the table, but his mindset stll radiates clearly underneath his facade.


Did anyone care when Obama said his grandmother was a "Typical White Person". That his pastor of 20+ years who he dedicated an entire book to and quoted as like his fater, says America is a land of white devils?

Yeah, liberals carve out the part of the brain that invokes detailed objective analysis in favor of mindless servitude. You constantly whine and cry about how George W ruined the nation for 8 years and are so happy with Obama. Yet , what is the Messiah doing differently? He cannot figure out his backside from his forehead. The wars did not end. The rich have not become less greedy. Now all your hard earned tax money is ending up in the hands of a corrupt treasury department and in the fuel tanks of rich CEOs who can extend their vacation time as their companies fall apart. Obama kissed your crying arsh to get into office, by pampering you with pretty little promises that any rational thinking person could ascertain. But for those naive people, they will keep drinking the Obama Kool-Aid.

Did anyone care that the head of a Syrian mafia ring in Chicago financed this politician. If it was not for Rezko and the likes, Obama would have been a lawyer in Chicago suing little old ladies for not paying their overbloated hospital bills. Did anyone care that Obama's wife worked for one of the most corrupt and unscrupulous hospitals in Chicago?

Obama is a mafia-endorsed politician. He's a payroll mafia politician. Do you really want this man around your children?

I Don't!

Oh yeah, Obama also condemns people who clings to guns and religion. THose liberals who are infatuated with the man, do a favor and turn your guns to appease your leader. In this way, you "HELP HIM". The more controlled you are by the government, the better! Especially , "Rich, White People".

 

[cameronhu]

Um, is there something related to firearms in all this...?

 

[Chee-to]

Funny you should quote a right wing blog, because it turns out this whole brouhaha was cooked up by the Florida Republican Party and has been thoroughly debunked by the non-partisan and Pulitizer Prize winning St. Petersberg Times fact checker website. I hope this puts the whole silly nonsense to rest. Of course, if you don't live in a fact-based world, it won't mean a thing to you.

http://politifact.com/truth-o-meter...ican-party-florida-says-obama-will-indoctrin/

More generally, it would be helpful if people would try thinking critically and not just believing what they read on right-wing internet sites, see on Glenn Beck or Bill O'Reilly or hear on right-wing talk radio. This may shock you, but sometimes those sources are badly mistaken. Indeed, they have an incentive to be badly mistaken, because it keeps people like you lathered up enough to keep listening.

Yup, yup, that's an unbiased source. Your gonna have to do better than that..

The St. Petersburg Times endorses Barack Obama for President
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x4138191

The St. Petersburg Times endorses Barack Obama for President of the United States...
http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/samgrahamfelsen/CGxVJ

 

[chemist]

Will you get behind this:

I talked to my x-wife and we both desided to have our girls stay home that day. Everything they (Government) are doing is back stabbing and fashious to no end. Everytime I turn around I'm hearing about or seeing something stuped from them. Like the Marine from Camas, Washington said. "" LEAVE MY KIDS ALONE!""

Or open your mind to this:
http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/

Time is short, fellow citizens, and the choices we make now will resonate through generations to come. I'm not asking you to agree with me - only to choose your path wisely, rationally, and freely.



"None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free."
- Goethe

 

[Johnny_boy]

Generally I am all for the president making speeches to students and children. Almost always they have good message to share when it comes to asking the children to stay in school, work hard and get further education.

I think the problem here is the fact that the department of education has created the "lesson plan" and sent to all school principles and asking them to participate.

Whether the school should make/allow students to watch this should be left to teachers and school and parents. I don't remember the last time when the president made a speech and schoole were all told to watch it and participate following a lesson menu.

Quotes like this in the pre-k to 6 "lesson plan" is what people get all worked up about:
- "Why is it important that we listen to the president and other elected officials, like the mayor, senators, members of congress, or the governor? Why is what they say important?"
- "What is the president trying to tell me? / What is the president asking me to do? / What specific job is he asking me to do?"
- "Write letters to themselves about what they can do to help the president. These would be collected and redistributed at an appropriate later date by the teacher to make students accountable to their goals"

1. Hmmm, first tell the children they need to listen to the government officials
- (blindly? I am sure If Geroge Bush said this the people would have went nuts too. I am sorry, I would like to teach my children to listen to parents and teachers and God fearing people, and then evaluate what those people are saying based on the principles that they have been taught. We should respect govnerment officials, but we do not teach them to listen to Sadam, Castro or Chavez, just because they are govnerment officials. Unfortunately most of the govnerment officials especially in DC are liars (both parties!). I don't want my children to listen to them)
2. Then, tell the kids to do what the govnerment officials are asking
3. Then, make the kids accountable based on the letter they wrote about how they are going to help the president?

Things like above can come across as indoctrinating children.

Again, I think if these whole lesson plan from Dep. of Ed was not there, and president just made a speech to school children about staying in school and working hard, I don't think anybody would have problems with it.

(BTW, we will never know what the real script of tuesday speech would have been, becasue it would been changed on Monday. So either party will never really know if he was going to only talk about education or something else)

 

[Scott]

So the opposing point of view would be that children should not hear from the duly-elected President of the United States? We should shelter our children from hearing from their President? We had an election. It was fair. It was a landslide.

I worry about the apparent lack of commitment of some people to democratic principles where sometimes you win and sometimes you lose, but you agree to abide by the outcome. It's the American system. It makes us unusual, if not unique. The alternative is scary.

No my child should not hear from the so called duly-elected president who has an idea of the world that is much different from most people I know and yes I tell my kid the real plans of the president and tell him the truth. If you feel it was a fair election you watch to much MSNBC. So I suppose AFL-CIO and Acorn are respectable groups as well. I saw a totally different election than you.

 

[sparkly_flea]

Are we at the point in America now where the only thing we can do is hate on those who we don't agree with? Isolate ourselves with "like-minded" people so we never have to hear a dissenting opinion?

I would like to think most people make rational decisions based on the facts before them. Unfortunately our "facts" these days, the facts we choose to believe, are provided to us by sources who's agenda is to advance their own agenda and whom we already agree with anyway. Does that sound like a nation of independent, free thinking people? This frickin' out of control media machine on both sides (why the **** are there only two sides anyway?) just keeps churning out the divisiveness when in fact we are likely more alike then different. You sure wouldn't know it though as we're told by our sources what is bad and what is good. I wouldn't know what to rail against if it weren't for MSNBC or Fox. I let them tell me when I should be outraged. Seems the opposite of what we set out to do as a nation which, as I see it, was to live free from tyranny, have a fair chance to better our own and our children's lives and respect the rights and views of those that differ from our own. WTF happened?

 

[el gringo loco]

To all those people who think this election was stolen: Where the he77 were you eight years ago when the presidential election really was stolen?

The fact is that I thought W was an illegitimate president, a deserter, and our worst leader since Warren G Harding. Most people, even if they liked him, would agree the man was not a great speaker. However, once he was sworn in he was my president---not just the president of only the people who voted for him. Despite the fact that I did not agree with the man and that he was a lousy speaker, I watched and listened to every major speech the man gave when he was in office. He was the leader of my country and it was my responsibility as a citizen to, at the very least, hear him out. Had he given a speech directed to my kids-regardless of topic-I would have forced them to listen to it. I might have discussed the content with them later, but they would have given the man the respect that goes along with his office.

I doubt President Obama will get very political. More likely he will encourage kids to work hard and give back to their country and community. I think those messages cross partisan lines. Even if you don't agree with the man's politics, the fact that he was able to join a club with only 44 members could serve to inspire kids to believe that, they too, can accomplish what they set out to do. GW Bush could have delivered the same message (not as eloquently).....but I think that when a native Kenyan who plotted from birth to become the first non-citizen (and coincidentally the first black) president tells you that anything is possible....well....It's a lot more inspirational. :winkkiss:

 

[aflineman]

From this thread: <broken link removed>

Going forward from now on, the Legal and Political section is only to be used for gun-related political discussion (and legal stuff, obviously). This was the original intention of the section, but I knew I needed to allow all the dirt on Obama because he himself is most likely going to have a direct impact on our gun rights. He's now our next president, so there's no longer a reason to discuss his tax plan, where he was born, or anything else about him that isn't gun related.

So, how does this have anything to do with guns? Go to DU or somewhere else to talk politics not related to guns.