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New the forum. First post!

Question 1: Still trying to get up to speed on the legal ins/outs of NFA / Tax Stamps for SBR purchases. My question is... do you apply for an NFA / SBR "special permit" of some kind (one that is based on you as a person), and then (once you are approved) you submit paperwork & NFA fee for each SBR purchase??? Or ... does each purchase of an SBR require a unique person/firearm combo application? I started wondering about this when looking at various SBR's on a gun auction website. In fumbling around the ATF website, it looked to me as though the application called for you to name the specific firearm you were purchasing. If so, how could a person ever bid on an SBR if they had not applied for the right docs from ATF to actually be allowed to purchase it? I was hoping the answer was that you applied for a "person-based" permit of some kind, which then allowed you to purchase (basically) any SBR, and once purchased, you would just need to pay Uncle Sam his fee. If anyone can help me get this straight, I'd appreciate it!

Question 2: In general, I did not find a way on this website to search the threads of just one specific forum. I see the search box in the top-right of all screens, but is there a way to confine your search to a specific forum?

Thanks in advance for any thoughts.
 
By no means am I an expert but as to

Question 1: You apply to either form 1 or form 4 for every SBR you want to buy or make. $200 each time.
I have never done a form 4 SBR but you can bid on most NFA items and then have the selling dealer file a form 3 which allows the item to be delivered to an FFL/SOT in Washington that will then handle the Form 4 paperwork to transfer to you. It is a long wait to do so close to a year or more. You will need to find an FFL that is also an SOT to accept most FFLs are not equipped to handle these transfers so you need to find one.

My personal recommendation is to get an AR lower and do an e-filed form 1, get it engraved and when your stamp comes back approved you can put it together. Do NOT order the parts for a SBR prior to having approval. Form 1 is much faster and I got my approval back in 27 days vs close to a year if you buy a pre-built one.
 
Each application is unique to a serial number. The wait is about a year, as stated above.

Bid, win, seller transfers to a class III dealer. You will pay sales taxes on the gun and shipping, plus a transfer fee from the delivering dealer. At the end of the process you'll still have to do a 4473, pay and $18 SAR tax to Washington, go through another background check and wait a minimum of 10 business days.
 
There is no permit to own SBRs or suppressors. There are licenses you can apply for to bypass individual registrations. But that's not exactly the route most individuals take. The key word here is REGISTER, not license or whatnot. As long as you are legal to own firearms, you are legal to own SBRs and other NFA items. You must REGISTER the item with the federal government before you are allowed to take possession.

Think of each NFA item as an gun registration. You are basically applying for permission to own the item from the federal government. In simpler terms, you are legal to own it but the government needs to record that they gave you permission to do so. Also, they want to make you hate this process by taking months to record the registration.

If you apply for the correct federal licensing, you can then buy and sell and even make as you want, be it you log and file them correctly. A licensed FFL holder can chime in more on this.

As an individual, you can REGISTER a NFA item via yourself as an individual, or as a legal entity known as a trust. Either way, you must register each item every time you make or buy one. Every time, no exceptions.

As for the auction site. Unless the seller listing the item is an FFL licensed shop or individual with the proper FFLs, which is much easier and would be similar to buying a brand new SBR or suppressor from a shop or distributor, you would be buying from an individual. When buying from an individual, you still need to register the purchase with the federal government via a form 4. The seller has to register the sale to a third party dealer via a form 4 as well. That's two form 4s. Which cost $200 a piece. Then the dealer wants his cut. They will likely charge anywhere from $50 to $200 to perform the transfer and hold the item while your paperwork is pending. Think of the FFL dealer as an escrow service. Doing private party NFA transfers means $400 in taxed registrations alone. :eek:

Hope any of that makes sense!
 
Ok, so what I am getting from all that is that when you find an SBR you want to purchase...

1.) You purchase it and fill out all the right paperwork to have it sent to a Class 3 FFL/SOT, who keeps it until you have completed the ATF Class 3 application process.
2.) This process could take a long time, but the Class 3 FFL/SOT just holds onto it "in escrow" until you can present all the right paperwork - regardless of how long it takes (months to a year)
3.) The Class 3 FFL will likely add a sur-charge of some kind for the long-term storage, in addition to all the other applicable fees.
4.) Once all this is done, you have an SBR

Did I get that right? If so... man... thats an ordeal! :eek:
 
Ok, so what I am getting from all that is that when you find an SBR you want to purchase...

1.) You purchase it and fill out all the right paperwork to have it sent to a Class 3 FFL/SOT, who keeps it until you have completed the ATF Class 3 application process.
2.) This process could take a long time, but the Class 3 FFL/SOT just holds onto it "in escrow" until you can present all the right paperwork - regardless of how long it takes (months to a year)
3.) The Class 3 FFL will likely add a sur-charge of some kind for the long-term storage, in addition to all the other applicable fees.
4.) Once all this is done, you have an SBR

Did I get that right? If so... man... thats an ordeal! :eek:
Somewhat, the ATF will Mail the tax stamp paperwork back to the SOT not to you. I would make sure you find an SOT willing to accept AND help you with the paperwork it can be a bit overwhelming. If you do decide to go the form 4 route I HIGHLY recommend getting a trust.

Again this is assuming that SBR's don't get banned before you get yours. Who knows what may happen if Trump loses. I would do the form 1 route, gets you out to the range faster with essentially the same gun.
 
Buying a form 4 sbr is just like buying a normal rifle with just a few extra steps, I am not sure exactly how these work with interstate transfers, but If you are buying one that your local dealer has in stock or has to order for you. It works basically the same as a regular 16"+, you pay for said rifle and any fees the dealer charges to deal with the transfer(excluding the $200 federal tax), fill out all paperwork and submit to the federal government, once the current owner of said nfa item receives that paperwork back from the atf, they will call you, and you will complete any state level paperwork.

You will do this with every NFA item you wish to purchase.

It is best to talk to a dealer who is a sot, easiest why to find one is go to silencershop and do a dealer search. You need a FFL who also is an SOT.
 
Ok, so what I am getting from all that is that when you find an SBR you want to purchase...

1.) You purchase it and fill out all the right paperwork to have it sent to a Class 3 FFL/SOT, who keeps it until you have completed the ATF Class 3 application process.
2.) This process could take a long time, but the Class 3 FFL/SOT just holds onto it "in escrow" until you can present all the right paperwork - regardless of how long it takes (months to a year)
3.) The Class 3 FFL will likely add a sur-charge of some kind for the long-term storage, in addition to all the other applicable fees.
4.) Once all this is done, you have an SBR

Did I get that right? If so... man... thats an ordeal! :eek:
Correct. Minus the you providing paperwork thing. The ATF tends to send the approval to the FFL holding the firearm. They will call you letting you know Christmas has come. You then fill out a 4473 and leave with your new gun.

What are you looking to buy?

Form 1 SBRs are way freaking easier. Can the item you want be purchased in a pistol form?

Form 1 scenario...

Buy gun in pistol form. Walk out that day after purchasing (outside of the craziness occurring right now with 3-4 day NICS checks)

Shoot all day everyday as is and have in your possession.

Go onto ATF efiles webpage. Submit efile registration to make SBR and pay online tax. Request ATF fingerprinting cards or buy them off amazon along with a ink pad. Roll your own prints and mail them to the ATF with cover letter. Wait roughly 3-4 weeks (current wait times). Get registration approval emailed to you. Add stock. Have SBR
 

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