New Bullpup - Springfield Hellion

[titsonritz]

I thinks me wants one! Has some pretty slick features I would prefer, especially against the Tavor, and others! The sights are a simple swap, and it looks like there might be a little bit of aftermarket support for these!


If they do offer these here, they had better price them well under the Tavor, near a halfway decent AR, or it won't sell well and they better push the aftermarket accessories too!

I've got to admit it is one of the only bullpups to peak my interest, but at that price tag I doubt I'll get one. It would need to drop a minimum of 5 bills for me to consider.

 

[Ura-Ki]

I've got to admit it is one of the only bullpups to peak my interest, but at that price tag I doubt I'll get one. It would need to drop a minimum of 5 bills for me to consider.

Yup, I do appreciate many of it's features, it's overall design, and it's egros and such, but not at that price point! I really wanted to like the Tavor, but there is too much I don't like about it, including it's price too!

 

[slimmer13]

How do I know where to grip it?

 

[Kruel J]

How do I know where to grip it?

I just laughed out loud!

 

[Art_Vandelay]

For new folks - This is the imported Croatian military rifle; not some Springfield bullpup clone. $1999 street price makes this hopefully around $1700-1800 street price, which puts it in the "normal" range for AUGs, Tavors, etc.

 

[clanhanson]

This just might be the bullpup that replaces my AUG as my SHTF rifle. Time (and price) will tell. I will say that the disassembly video posted by Ian made me irrationally happy.

 

[Flopsweat]

After the videos I'm less impressed. I don't really see it as ergonomic. Changing mags is slow and awkward. Same for operating the charging handle and bolt release. Most of the controls require more precise manipulation and more focus than an AR or AK.

 

[3MTA3]

After the videos I'm less impressed. I don't really see it as ergonomic. Changing mags is slow and awkward. Same for operating the charging handle and bolt release. Most of the controls require more precise manipulation and more focus than an AR or AK.

I have to agree, though don't want to discourage others. Personally in a 5.56 bullpup I'd be more intrigued by the RDB. I've watched a few reviews by people who don't tend to pull any punches, and the RDB is reliable, accurate, and for a bullpup pretty ergonomic. It's also in a justifiable price range. I'm still an AR guy for a lot of other reasons.

 

[clanhanson]

I have to agree, though don't want to discourage others. Personally in a 5.56 bullpup I'd be more intrigued by the RDB. I've watched a few reviews by people who don't tend to pull any punches, and the RDB is reliable, accurate, and for a bullpup pretty ergonomic. It's also in a justifiable price range. I'm still an AR guy for a lot of other reasons.

It also doesn't have any military background. The VHS is battle proven and requires almost zero maintenance, much like my AUG (much less battle time than the AUG though). KelTec makes unique firearms that often have quirks that make them unreliable. Military rifles like the VHS/Hellion always have quirks but their reliability is more often than not higher than an AR platform and simple to operate quickly with training.

As more people see the many drawbacks of a pistol AR, we will continue to see increased interest in bullpups. In my opinion, they're better than standard format carbines and if the Hellion proves as reliable as their nearly identical VHS brother, they'll dominate the market.

 

[3MTA3]

It also doesn't have any military background. The VHS is battle proven and requires almost zero maintenance, much like my AUG (much less battle time than the AUG though). KelTec makes unique firearms that often have quirks that make them unreliable. Military rifles like the VHS/Hellion always have quirks but their reliability is more often than not higher than an AR platform and simple to operate quickly with training.

As more people see the many drawbacks of a pistol AR, we will continue to see increased interest in bullpups. In my opinion, they're better than standard format carbines and if the Hellion proves as reliable as their nearly identical VHS brother, they'll dominate the market.

Believe what you will, but I'd likely take the RDB over eother the VHS or the AUG. Kel-Tecs are like Adam Sandler movies, it's either great or it sucks with nothing in between. Frankly I was unimpressed by the AUG when I first looked at them thirty years ago, battle proven or not. I'd take an AR over any of them just for maintenance ease if nothing else.

 

[The Heretic]

 

[The Heretic]

 

[clanhanson]

Believe what you will, but I'd likely take the RDB over eother the VHS or the AUG. Kel-Tecs are like Adam Sandler movies, it's either great or it sucks with nothing in between. Frankly I was unimpressed by the AUG when I first looked at them thirty years ago, battle proven or not. I'd take an AR over any of them just for maintenance ease if nothing else.

Regarding maintenance ease, it's pretty easy to clean locking lugs when a barrel comes off in three seconds. An AR might be easy to clean, but since they blow all the nastiness right into the receiver they require more frequent cleaning. I've cleaned my aug once and lubed it once. It's one if the things I prefer about short stroke piston guns in general.

Also, I don't have to believe anything when I can quickly access and read about the various issues plaguing KelTec bullpups, issues that affect many of their firearms. They're crazy Floridians that make cool stuff, but they need somebody there to make their stuff actually reliable, durable, and easy to maintain.

 

[Ura-Ki]

Of the many downsides to the AUG is lack of modularity, there ain't much you can change or reconfigure or customize to fit your mission needs. It's one of the reasons this platform didn't do well in any military services!

 

[clanhanson]

Of the many downsides to the AUG is lack of modularity, there ain't much you can change or reconfigure or customize to fit your mission needs. It's one of the reasons this platform didn't do well in any military services!

The aug is in service in over 30 countries. It is in the top five most common military rifles seen on the battlefield. Not bad for a 1977 space gat with limited modularity.

 

[3MTA3]

Regarding maintenance ease, it's pretty easy to clean locking lugs when a barrel comes off in three seconds. An AR might be easy to clean, but since they blow all the nastiness right into the receiver they require more frequent cleaning. I've cleaned my aug once and lubed it once. It's one if the things I prefer about short stroke piston guns in general.

Also, I don't have to believe anything when I can quickly access and read about the various issues plaguing KelTec bullpups, issues that affect many of their firearms. They're crazy Floridians that make cool stuff, but they need somebody there to make their stuff actually reliable, durable, and easy to maintain.

Sorry I didn't mean to make you defensive. What I didn't like about the AUG was weight, really bad and maybe the worst trigger pull (perhaps this has been fixed) and gimmicky charging handle. To me nothing about the rifle felt good or natural, but that's me. You obviously are quite happy with the rifle as a total package, and that's just fine. It just never felt right to me and that's something you can't get from a web page. I might have the same reaction to the RDB or other rifle, but I need to hold it in my hands and tear it down and back up again to really know. A good fit is a personal thing that will vary from person to person.

Even with that criticism the AUG is still a very fine rifle, just not my cup of tea.

BTW most of my AR's are short stroke piston guns and agree that it keeps them cleaner, but my DI guns don't suffer badly at all. I prefer the AR platform because I can quickly and easily replace any part with mostly basic tools. It's ergos are outstanding during any usage, it's balance is perfect. and the trigger can be absolutely top notch.

My apologies to the OP for the thread drift.

 

[clanhanson]

Sorry I didn't mean to make you defensive. What I didn't like about the AUG was weight, really bad and maybe the worst trigger pull (perhaps this has been fixed) and gimmicky charging handle. To me nothing about the rifle felt good or natural, but that's me. You obviously are quite happy with the rifle as a total package, and that's just fine. It just never felt right to me and that's something you can't get from a web page. I might have the same reaction to the RDB or other rifle, but I need to hold it in my hands and tear it down and back up again to really know. A good fit is a personal thing that will vary from person to person.

Even with that criticism the AUG is still a very fine rifle, just not my cup of tea.

BTW most of my AR's are short stroke piston guns and agree that it keeps them cleaner, but my DI guns don't suffer badly at all. I prefer the AR platform because I can quickly and easily replace any part with mostly basic tools. It's ergos are outstanding during any usage, it's balance is perfect. and the trigger can be absolutely top notch.

My apologies to the OP for the thread drift.

I didn't intend to sound defensive, and yes I also apologize for veering the thread off track. I'm an unapologetic bullpup fanatic that loves the weight distribution and compactness without stamp, we will see how the Hellion fares.

 

[Certaindeaf]

The cool thing about the adjustable stock is when you mortar it you just know your ball skin will get pinched in it.

 

[clanhanson]

The cool thing about the adjustable stock is when you mortar it you just know your ball skin will get pinched in it.

Either you mortar strangely or you have some longggg sacks my friend

 

[spookshack]

Certaindeaf is not your "average" baller. More on the "big" baller side, but I digress….