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... does the establishment assume responsibility for protecting everyone (and in this case it also failed to) by restricting the means for individuals to protect themselves. And if someone is hurt/killed who otherwise might have been able to prevent injury/death, could the establishment be sued?

You can sue anyone for anything, but I have severe doubts as to whether you'd win. If the police aren't obligated to respond to calls, any venue that's legally restricting your right to carry couldn't possibly be found liable for anything that happens to you because of that.

Edit: You could, of course, sue them for negligence for allow the crazy shooter onto the property in violation of their own security rules or something, but that'd probably have a slim chance of winning, too.
 
Does anyone have a sense of where the OR legislature lines up on gun issues? I've searched for an NRA-style rating of the legislators but haven't been able to find one. In other words, how worried should we all be that some/any/all of these proposals will pass? (Of course I will still be writing and calling regardless.)
 
After taking to my representative last weekend. I got the sense that they want to do something. And that is not a good sign. He push me off by saying. There are going to be amendments. Using words like " fluid" and "changing". And he's the whip. This year they are more interested in the budget. So if they see a fight. There more likely to cut and run. So show them a fight. Now
 
I sent this email to each of the Senators listed and signed with my name, address, and phone number.

Dear Senator #######,

I'm writing to request that you vote against Senate Bills 347, 699, 700 & 796.

I believe that these bills are knee-jerk reactions to the horrible crime recently committed in a Connecticut school. Think for a moment whether any or all of these bills combined would have prevented that crime from occurring.

In fact, if there had been one or more licensed concealed carry holders present in the school in Connecticut the odds are that the perpetrator would have been stopped sooner.

Criminals by definition do not abide by laws. Therefore, these Senate Bills will only serve to burden lawful gun owners.

Sincerely,
 
Bill 796 how close is the test to the requirment for police test??



{ + (10) For the purposes of subsection (1)(f) of this
section, in order to demonstrate competence with a handgun a
person must:
(a) Receive a score of at least 70 percent on a firing range
test, with a maximum of three attempts, using a National Rifle
Association B27 or similar silhouette target and consisting of
the following course of fire:
(A) 20 rounds fired from a distance of three yards, with:
(i) Five rounds fired one at a time with two seconds allowed
for each shot;
(ii) 10 rounds fired two at a time with three seconds allowed
for each two shots; and
(iii) Five rounds fired with 10 seconds allowed for all five
shots;
(B) 20 rounds fired from a distance of seven yards, with:
(i) Five rounds fired with 10 seconds allowed for all five
shots;
(ii) Five rounds fired with four seconds allowed for the first
two shots and six seconds allowed for the remaining three shots;
(iii) Five rounds fired one at a time with three seconds
allowed for each shot; and
(iv) Five rounds fired with 15 seconds allowed for all five
shots; and
(C) 10 rounds fired from a distance of 15 yards, with:
(i) Five rounds fired with six seconds allowed for the first
two shots and nine seconds allowed for the remaining three shots;
and
(ii) Five shots fired with 15 seconds allowed for all five
shots; and
(b) Provide proof of one of the following:
(A) Completion of any hunter education or hunter safety course
approved by the State Department of Fish and Wildlife or a

similar agency of another state if handgun safety was a component
of the course;
(B) Completion of any National Rifle Association firearms
safety or training course if handgun safety was a component of
the course;
(C) Completion of any firearms safety or training course or
class available to the general public offered by law enforcement,
community college, or private or public institution or
organization or firearms training school utilizing instructors
certified by the National Rifle Association or a law enforcement
agency if handgun safety was a component of the course;
(D) Completion of any law enforcement firearms safety or
training course or class offered for security guards,
investigators, reserve law enforcement officers or any other law
enforcement officers if handgun safety was a component of the
course;
(E) Equivalent experience with a handgun through participation
in organized shooting competition or military service;
(F) That the person is licensed or has been licensed to carry a
firearm in this state, unless the license has been revoked; or
(G) Completion of any firearms training or safety course or
class conducted by a firearms instructor certified by a law
enforcement agency or the National Rifle Association if handgun
safety was a component of the course. + }
SECTION 2. ORS 166.291, as amended by section 10, chapter 826,
Oregon Laws 2009, and section 34, chapter 547, Oregon Laws 2011,
is amended to read:
166.291. (1) The sheriff of a county, upon a person's
application for an Oregon concealed handgun license, upon receipt
of the appropriate fees and after compliance with the procedures
set out in this section, shall issue the person a concealed
handgun license if the person:
(a)(A) Is a citizen of the United States; or
(B) Is a legal resident alien who can document continuous
residency in the county for at least six months and has
{ - declared in writing - } { + submitted a written
application for citizenship + } to the United States Citizenship
and Immigration Services { - the intent to acquire citizenship
status - } and can present proof { - of the written
declaration - } to the sheriff at the time of application for
the license { + that the application for citizenship has been
received by the United States Citizenship and Immigration
Services and the application fee, if applicable, has been
paid + };
(b) Is at least 21 years of age;
(c) Is a resident of the county;
(d) Has no outstanding warrants for arrest;
(e) Is not free on any form of pretrial release;
(f) Demonstrates competence with a handgun { - by any one of
the following: - } { + as described in subsection (10) of this
section; + }
{ - (A) Completion of any hunter education or hunter safety
course approved by the State Department of Fish and Wildlife or a
similar agency of another state if handgun safety was a component
of the course; - }
{ - (B) Completion of any National Rifle Association firearms
safety or training course if handgun safety was a component of
the course; - }
{ - (C) Completion of any firearms safety or training course
or class available to the general public offered by law
enforcement, community college, or private or public institution
or organization or firearms training school utilizing instructors
certified by the National Rifle Association or a law enforcement
agency if handgun safety was a component of the course; - }
{ - (D) Completion of any law enforcement firearms safety or
training course or class offered for security guards,
investigators, reserve law enforcement officers or any other law
enforcement officers if handgun safety was a component of the
course; - }
{ - (E) Presents evidence of equivalent experience with a
handgun through participation in organized shooting competition
or military service; - }
{ - (F) Is licensed or has been licensed to carry a firearm
in this state, unless the license has been revoked; or - }
{ - (G) Completion of any firearms training or safety course
or class conducted by a firearms instructor certified by a law
enforcement agency or the National Rifle Association if handgun
safety was a component of the course; - }
(g) Has never been convicted of a felony or found guilty,
except for insanity under ORS 161.295, of a felony;
(h) Has not been convicted of a misdemeanor or found guilty,
except for insanity under ORS 161.295, of a misdemeanor within
the four years prior to the application;
(i) Has not been committed to the Oregon Health Authority under
ORS 426.130;
(j) Has not been found to be mentally ill and is not subject to
an order under ORS 426.130 that the person be prohibited from
purchasing or possessing a firearm as a result of that mental
illness;
(k) Has been discharged from the jurisdiction of the juvenile
court for more than four years if, while a minor, the person was
found to be within the jurisdiction of the juvenile court for
having committed an act that, if committed by an adult, would
constitute a felony or a misdemeanor involving violence, as
defined in ORS 166.470;
(L) Has not been convicted of an offense involving controlled
substances or participated in a court-supervised drug diversion
program, except this disability does not operate to exclude a
person if:
(A) The person has been convicted only once of violating ORS
475.864 (3) and has not completed a court-supervised drug
diversion program under ORS 135.907; or
(B) The person has completed a court-supervised drug diversion
program under ORS 135.907 and has not been convicted of violating
ORS 475.864 (3);
(m) Is not subject to a citation issued under ORS 163.735 or an
order issued under ORS 30.866, 107.700 to 107.735 or 163.738;
(n) Has not received a dishonorable discharge from the Armed
Forces of the United States; and
(o) Is not required to register as a sex offender in any state.

IT GOES ON AND ON! THIS IS JUST A PORTION OF IT, WE MUST STOP THIS.
 
Bill Text: OR SB796 | 2013 | Regular Session | Introduced | LegiScan Here's the link to the stinking piece of feces. All the other ones can be easily seen there too.
BTW I'm having trouble deciphering 796.
Is a live fire test going to be required or just one of a few options? I tried to read it a couple of times. If it's required isn't it discrimination against disabled or elderly? They might not score as well as a healthy young person.
 
You can sue anyone for anything, but I have severe doubts as to whether you'd win. If the police aren't obligated to respond to calls, any venue that's legally restricting your right to carry couldn't possibly be found liable for anything that happens to you because of that.

Edit: You could, of course, sue them for negligence for allow the crazy shooter onto the property in violation of their own security rules or something, but that'd probably have a slim chance of winning, too.

I think one avenue would be their parental negligence for letting the shooting happen on campus. Schools have claimed "in loco parentis" for a variety of issues dealing with students when they're on campus. Likely they'll just claim soverign immunity though.
 
Bill 796

IT GOES ON AND ON! THIS IS JUST A PORTION OF IT, WE MUST STOP THIS.

I know, what if someone just wants a CHL as a "good guy" card to buy from or trade with other good guys in Oregon? Or since Oregon's laws for transporting a firearm are screwy and confusing, your car is and is not a public place, get a CHL to act as a keep out of jail free card if you get pulled over by a Barnie Fife who does not know the law either.
 
Does anyone have a sense of where the OR legislature lines up on gun issues? I've searched for an NRA-style rating of the legislators but haven't been able to find one. In other words, how worried should we all be that some/any/all of these proposals will pass? (Of course I will still be writing and calling regardless.)

See NRA grades of Oregon Legislature members at <broken link removed>

Here are the NRA's grades for Oregon Senate Judiciary Committee members:

Floyd Prozanski (D), Chair, Grade: F
Betsy L. Close (R), Vice-chair, Grade: A+
Jackie Dingfelder (D), Grade: F
Jeff Kruse (R), Grade: A+
Arnie Roblan (D), Grade: A

What the grades mean:
A+ : A legislator with not only an excellent voting record on all critical NRA issues, but who has also made a vigorous effort to promote and defend the Second Amendment.

A : Solidly pro-gun candidate. A candidate who has supported NRA positions on key votes in elective office or a candidate with a demonstrated record of support on Second Amendment issues.

F : True enemy of gun owners' rights. A consistent anti-gun candidate who always opposes gun owners' rights and/or actively leads anti-gun legislative efforts, or sponsors anti-gun legislation.

Guess what grade the NRA gave to Ginny Burdick.

eq5gmq.jpg
 
I'm getting so f#cking tired of "contact him", "email her", and "sign this petition"... when can I just enjoy shooting again?

"The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt."


Some smart guy said that a long time ago and it's more true than ever! WRITE, CALL, SHOW UP, CONVINCE OTHERS, IT'S UP TO US!
 
I sent the same letter as in post 1, and added the Judiciary committee members to the e-mail
So far, responses from:
Senator Roblan: "will take your concerns under serious consideration"
Senator Jeff Kruse "I will without question defend the 2nd Amendment and vote against these bills"
Senator Chuck Thomsen "believes that infringing on the rights of legal gun owners is not the best way to prevent future violent acts in our nation.
Believes instead that increased support for mental health care and rehabilitation is a more pressing and effective way of solving violent crime."
Representative Shemia Fagan
"I assure you that as a gun owner and an attorney, I will uphold the 2nd amendment. I've reached out to the Chair of the Judiciary Committee where those bills would be referred and he is almost certain that those bills do not have the votes to get out of the Senate. The tragedies that struck last year at Clackamas Town Center and Newtown require a thoughtful solution that will solve the real problem, firearms in the hands of dangerous and mentally ill people. Neither tragedy would have occurred if responsible gun owners had kept their guns in gun safes. But I know firsthand that gun safes are expensive! That is why I gathered Republican and Democratic cosponsors for a bill to provide a tax credit for the purchase of a gun safe so that responsible gun owners can lock up our guns and keep them from being stolen by people who intend to do harm. I filed the bill last week. The bill number is HB 3261 (you can follow it online here HB 3261 :: Oregon Legislature Bill Tracker - Your Government - The Oregonian). I encourage you to inform your friends and neighbors to check out HB3261 and encourage their legislators to support it. Thanks for keeping me informed, Shemia Fagan, House District 51

As the Clackamas Mall shooter stole the rifle, Representative Fagan's HB3261 is a positive, thoughtful response to the theft preceeding the shooting.

Bought my safe in 1982, 24 cubes, quarter inch steel all around, four locking lugs, combination dial, 750 lbs empty.
 
See NRA grades of Oregon Legislature members at <broken link removed>

Here are the NRA's grades for Oregon Senate Judiciary Committee members:

Floyd Prozanski (D), Chair, Grade: F
Betsy L. Close (R), Vice-chair, Grade: A+
Jackie Dingfelder (D), Grade: F
Jeff Kruse (R), Grade: A+
Arnie Roblan (D), Grade: A

Thanks BSG 75.

I used the nra-pvf link and www.leg.state.or.us to put together a summary of their ratings for all the Oregon legiscritters so I could answer my own question about where things stand.

For the OR State Senate:
30 Members; 15 D, 15 R
Rated A: 16
Rated B or C: 2
Rated D or F: 10
Unrated/Unknown: 2 (no previous record; declined to answer questionnaire)

For the OR State House:
60 Members; 34 D, 26 R
Rated A: 30
Rated B or C: 6
Rated D or F: 17
Unrated/Unknown: 7 (no previous record; declined to answer questionnaire)

The upshot: if you assume only A-rated members are going to vote in our favor, both houses are split about 50-50 pro/anti. So, KEEP CONTACTING YOUR REPS.
 
Didn't work in NY, CO, or CT. I'm feeling slowly beaten down. I work and support a family unlike the "anti-gun", "anti-everything conservative" sh!ts that live to enslave me. They have time for this and some are even paid to trample on the 2nd Ammendment.

"The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt."


Some smart guy said that a long time ago and it's more true than ever! WRITE, CALL, SHOW UP, CONVINCE OTHERS, IT'S UP TO US!
 

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