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North Korea attacks South

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by bugeye, Nov 22, 2010.

  1. bugeye

    bugeye Oregon Well-Known Member

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    North Korea shells South Korean island | Reuters

    Interesting, first North Korea shows a top US scientist their secret Uranium enrichment facility and a few days latter this. I guess we should thank them for revealing such a good target. Earlier this year they deny sinking a South Korean ship by submarine but maybe that is true as I'm not sure you can trust South Korea either.

    Interesting times ahead, and this is way gun related, canons in this case.
     
  2. Trlsmn

    Trlsmn In Utero (Portland) Well-Known Member

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    It just never ends.
     
  3. WhyteCheddar

    WhyteCheddar East of Moscow by the Willamette Well-Known Member

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    North Korea is due for a serious bloody nose. I think losing their prescious little nuclear program would do the trick nicely. At some point even the seriously neglectful have to grease their squeeky wheel and NK is way over due for some lube.
     
  4. chemist

    chemist Beaverton OR Well-Known Member

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    I go to South Korea all the time. I just got back two days ago.

    The Seoul residents know that these border skirmishes have been going on forever, and none of them expect it to change in the foreseeable future. Sure, for the people who are unlucky or unwise enough to be stuck on Yeonpyeong it's a terrible tragedy, but for pete's sake they live on a disputed rock a stone's throw from the North! I'm no friend of the North, but I can see that the "exercises" carried out by the South on Yeonpyeong Island were perceived as a provocation in Pyongyang.

    Folks, there is no way to win a war against the North without sacrificing untold numbers of civilians in the South. Two deaths on Yeonpyeong Island should not be allowed to trigger two million deaths in Seoul. The North is the most militarized nation on Earth, and they have the largest stockpile of chemical weapons of any nation on Earth. And guess what, the entirety of metropolitan Seoul is within range of the thousands of artillery pieces that the North has positioned just over the DMZ.

    We are talking about the second-largest metro area in the world, 24.5 million souls or nearly 50% of the population of the South, all crammed cheek-by-jowl into a strip of land that lies almost completely under the guns of the North. Yes, they're old Soviet tubes, stocked with old Soviet-style mustard-gas shells, but that's more than enough technology for the North to ravage the civilian population of Seoul.

    Would it be suicide for the North to launch a chemical attack on the South? You bet. That's the very reason why a regime-changing attack against the North is off the table: Because if the Kim family faces an existential threat, they are virtually guaranteed to bring down the whole Korean peninsula with them. Or die trying.

    The world's a messy place. I wish we could clear the table and start over, but conceptually simple solutions are sometimes the worst from a practical standpoint. Like it or not (and I don't), the policy of containment has worked for the last 65 years. We stay put, refusing to be goaded into a disproportionate response, and wait for the tinpot dictators to lose out by internal rot. The North has taken longer than most due to support from China, but the outcome is inevitable - and close, IMO.
     
  5. Bark

    Bark Oregon Member

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    Thanks, thats a great post.
     
  6. Silver Fox

    Silver Fox Puyallup, WA Well-Known Member

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    Chemist,

    I once had the privilege to sit in on a lecture and current SITREP of the SE Asian region by MG Rosenbluam(SP?) his credentials go on forever as being the areas expert.

    What you mentioned he stated along with the 17% of S. Korea's GDP is made up by the U.S. Defense spending so to pull out even if there wasn't a threat is almost impossible without shoring up the global economy. Anymore we are so tied together that if one countries finical woes effects us all.

    Stuff like this had been going on since 1953 so to hear about two deaths on that island from one of the north 'training missions' seems almost propaganda like.

    Just my two cents worth.

    SF-
     
  7. saxon

    saxon springfield Active Member

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    first news report i saw said south was doing some war games and told north they were,
    and north shot at them.

    next news report said north shot artty at nothing but civillians
    and two south military were killed.

    since north korea got all the nuke matrial from bush lets make him clean it up


    Wednesday, 3 April, 2002, 12:06 GMT 13:06 UK
    US grants N Korea nuclear funds

    BBC News | ASIA-PACIFIC | US grants N Korea nuclear funds
     
  8. saxon

    saxon springfield Active Member

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    S.Korea says it test-fired in area before N.Korea firing
    SEOUL | Tue Nov 23, 2010 6:27am EST

    SEOUL Nov 23 (Reuters) - South Korea said it was conducting regular military drills off the west coast before North Korea started firing dozens of shells, but that its firing exercises did not aim to the North.

    "We were conducting usual military drills and our test shots were aimed toward the west, not the north," a South Korean military official said.

    North Korea said on Tuesday that Seoul had initiated firing of shells, prompting it to take an instant military action. [ID:nTOE6AM05B]

    (Reporting by Ju-min Park, writing by Miyoung Kim; Editing by Yoo Choonsik)

    S.Korea says it test-fired in area before N.Korea firing | Reuters
     
  9. baalzebubba

    baalzebubba Vancouver, WA Member

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    Here's a writeup of the ship sinking incident. It's in Korean but the diagrams do paint a picture and point fingers clearly at the DPRK. Some nasty business.

    Link to writeup: [link]
     
  10. Martini_Up

    Martini_Up NW USA Well-Known Member

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    Bloody nose? How about a knock out!!!

    mushroom-cloud-hb.jpg

    mushroom-cloud-hb.jpg
     
  11. PBinWA

    PBinWA Clark County Well-Known Member

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    Does this mean they are going to keep those unused Garands? :p
     
  12. CharlesAFerg

    CharlesAFerg Beaverton Active Member

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    This whole situation is eerie. I just finished watching a really long Korean War documentary yesterday afternoon,
    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JHfYmA7PJg) - [Very good watch]
    and heard about this while I was watching, "Friends of Kim."
    (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C76HqPaA6kw) - [Good watch, but disturbing]
    I was interested in learning a bit more about North Korea. Ironic, that this happened when it did.

    The South was engaged in a training exercise, the North fired upon them. The North's excuse is that they perceived a threat. Garbage.
     
  13. sports-shooter

    sports-shooter Seattle East Side Member

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    If we are reducing our nuclear stockpile, one cheap way to do it is to "accidentally" drop them on a dictatorial country in Asia.:D

    NK is lukcy that they are not next to Israel.
     
  14. Silver Fox

    Silver Fox Puyallup, WA Well-Known Member

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    What's garbage?

    One of Americas largest suppliers of cheap imports supports a country like NK?

    American soldiers who die on the DMZ and is reported as a training accident, because if it was't training then it would be an act of war?

    The fact our cease fire is still in effect? I mean there hasn't been a declared winner or loser of the Korean War.

    Is it garbage how American Veterans of the Korean War have been over shadowed by WW II and Vietnam and sometimes almost forgotten about in the pages of history?

    What exactly is garbage?

    SF-
     
  15. elsullo

    elsullo Portland Oregon New Member

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    As Chemist pointed out, tens of millions of SOUTH Koreans are under the range of the North Koreans' conventional artillery, including poison gas shells, the largest concentration of cannon in the world. I would imagine the highly trained soldiers of the North have standing orders to fire EVERYTHING if they see a single mushroom cloud over North Korea.

    So, how many South Korean deaths are acceptible to you for your macho blustering about "knocking out" the leadership of the North?.........................elsullo :cool:

    mushroom-cloud-hb.jpg
     
  16. saxon

    saxon springfield Active Member

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    how many times does the usa give out bad nasty stuff to other
    countries just to have that country do this?
    its all smoke and mirrors.
    First USA gives out things like nerve agents and WMD to people like sadam
    We help them make the stuff then when they say they don’t want to deal with us any more
    We say what a bad person or place they are and act like they are terrorist when in fact USA made them.
    Just a few
    Marcos, Castro, edi amin, papa and baby doc,
    And lets not forget bin laden or the iran contra affair
    Were we were backing sadam while he fought Iran
    And at the same time we USA were buying arms from Iran to sell to the contras
     
  17. chemist

    chemist Beaverton OR Well-Known Member

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    Let's understand what China faced in 1950: Once the soldiers of the North launched their unprovoked invasion across the 38th parallel, it was all-or-nothing for both parties. After the lines of the North were broken by MacArthur's Incheon landing, there was nothing to stop a complete rout of the Communist forces, all the way to the Yalu River.

    China was looking at dozens of American army divisions camped out indefinitely on their Southern border. Even if they didn't perceive the American presence as an immediate threat, those divisions would have still tied up a huge number of Chinese troops on the other side of the border as a necessary counterbalance. So the Chinese came across the river and forced a truce - their version of containment.

    I'm not a big fan of "mirror-imaging" as a window into foreign policy, but let's at least entertain the thought of how we in the US would react if Mexico collapsed and was "rescued" by China, which positioned tens of thousands of "peacekeepers" along our Southern border. Heck, the Reagan administration went nuts when a few Russian Hind helicopters were discovered way down in El Salvador! (Which, it turned out, were never there at all.)
     
  18. EZLivin

    EZLivin SW of PDX Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the info. It certainly is a different world over there. Could you imagine our response if the Canadian's or Mexicans or Cubans began lobbing shells on our property?:gun09: Must really suck to have the looniest nation on the planet situated next to you.
     
  19. chemist

    chemist Beaverton OR Well-Known Member

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    The worst part is the terrible suffering that they know their friends and family members are enduring - or failing to endure - just across an imaginary barrier that is the last remnant of Cold War MAD doctrine.
     
  20. BigCat

    BigCat Portland Member

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    Yeah, boarders make me mad sometimes.