Most powerful and penetrating 12 ga slug ammo?

[The Heretic]

Pretty cool. Like they said if they fix the defects it will crazy effective. Only for rifled barrels though. At least I know how to pronounce Brenenke lol.

Here is the Black Magic. Take a look at the gelatin test. It doesn't expand but a devastating wound channel. That part on the back is only hard plastic but didn't fail like the crush.

So far these are ones in a smooth bore for Grizz defense.

I am thinking I want to get the barrel on my Shockwave fitted with a Carlson rifled bore choke. I have to ask @Velzey if he can do this - looking at the Carlson site it isn't clear whether their chokes will fit well with on a 590 barrel. I am not sure which of their chokes can be used to fit a 590 barrel. I would like to get an 18.5" barrel for the Shockwave too.

 

[Ridge Walker]

I am thinking I want to get the barrel on my Shockwave fitted with a Carlson rifled bore choke. I have to ask @Velzey if he can do this - looking at the Carlson site it isn't clear whether their chokes will fit well with on a 590 barrel. I am not sure which of their chokes can be used to fit a 590 barrel. I would like to get an 18.5" barrel for the Shockwave too.

The Maverick uses 500 barrels Mike have to see what is out there too.

Forgot to paste the vid for the Black Magic. Here it is.

 

[The Heretic]

The Maverick uses 590 barrels Mike have to see what is out there too.

Forgot to paste the vid for the Black Magic. Here it is.

I was under the impression that the Maverick 88 is basically a 500, not a 590. The 590 has a thicker heavier barrel and will not accept a 500 barrel, and vice versa - at the very least, how the mag tube is cinched down against the barrel band is different.

 

[Ridge Walker]

I was under the impression that the Maverick 88 is basically a 500, not a 590. The 590 has a thicker heavier barrel and will not accept a 500 barrel, and vice versa - at the very least, how the mag tube is cinched down against the barrel band is different.

You're correct they use the 500's. Didn't catch it. Fat fingered it again just now correcting it lol.

Between Fat Fingers spell check and me skipping words sometimes my posts are unreadable. Especially when I am trying to squeeze one out at a red light.

 

[gmerkt]

how many people around the world have used their products in the field.

Just pointing out that they are not being made in "somebody's garage/basement" as you opined. The company is ISO certified. The products are CIP certified. These are not standards that typical garage/basement operators meet. The reason reputable firms go to the trouble of certification is to establish trust and reputation. It's there if you want to embrace it.

Agreed, D Dupleks is not Winchester. D Duplecks might be better. But to be completely honest, I haven't encountered a grizzly bear to try one out on.

Major manufacturers can get set in their ways. They get big and bloated and complacent. And don't want to get into niche markets that absorb R&D resources when they can keep churning out the same old stuff that they have successfully made for years. And can enjoy maximum economies of scale because the process and equipment was paid off long ago. That's why they keep making lead Foster slugs which are clearly not the latest or best technology in shotgun slug ammo. Innovations often have to come from smaller companies. That may or may not turn into something bigger over time. Like AR platform rifles, for example.

 

[The Heretic]

Agreed, D Dupleks is not Winchester. D Duplecks might be better. But to be completely honest, I haven't encountered a grizzly bear to try one out on.

Let me know when you or someone else has and what the results are.

 

[Ridge Walker]

...Major manufacturers can get set in their ways. They get big and bloated and complacent....That's why they keep making lead Foster slugs which are clearly not the latest or best technology in shotgun slug ammo...

For the record:

'The first effective modern shotgun slug was introduced by Wilhelm Brenneke in 1898.' It 'set the standard for all shotgun projectiles that followed. Indeed, virtually every slug on the market today is derived from Brenneke's designs.' 'The Classic Magnum is the original 1898 design by Wilhelm Brenneke. These cartridges are made in 12 gauge 2¾" with a 492 grain projectile and 16 gauge 2¾" with a 437 grain projectile. The Classic Magnum Brenneke slug was inspired by the shuttlecock, heavy at the front with a light tail to stabilize it, and the design has proven hard to beat ever since 1898.'

'A 'Foster slug, invented by Karl M. Foster in 1931, and patented in 1947 (U.S. Patent 2,414,863) is a type of shotgun slug designed to be fired through a smoothbore shotgun barrel.' '...It has a deep hollow in the rear of the slug, like that in the back of an airgun pellet. They also have ribbing down the sides to give the slug a slight rotation and improving precision.'

The original Bernanke Slug is not a Foster. The Modern Bernenke is as, or even more accurate than the Foster. The foster types require a clean barrel and they will lead your barrel, Brenneke's reportedly 'seem to clean the barrel as they are shot.' 'The main difference between this slug and the Foster is the wad attached to the end. Brenenke design feature helps increase the flight stabilization of the slug once it leaves the barrel.'

The original Foster Slug is not a Sabot.

'A Sabot slug is an improved rifled slug. They offer more accuracy for a slug in a shotgun barrel, and have a correspondingly improved range. The slug itself is smaller than the shotgun bore and encased in wad which has a greater effect with a rifled shotgun barrel. The slug spins more like a rifle bullet.'

So since Sabots are out for if you want to get accuracy out of a 'clean' smooth bore you are stuck with the 'Brenenke' type.

Yes Black Magic is based on a 123 year old design, but it is sort of a melding of the Foster and the Bernanke with a modern upgrade. They have the improvement some were/are looking for. Since I have witnessed what they do in Gelatin and Cross Grain Pine with out expanding or failing, for my stated purpose of a charging Grizz the Black Magic is what I am looking for.

Like Heretic I'm open to them. But with a Grizzly I already know that the Bernanke Type in the Modern Design of the Black Magic is a proven dangerous game stopper.